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Was watching a youtube video this morning talking about Famicom cartridges; while doing so, it was suggested that PC Engine/Turbografx HuCards are not cartridges.

Are they, or aren't they? And what, exactly, is the definition of a cartridge?

Cartridge-
a small part with a particular purpose, used in a larger piece of equipment, which can be easily replaced with another similar part.

In this vein most of our wankers can be considered cartridges- but not mine- mine's too big.

A hucard is most certainly a cartridge.

Not a cartridge.  Its a plastic card with a PCB glued to it.  This is not a cartridge as the PCB is not contained in anything, its just flipped over and painted black.  Its a Hudson Card.  8)

The Japanese company's loved comming up with their own names though.  Neo Geo AES games are "ROM Cassettes" acording to the Japanese packaging.  :dance:

Of course they are cartridges. Why the hell wouldn't they be? In fact, I rarely refer to them as "HuCards" because most people will stare blankly at you when you do so.

They are a plastic game medium that interfaces with the system via a set of pins. Sure they are smaller than most cartridges, but that's just because NEC rocks and was efficient when designing them. Why would they NOT be a cartridge?

Anyone who says otherwise is a doofus.

That is so stupid. Of course they are! What else would they be? I often describe my Turbo Duo as a system that plays both Cartridge and CD games. Although, I do use this description for people who know nothing about the Turbo... :-k

cartridge: bullet, gunpowder, and primer packaged into a single metallic case precisely made to fit the firing chamber of a firearm.  :lol:

HuCards are cartridges in my book.  I classify games as either disc (CDs, DVDs, floppies, etc.), cartridge (PCBs), or download.

Quote from: SuperDeadite on 05/14/2008, 01:11 PMNot a cartridge.  Its a plastic card with a PCB glued to it.  This is not a cartridge as the PCB is not contained in anything, its just flipped over and painted black.

Following that logic: gluing another piece of plastic on top of a HuCard will magically transform it into a cartridge, and removing a SNES (or whatever) cartridge from its case will forever end its life as a cartridge.  Sounds goofy to me.

They are not carttridges, to me but cards. The name says it all, doesn't it?

Quote from: shubibiman on 05/14/2008, 02:18 PMThey are not carttridges, to me but cards. The name says it all, doesn't it?

Following that logic- an iBook would actually be a book and not a computer, a hamburger would be made out ham and a hot dog would be made from dog meat.  :roll:

YEah, what if I had an NES cartridge shaped like a boot? Would it then be a boot and stop being a cartridge?

Quote from: nat on 05/14/2008, 03:56 PMYEah, what if I had an NES cartridge shaped like a boot? Would it then be a boot and stop being a cartridge?

better yet- whose ass would you apply it to?  :lol:

At the risk of sounding like a doofus  8) 8) I never considered HuCARDS cartridges. Any cartridge I've seen, up to the N64, were big clunky P.O.S. that you had to blow on to get them to work properly. I always go by the saying "If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck..." - the HuCARD does neither. It's its own thing. Sure it performs the same function, but so do CDs. The SMS is a perfect example -they didn't call both game formats cartridges. They called the main cartridges "cartridges", and the cards "cards".

Basically, I look at Turbochips and Sega Cards as completely different formats from cartridges and CDs. However, technically they are cartridges. Wiki explains cartridges as:

QuoteIn various types of electronic equipment, a cartridge can refer one method of adding different functionality or content (e.g. a video game cartridge), or a method by which consumables may be replenished (e.g. an ink cartridge for a printer). The term cartridge tends to be applied loosely to a large range of techniques which conform to this general description.

In general, the term tends to mean any detachable sub-unit that is held within its own container. The term cassette has a similar meaning. A video game cartridge may also be referred to as a cart or game pak.

Now, I've never called a cassette tape a cartridge and I would look at anyone strange for calling it that. It may by broad definition be a cartridge, but no one calls them cartridges. I tend to see HuCARDs in that way. Technically, by definition, they are cartridges, but we all know they are something else, and better.  8) By most definitions of cartridge, CDs also fall under that category. CDs are inserted into a bigger instrument and are easily replaceable. I guess MiniDiscs would more easily fit the cartridge definition than just regular CDs since they are encased; however, it's still just a CD in a plastic case. So is it just the plastic case that makes it a cartridge?

Its a cartridge to me but never really thought about it until now  :-k ... take away all the game casings from different system carts and you end up with the same teeth (whatever they are called) that need to be inserted into a device/system, me 2 cents. 
Edit: ceti's comment has me thinking though :-k

I voted NOt a caRtridge! since it is a rom card  :)

Quote from: turbo D on 05/14/2008, 04:13 PMI voted NOt a caRtridge! since it is a rom card  :)

and what exactly is a "rom card" if not a cartridge?  :-k  You've opened one serious can of worms Guyjin!

Interesting. So we are arguing semantics?

 I voted for cartridge, but technically it's not IMO. It's a card. A cartridge is a hollow case(usually two halves) that houses a PCB. A card is either glued to or molded with, a slim PCB. The share the same purpose (protecting the PCB), but are nothing alike in design.

