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Just curious to know how many folks on here are just here because they like the CD ROM classics and not so much the HuCard titles. Why are you here? Let us know!

I am in it for both the Hu-Cards and the CD games.  Not ALL of them, but the ones I will actually play.  Now, I may just get the entire TG-16 collection just for the sake of collecting.  For the PC Engine side, I will only get the ones I pick and choose.

I'm in it for fun games, format be damned.  That said, developers favored discs more and more as time passed, so many of the best games are on CDs.

I used to be, but then I realized how much I was missing. At least half of the best games are HuCards. This isn't so much because of the difference in format but more because the system trended to heavily to RPGs and sims in the later years as CD became dominant. I like RPGs and sims, but I also like platformers, shooters, etc.

I split my time playing hucards and cds 50/50.  I like hucards because they play like spiffed-up 8-bit games, while the CD's satisfy my 16-bit cravings.  Without junk like Falcon, Andre Panza, and random sports titles, the CD library is slightly stronger overall.  On the other hand, I find hucards easier to pick up and play.  I can play them on my TE and I have a dedicated TG16 w/TB+ so I never have to hassle swapping out Tennokoe Bank slots.

CD-ROM games tend to be more technically advanced and have more content aesthetically and in general, but if you appreciate good games, you can't ignore the HuCards. There's gotta be like 100 fun HuCard games that aren't mahjong, pachinko, digital comic, text heavy war sims, etc... which stereotypical "westerners" should enjoy.

When you are without HuCard, you are without chiptunes (mostly).  Why would you do that to yourself?

CD was a big draw early on, but I enjoy the purchase of a loose Hu a lot nowdays. I got or had all the CDs I ever wanted, and cards are just too cool a format!

Quote from: BlackandBlue on 07/15/2011, 01:57 PMWhen you are without HuCard, you are without chiptunes (mostly).  Why would you do that to yourself?

I think that there are more chiptunes in CD games than HuCards. Many CD games have more chip tunes than the average HuCard.

I started out being mainly interested in CD games (especially SCD) But I've grown to love the Huey's just as much!

I mean really, what other console has games that can span from 8-bit Nintendo all the way to NEO GEO?!

I was a bit of a CD-only snob when I first started out [with a preference for SCDs].  (Sound was a big thing for me and I didn't like the sound of TG's chip-tunes.  I generally like chip tunes but there was something about the TG's "twang" that didn't work for me).

Then I started to look into more and more Hueys to pad the time between CD releases. ;)

Shockman, Blazing Lazers and Soldier Blade turned me around.  However, it still doesn't mean that I appreciate all chip-tunes, for the most part the music in Bonk still grates my nerves...  Bonk 3 CD softened the blow, but they still kept that annoying out-of-tune end of level chime as chip-tunes.

I have an even mix.  Since I don't care about cutscenes and I like to hear chip tunes push the hardware, I think I generally prefer HuCard games.  Plus, there just aren't any platformers as good as Legendary Axe and Ninja Spirit for the CD.  ;)

Quote from: td741 on 07/15/2011, 04:10 PMShockman, Blazing Lazers and Soldier Blade turned .....

Finally another guys that appreciates Shockman!!
Shockman, Order of the Griffon, and Air Zonk totally made me fall in love with Hueys!

Quote from: sheath on 07/15/2011, 04:57 PMPlus, there just aren't any platformers as good as Legendary Axe and Ninja Spirit for the CD.  ;)

I take it you haven't played Dracula X or Schbibin Man 3?

I haven't played Schbibin Man 3, I own Rondo of Blood I just wasn't thinking when I chose the word "any".

I love all formats of the PCE/Turbo and some of my favorite games are Hueys (SF2, Air Zonk, Bonk's Revenge, Legendary Axe, Blazing lazers, Splatterhouse...etc). That said I love SCDs for the inclusion of awesome soundtracks and anime cinemas that can make an already great game fantastic. I remember once I got my Turbo Duo many years back one of the first games I made sure to get was Rondo of Blood. It's hard not to get spoiled after that I guess.

To limit yourself to certain games based on the medium seems silly. I play great games, it rarely enters into my mind whether I'm picking up a cart or CD.

I don't discriminate...there are plenty of great games on both CD and Hucard formats. 

However, I do like the physical appearance, the unique shape and the presentation of the Hucard over the CD.   In other words, Hucards look pretty damn cool. 8)

I like both equally.  There is no Shadow of the Beast hucard

and no Final Solder for CD.