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/14/2008, 04:22 PM

Quote from: turbo D on 05/14/2008, 04:13 PMI voted NOt a caRtridge! since it is a rom card  :)

and what exactly is a "rom card" if not a cartridge?  :-k  You've opened one serious can of worms Guyjin!

hahaha!! Did he ever!! Curse you Guyjin!!  :twisted: :twisted:

But seriously, I spent my whole drive home thinking about this. lol I still think that by strict definition (at least from what I've found online), HuCARDs are cartridges. But by strict definition many things are cartridges that I never really considered such. For example, flash memory cards, by definition are cartridges. They hold information and are inserted into a larger instrument (i.e. computers, dvd players, gaming consoles), but I've never considered them cartridges. I've always referred to them as cards or sticks.

OK. I just found something.

http://www.computerhope.com/jargon/r/romcard.htm (http://www.computerhope.com/jargon/r/romcard.htm)

If you click "ROM cartridge" on that link, the definition of "ROM cartridge" states that it's virtually identical to the ROM Card except that it's bigger.

Cartridge..... card..... cartridge..... card..... I'm so confused.  :-k

Where's the fourth option, guyjin?  Did you forget that HuCards are also part of a balanced breakfast?  :)

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/14/2008, 04:22 PMYou've opened one serious can of worms Guyjin!

That's what I'm here for.  :twisted:

Anyway, here's the video I was too lazy to link to this morning:
http://youtu.be/CHMkwPEuv-o
He doesn't directly say so, but it's implied around 1:10.

Quote from: guest on 05/14/2008, 05:14 PMWhere's the fourth option, guyjin?  Did you forget that HuCards are also part of a balanced breakfast?  :)

Yes I did. I've fixed the error.  :lol:

I voted cartridge...the only difference between a NES/SNES cart, etc.  is the way the innards are housed.  I mean take apart a NES cart...how much useless dead area is there.  So maybe we should define a cartridge as a media form that wastes room/plastic, and the cards are a much more efficient way to house the media in a least wasteful, space saving CARTRIDGE  :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

I voted 'not a cartridge'

If I was going to be a tool like Sinistron and just go blindly along with the dictionary definition, I'd have to agree that HuCards are cartridges... but no...

HuCards are a separate identity. Dictionary definitions don't have to be set in stone, and can be changed by a dedicated group of people... HuCards shouldn't be lumped together with those clunky space wasters that, as Ceti pointed out, need you to blow on em half the time before they work.

One word that has had it's original meaning corrupted is the term "semite"

According to the dictionary, the term "semite" includes a number of Afro-Asiatic linguistic groups, including Hebrew, Arabic, Aramaic, Ethiopic, and some others... but the definition has been corrupted by Zionists to refer exclusively to Jews... to the point that when people say "anti-semitism" it is understood that it is Jews who are being talked about and not any of the other "semites"

When I tell people who have never heard of a turbo grafx 16, I tell them that the games came in a cerdit card size game card.  I don't think of it as a cartridge even technicly it is.  I think of cartridge as being big and clunky as found on the other systems.

This is quite the confusing post Rag-time.

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/14/2008, 06:18 PMHuCards are a separate identity. Dictionary definitions don't have to be set in stone, and can be changed by a dedicated group of people... HuCards shouldn't be lumped together with those clunky space wasters that, as Ceti pointed out, need you to blow on em half the time before they work.

so, how does this "dedicated group of people" who can change the definition differ from these "zionists" who changed what the word "semite" means?

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/14/2008, 06:18 PMAccording to the dictionary, the term "semite" includes a number of Afro-Asiatic linguistic groups, including Hebrew, Arabic, Aramaic, Ethiopic, and some others... but the definition has been corrupted by Zionists to refer exclusively to Jews... to the point that when people say "anti-semitism" it is understood that it is Jews who are being talked about and not any of the other "semites"

You seem to be making two opposing points here- 1) That it's good for dedicated people to change a definition
and 2) that a dedicated group of fanatics who changed a word "corrupted" it and therefore did a bad thing.

:-k Two opposing thoughts that lead fucking nowhere and somehow I'm the tool.


Hey- maybe it is a cartridge and maybe it isn't- but you're most certainly quite the "card".

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/14/2008, 08:51 PMThis is quite the confusing post Rag-time.

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/14/2008, 06:18 PMHuCards are a separate identity. Dictionary definitions don't have to be set in stone, and can be changed by a dedicated group of people... HuCards shouldn't be lumped together with those clunky space wasters that, as Ceti pointed out, need you to blow on em half the time before they work.

so, how does this "dedicated group of people" who can change the definition differ from these "zionists" who changed what the word "semite" means?

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/14/2008, 06:18 PMAccording to the dictionary, the term "semite" includes a number of Afro-Asiatic linguistic groups, including Hebrew, Arabic, Aramaic, Ethiopic, and some others... but the definition has been corrupted by Zionists to refer exclusively to Jews... to the point that when people say "anti-semitism" it is understood that it is Jews who are being talked about and not any of the other "semites"

You seem to be making two opposing points here- 1) That it's good for dedicated people to change a definition
and 2) that a dedicated group of fanatics who changed a word "corrupted" it and therefore did a bad thing.