Quote from: guest on 07/16/2011, 01:55 AMI like both equally.  There is no Shadow of the Beast hucard

and no Final Solder for CD.

I agree with Arkhan, but with a more positive outlook:

There is Image Fight for HuCard, and there is Image Fight for CD.

Well, I am here for both, but I actually think (in this latter era) the HuCards are cooler.  Optical media are everywhere nowadays but the cards are still unique & neat-looking.

Lol, who wants to refrain from some ubergood huey action? I don't think that there is just one sane person who wants to. And it just would be retarded too.

Honestly, I hardly have a huge collection, but I've generally been preferring the HuCard games.  There are certainly great games on CD like Gate of Thunder and Rondo, and to a lesser extent the Ys games, but I've been finding that a lot of the supposedly classic CD games seemed to mostly rely on the novelty of having cinemas, CD music, and the like more than gameplay.  Valis 2 and 3 were pretty much just bland Castlevania knockoffs.  Exile was a bit better, but the boss battles suck, and the gameplay isn't all that tight.  And while I quite enjoyed Shubibinman 3, it's only a half hour long and can easily be beaten the first time.  It felt more like the demo of a great game than a complete game, and I wished they used the time, money, and space to do more levels rather than cinemas.

some of the times i find the CD music in a game to be distracting/irritating.

Fausette Amour for example.  That music is kinda lame.  Its too jazzy. Id rather have heard some pounding chiptune rock.

I'm a fan of both.  I love the portability of the HuCards and the extra graphical and audio touches to the (S)CDs. 

Before this thread I hadn't even thought of being a fan of one over the other.  I owned a vanilla TG-16 until the CD add-on was released, then I bought that ASAP.  So I've been a fan of both mediums pretty much forever and never really distinguished between the two.  It's all Turbo-goodness to me. :)

Quote from: guest on 07/16/2011, 09:30 PMFausette Amour for example.  That music is kinda lame.  Its too jazzy. Id rather have heard some pounding chiptune rock.

That's strange, I uberlove the BGM of Fausette Amour, just because it is so unique and has kinda a dark touch. The intro music gives me the goosebumps when ever I lissen to it.

I only play huey because there's so many great games ..... and because I can't afford a CD.

Interesting, I have generally played and collected HuCards rather than games on the PCE CD format; well until recently (Past year of so)

Probably the reason is that I had used to play and collect Hu in the day, as I could not afford a CD unit.

I kinda still wonder why a number of Hucards weren't re-released later on SuperCD or ACD, "Best Collection"-style...

Quote from: guest on 07/17/2011, 10:06 AMI kinda still wonder why a number of Hucards weren't re-released later on SuperCD or ACD, "Best Collection"-style...

Human Sports Festival :)

If you didn't include Dracula X & Winds of Thunder I would say I prefer HuCards over CDs.

Lol, and what does gate of thunder? :)

In recent years I've started hearing people say that they can't bring themselves to play 8-bit games - stuff like youtube reviewers saying "who even plays this crap anymore!"

Is this a trend?  Is the title of this thread a reflection of that mentality?  Hucards have a little more of an 8-bit vibe than CDs.

i have always played the hu cards.
only recently got cd hardware, so most of my games are card.

Air Zonk > Super Air Zonk

Must play both!

Quote from: guest on 07/17/2011, 01:50 PMIn recent years I've started hearing people say that they can't bring themselves to play 8-bit games - stuff like youtube reviewers saying "who even plays this crap anymore!"

Is this a trend?  Is the title of this thread a reflection of that mentality?  Hucards have a little more of an 8-bit vibe than CDs.

It could simply be due to a new generation of retrogamers coming onto the scene.  People tend to focus on the sorts of games that they grew up with, so the retro scene is moving away from NES era stuff just like it moved away from Atari 2600 era stuff over this last decade.

Unless you mean that it's the exact same guys who used to obsess over 8-bit stuff all of the sudden hating it.  Then I don't know what the fuck.

Quote from: Tatsujin on 07/17/2011, 11:36 AM

Quote from: guest on 07/17/2011, 10:06 AMI kinda still wonder why a number of Hucards weren't re-released later on SuperCD or ACD, "Best Collection"-style...

Human Sports Festival :)

Maybe they should have updated it to Robot Sports Festival, or Dinosaur Sports Festival.

There are so many good HuCard games that get overlooked.  I have always been in it for both.  One reason is I started with HuCards on my TG-16 before the CD addon was even out.  So, I already thought the HuCard games were awesome.  Even after buying the CD addon I still would always come back to the HuCard games.

Quote from: Gao on 07/17/2011, 05:18 PM

Quote from: guest on 07/17/2011, 01:50 PMIn recent years I've started hearing people say that they can't bring themselves to play 8-bit games - stuff like youtube reviewers saying "who even plays this crap anymore!"

Is this a trend?  Is the title of this thread a reflection of that mentality?  Hucards have a little more of an 8-bit vibe than CDs.

It could simply be due to a new generation of retrogamers coming onto the scene.  People tend to focus on the sorts of games that they grew up with, so the retro scene is moving away from NES era stuff just like it moved away from Atari 2600 era stuff over this last decade.

Unless you mean that it's the exact same guys who used to obsess over 8-bit stuff all of the sudden hating it.  Then I don't know what the fuck.

Maybe I'm just an Isolated incident but I'm 15 and My two favorite consoles are the Sega Master System  and the Turbo. I don't think the NES, SMS, or Turbo will be abandoned like the 2600 because we have things like the Wii Virtual Console and Xbox Live arcade to spark younger gamers interest in Classic games. Another thing NES era consoles have going for them is an abundance of good games. Once you play Space invaders, Adventure, and Pitfall does the 2600 have too many games worth playing?

Quote from: Lilgrafx on 07/18/2011, 03:25 PM

Quote from: Gao on 07/17/2011, 05:18 PM

Quote from: guest on 07/17/2011, 01:50 PMIn recent years I've started hearing people say that they can't bring themselves to play 8-bit games - stuff like youtube reviewers saying "who even plays this crap anymore!"

Is this a trend?  Is the title of this thread a reflection of that mentality?  Hucards have a little more of an 8-bit vibe than CDs.

It could simply be due to a new generation of retrogamers coming onto the scene.  People tend to focus on the sorts of games that they grew up with, so the retro scene is moving away from NES era stuff just like it moved away from Atari 2600 era stuff over this last decade.

Unless you mean that it's the exact same guys who used to obsess over 8-bit stuff all of the sudden hating it.  Then I don't know what the fuck.

Maybe I'm just an Isolated incident but I'm 15 and My two favorite consoles are the Sega Master System  and the Turbo. I don't think the NES, SMS, or Turbo will be abandoned like the 2600 because we have things like the Wii Virtual Console and Xbox Live arcade to spark younger gamers interest in Classic games. Another thing NES era consoles have going for them is an abundance of good games. Once you play Space invaders, Adventure, and Pitfall does the 2600 have too many games worth playing? 

Good point about Virtual Console.  That probably will keep the NES and the like from fading as much.  However, a shift is definitely happening.  10 years ago, you really didn't see that many collectors of things like the SNES, but now it's become one of the most popular systems to collect for, and we're already seeing more and more N64 collectors out there.  The most popular areas in retrogaming will probably always be whatever the current 20-30 year olds grew up with, since they are the ones who now have the disposable income to acquire all the games they want, often don't have their time sucked up by children yet, and haven't yet gotten all the games they want for the consoled they're interested in.

As for the 2600, while the majority of the library is indeed crap (like most dominant consoles), there are in fact plenty of great games, as long as you don't mind the sorts of things they made in that era.  Off the top of my head, there's Combat,  Ms. Pac-Man, Jr. Pac-Man, Asteroids, Solaris (which is worth trying just to see what they managed to pull off with the hardware), River Raid, Stargate, Cosmic Ark, Yar's Revenge, and Pitfall 2.  There's a reason why it was the dominant console for so long.

i still havent picked up a CD player so right now I am in it for the HU's. Its good to have an narrow focus in the beginings of my collection I think. I am waiting on an extension to be built to my house and then I should have room to fit in a little TG space so I can have it all there and sit and play them.

Quote from: Lilgrafx on 07/18/2011, 03:25 PMMaybe I'm just an Isolated incident but I'm 15 and My two favorite consoles are the Sega Master System  and the Turbo.

Hearing that makes me really happy!  When I was 15 all my favourite movies were black & white; my friends all thought I was nuts, but I think there is something to be said for appreciating the classics.  I'm glad I wasn't the only teen who could see the value in older media like that.  ^__^

Quote from: Gao on 07/18/2011, 04:31 PMThe most popular areas in retrogaming will probably always be whatever the current 20-30 year olds grew up with, since they are the ones who now have the disposable income to acquire all the games they want, often don't have their time sucked up by children yet, and haven't yet gotten all the games they want for the consoled they're interested in.

As for the 2600, while the majority of the library is indeed crap (like most dominant consoles), there are in fact plenty of great games, as long as you don't mind the sorts of things they made in that era.  Off the top of my head, there's Combat,  Ms. Pac-Man, Jr. Pac-Man, Asteroids, Solaris (which is worth trying just to see what they managed to pull off with the hardware), River Raid, Stargate, Cosmic Ark, Yar's Revenge, and Pitfall 2.  There's a reason why it was the dominant console for so long.

Agreed on both points.  Although I became more of a NES fan in later years my first console was a 2600 and I recall really enjoying it.  I also think that a few games like Pitfall 2 and Ms. Pac-Man (my preferred Pac rendition), taken for what they are, still stand up today.

Quote from: Gao on 07/18/2011, 04:31 PMGood point about Virtual Console.  That probably will keep the NES and the like from fading as much.  However, a shift is definitely happening.  10 years ago, you really didn't see that many collectors of things like the SNES, but now it's become one of the most popular systems to collect for, and we're already seeing more and more N64 collectors out there.  The most popular areas in retrogaming will probably always be whatever the current 20-30 year olds grew up with, since they are the ones who now have the disposable income to acquire all the games they want, often don't have their time sucked up by children yet, and haven't yet gotten all the games they want for the consoled they're interested in.

I disagree.  The Virtual Console was a reactionary development to curb piracy because interest in the NES wasn't fading.  Youtube, AVGN, and the ease with which modern systems can be hacked to run emulators probably played a greater role than in the retro craze.  While all consoles will experience a second wind as children grow into their twenties, the 8- and 16-bit generations will endure.  Maybe the short-attention-span crowd will fall off, but there's an attraction to a time when the market was dominated by companies that specialized in video games instead of computer and media giants, publishers took risks, games didn't have budgets the size of Summer movies, and a little imagination on the part of the player was helpful.

Quote from: guest on 07/21/2011, 03:02 PMthere's an attraction to a time when the market was dominated by companies that specialized in video games instead of computer and media giants, publishers took risks, games didn't have budgets the size of Summer movies, and a little imagination on the part of the player was helpful.

I really, really agree with this.



I also want to add, though, that while I agree that the Virtual Console was totally a reactionary development I believe that it has served to expose some younger gamers to older games.  At least, I know one teen gamer who has played and enjoyed games that came out for the virtual console that she never would have played if she'd had to expend effort, i.e. download an emulator or buy a used system on line.  Youtube et. al. may have played a greater role for many, but I think for some the VC was in the right place at the right time....

Quote from: guest on 07/21/2011, 03:02 PMI disagree.  The Virtual Console was a reactionary development to curb piracy because interest in the NES wasn't fading.  Youtube, AVGN, and the ease with which modern systems can be hacked to run emulators probably played a greater role than in the retro craze.

You're probably right about AVGN and Youtube helping, though I'm not sure if console hacking really did much given how much easier it already was to just emulate on a PC.  As for the Virtual Console, it's creation was indeed reactionary, but I agree with Thrush that it still helped bring people into retrogaming.

QuoteWhile all consoles will experience a second wind as children grow into their twenties, the 8- and 16-bit generations will endure.  Maybe the short-attention-span crowd will fall off, but there's an attraction to a time when the market was dominated by companies that specialized in video games instead of computer and media giants, publishers took risks, games didn't have budgets the size of Summer movies, and a little imagination on the part of the player was helpful.

Honestly, you could make a similar case just about any era you want, from the Atari days ("those games were all about skill, not about graphics, story, or 'beating' it"), to the 32 bit era ("there will always be appeal for those games that finally had the freedom of three dimensions, but weren't yet bogged down by giant budgets or established ideas of how a 3d game should work"), to the modern days ("with games like Portal, Infamous, and Uncharted 2, we finally had games were story and gameplay were integrated in such a way that each element enhanced the other to create an experience that you truly couldn't have in any other medium, and there will always be appeal for that").

Don't get me wrong, I love 8 and 16 bit stuff, and I probably play more from that era than anything else, but every generation has its strengths and weaknesses, and which strengths and weaknesses appeal to the public at large varies over time.  I really don't know how to tell how long these particular generations will remain popular aside from just waiting it out to see what happens.

Thanks for the kind words thrush. It's the same thing with my friends most of them will complain about the graphics or quite because there "too hard" (except bomberman all my friends love that) but personally I don't think there's a better feeling than beating a hard ass game like contra. Well there's better feelings but I mean as far as video games.

Quote from: Gao on 07/21/2011, 10:46 PMDon't get me wrong, I love 8 and 16 bit stuff, and I probably play more from that era than anything else, but every generation has its strengths and weaknesses, and which strengths and weaknesses appeal to the public at large varies over time.  I really don't know how to tell how long these particular generations will remain popular aside from just waiting it out to see what happens.

The video game market will crash again!  Everyone will give up on 3D plus 3D games!  That's when Tats will release his master plan on the world and make every one OBEY!

Quote from: geise on 07/22/2011, 06:39 AM

Quote from: Gao on 07/21/2011, 10:46 PMDon't get me wrong, I love 8 and 16 bit stuff, and I probably play more from that era than anything else, but every generation has its strengths and weaknesses, and which strengths and weaknesses appeal to the public at large varies over time.  I really don't know how to tell how long these particular generations will remain popular aside from just waiting it out to see what happens.

The video game market will crash again!  Everyone will give up on 3D plus 3D games!  That's when Tats will release his master plan on the world and make every one OBEY!

Oh No's! :shock:

I was never super interested in the formats. I didn't get into the PC Engine because of Hu Cards, CD-ROMs, Super CD-ROMs, etc. I was fascinated by this awesome little console from my childhood called a "PC Engine." Is there a cooler name than that? I used to sit and stare at pictures in my EGMs when I was little just because they were screenshots of this Japan only PC Engine thing. I didn't even know what the console looked like back then, and I don't think I even knew the Turbo was its American counterpart.

Granted I knew of the CD-ROM add on and the Turbo Duo back then, and the thought of games being put on CDs put my imagination into overdrive. I just always remembered how much I always wanted one, the formats be damned!

Really I'm just in it for the Deep Blue......

There are great games on both formats, so I can't ignore either one. My favorite system of all time, so I'll keep collecting and playing everyting.

Not really. Language barrier is a stumbling block in any case.

I get the US games when possible, but if they are too expensive I will get the PCE version.

Quote from: MasonSushi on 08/02/2011, 09:57 AMI get the US games when possible, but if they are too expensive I will get the PCE version.

words to live by when collecting turbob.

I love the fact that this console is almost like 4 consoles wrapped in one! (5 for you Supergrafx owners) and when we see the developer really push the envelope on some Huey or CD-rom games. 

Example, I remember playing through Shubibinman 3 and about half way through seeing amazing GIANT bosses and crazy flashing paralax, I had to do a double take when I looked at the case and saw this was only a CD2 game and NOT SCD!!  Hell, I would have believed the game was Arcade Card if the mark was on the case....lol

Also, how amazing was it to see Street Fighter II CE look just as good as the SNES version of SFII?  I was floored.  Had no idea the ole Huey could pull off so many tricks!!

Quote from: JoshTurboTrollX-16 on 08/02/2011, 10:03 AMI love the fact that this console is almost like 4 consoles wrapped in one! (5 for you Supergrafx owners)

I've often thought about this.  It almost makes the system feel more like a desktop computer since there is a series of continual improvements and additions, rather than the static uniformity interrupted by occasional quantum leaps characteristic of most console lines.

Just what the system is capable of with the Arcade Card is pure amazement. Fighting games like Fatal Fury and Art of Fighting look great for an "8-bit" system. Sure they aren't Arcade/Neo-Geo, but pretty damn close. And who can forget Sapphire??? Regardless, both formats have their gems. Wouldn't do without either type as they are both awesome.

Quote from: thrush on 08/05/2011, 08:40 AM

Quote from: JoshTurboTrollX-16 on 08/02/2011, 10:03 AMI love the fact that this console is almost like 4 consoles wrapped in one! (5 for you Supergrafx owners)

I've often thought about this.  It almost makes the system feel more like a desktop computer since there is a series of continual improvements and additions, rather than the static uniformity interrupted by occasional quantum leaps characteristic of most console lines.

Can make it feel like it costs almost as much as a desktop computer at times as well...

Quote from: thrush on 08/05/2011, 08:40 AM

Quote from: JoshTurboTrollX-16 on 08/02/2011, 10:03 AMI love the fact that this console is almost like 4 consoles wrapped in one! (5 for you Supergrafx owners)

I've often thought about this.  It almost makes the system feel more like a desktop computer since there is a series of continual improvements and additions, rather than the static uniformity interrupted by occasional quantum leaps characteristic of most console lines.

The PC Engine wasn't very unique in this regard in Japan. The SG-1000, Famicom, Sega Mark III and Mega Drive all had lots of variations, expansions and multiple formats. The Mega Drive in particular has all consoles ever beat.

Quote from: Mishran on 08/05/2011, 10:05 AMJust what the system is capable of with the Arcade Card is pure amazement. Fighting games like Fatal Fury and Art of Fighting look great for an "8-bit" system. Sure they aren't Arcade/Neo-Geo, but pretty damn close. And who can forget Sapphire??? Regardless, both formats have their gems. Wouldn't do without either type as they are both awesome.

They're even impressive for 16-bit. :)

Quote from: guest on 08/05/2011, 03:11 PMThe PC Engine wasn't very unique in this regard in Japan. The SG-1000, Famicom, Sega Mark III and Mega Drive all had lots of variations, expansions and multiple formats. The Mega Drive in particular has all consoles ever beat.

I wonder what accounts for that?  Was it just that the strong economy there in the 1990s could support a wide range of add-ons, or was there some deeper reason?

Quote from: thrush on 08/06/2011, 04:04 PM

Quote from: guest on 08/05/2011, 03:11 PMThe PC Engine wasn't very unique in this regard in Japan. The SG-1000, Famicom, Sega Mark III and Mega Drive all had lots of variations, expansions and multiple formats. The Mega Drive in particular has all consoles ever beat.

I wonder what accounts for that?  Was it just that the strong economy there in the 1990s could support a wide range of add-ons, or was there some deeper reason?

Sega's schizophrenic mid 90s marketing.

Quote from: thrush on 08/06/2011, 04:04 PM

Quote from: CrackTiger on 08/05/2011, 03:11 PMThe PC Engine wasn't very unique in this regard in Japan. The SG-1000, Famicom, Sega Mark III and Mega Drive all had lots of variations, expansions and multiple formats. The Mega Drive in particular has all consoles ever beat.

I wonder what accounts for that?  Was it just that the strong economy there in the 1990s could support a wide range of add-ons, or was there some deeper reason?

Japan just loved video games. Even if every platform wasn't a huge success, their was still a market for innovation.

QuoteSega's schizophrenic mid 90s marketing.

They did more experimenting during the 80's.

(https://web.archive.org/web/20190511141751im_/http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/sega80sstuff.jpg)

Quote from: guest on 08/06/2011, 09:35 PMThey did more experimenting during the 80's.

Japan has certainly always loved video games. Also, part of the experimentation of the 80s was that people had money coming out of their ears back then. I'm sure some of it is romanticized, but you'd be hard-pressed to find a wilder economic bubble than 80s Japan.

Good Lord! I had no clue!

Quote from: guest on 08/06/2011, 09:35 PMThey did more experimenting during the 80's.

I have to ask, what the hell is that "Telecon Pack" thing?

Quote from: SamIAm on 08/06/2011, 10:03 PMAlso, part of the experimentation of the 80s was that people had money coming out of their ears back then.

This was my thinking, too.  A lot of the peripherals for Japanese consoles I've read about remind me of the sorts of things you could get for 8-bit home computers in the US when I was 1st-grade-ish, but taken to the next level in terms of variety.  To me, this argues a similar impulse fuelled by more funds.  On the other hand, you have things like the Loopy coming out well into the 1990s and I don't think I've ever seen anything quite like that this side of the Pacific.  Could be I'm mistaken, but this makes me wonder if it's more than just money that motivated all the accessories & add-ons....

/edited for clarity

Quote from: Gao on 08/07/2011, 12:05 AM

Quote from: CrackTiger on 08/06/2011, 09:35 PMThey did more experimenting during the 80's.

I have to ask, what the hell is that "Telecon Pack" thing?

Wireless AV.