:-k Two opposing thoughts that lead fucking nowhere and somehow I'm the tool.


Hey- maybe it is a cartridge and maybe it isn't- but you're most certainly quite the "card". 

In the case of "two opposing thoughts" ... it's all about intentions. The current definition of cartridges doesn't take into account that HuCards are cards, and not clunky hunks of plastic!

The coolness factor of HuCards needs to be taken into account in that definition! The dictionary definition of "cartridge" doesn't seem to really take the gaming community into consideration... by the dictionary definition, it seems like CDs can be considered cartridges, as someone else said above.

I used the example of the term "semite" to show you that the changing of the definition of words has happened in recent history, so accepting the definitions in the dictionary as unchangeable is the behavior of a tool!

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/14/2008, 09:21 PM

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/14/2008, 08:51 PMThis is quite the confusing post Rag-time.

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/14/2008, 06:18 PMHuCards are a separate identity. Dictionary definitions don't have to be set in stone, and can be changed by a dedicated group of people... HuCards shouldn't be lumped together with those clunky space wasters that, as Ceti pointed out, need you to blow on em half the time before they work.

so, how does this "dedicated group of people" who can change the definition differ from these "zionists" who changed what the word "semite" means?

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/14/2008, 06:18 PMAccording to the dictionary, the term "semite" includes a number of Afro-Asiatic linguistic groups, including Hebrew, Arabic, Aramaic, Ethiopic, and some others... but the definition has been corrupted by Zionists to refer exclusively to Jews... to the point that when people say "anti-semitism" it is understood that it is Jews who are being talked about and not any of the other "semites"

You seem to be making two opposing points here- 1) That it's good for dedicated people to change a definition
and 2) that a dedicated group of fanatics who changed a word "corrupted" it and therefore did a bad thing.

:-k Two opposing thoughts that lead fucking nowhere and somehow I'm the tool.


Hey- maybe it is a cartridge and maybe it isn't- but you're most certainly quite the "card". 

In the case of "two opposing thoughts" ... it's all about intentions. The current definition of cartridges doesn't take into account that HuCards are cards, and not clunky hunks of plastic!

The coolness factor of HuCards needs to be taken into account in that definition! The dictionary definition of "cartridge" doesn't seem to really take the gaming community into consideration... by the dictionary definition, it seems like CDs can be considered cartridges, as someone else said above.

I used the example of the term "semite" to show you that the changing of the definition of words has happened in recent history, so accepting the definitions in the dictionary as unchangeable is the behavior of a tool!

Hmmm.  Seems like you completely missed the bit in my initial post where I said right after posting the definition of cartridge- "In this vein most of our wankers can be considered cartridges"...  Now maybe you'd like to show me how I'm going "blindly along with the dictionary definition" instead of actually pointing out how vague it is?

Other than that BLARING mistake you made in sizing up my post- I ask you to point out to me where I state something along the lines of the definitions in the dictionary are unchangeable and/or are not meant to be changed. 

As Bonknuts correctly surmised- this is a thread about semantics.  I am a 'tool' for showing a definition- and then making a joke about the vagueness of it?  Clearly (or maybe not so clearly if you're a muddle headed fool) the reason I picked it as being a cartridge wasn't because I feel so rigidly about the definition.  If you think that I actually consider my penis or anyone else's to be a cartridge in anything other than a joking "poetic-license" sense then you are the entire tool f*cking shed- not just a mere tool.

Now- what was your point again?

It's a rom chip that plugs into a console using copper contacts containing game data. Therefor, it is a cartridge.

It just happens to be a cartridge that looks like it was made last week, rather than twenty years ago. Damn sexy piece of electronics, the hucard!  :lol:

That's what I'm saying. I just don't even see how there could be any debate.

I mean..... It's. a. cartridge.

 :o

Damn you guyjin!!  :P :P

The debate isn't really if the HuCARD is a cartridge or not; it's really just about if you consider it a cartridge. It's just semantics. A HuCARD is a type of cartridge, but it's certainly unique in the world of consoles. Though calling it a cartridge isn't entirely precise, it is a form of cartridge. A memory card is also a type of cartridge (again, from the definitions I've read online), and so are a lot of things.

Anyway, this should be a fun debate. I don't think there's any reason for name calling. Everyone put their cartridge back in their pants.  :P

When I think of a cartridge, I think of a case that encloses an item. Like a cd cartridge from those old skool multi-disk players or a gun's magazine ( also called a cartridge.) I suppose you could call a hucard a cartridge, but it sounds out of place. Take the Sega MasterSystem for example; it has a cartridge slot and a card slot. Sega seems to agree that a rom card is different from a cartridge. Yay Sega!

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/14/2008, 09:34 PM

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/14/2008, 09:21 PM

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/14/2008, 08:51 PMThis is quite the confusing post Rag-time.

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/14/2008, 06:18 PMHuCards are a separate identity. Dictionary definitions don't have to be set in stone, and can be changed by a dedicated group of people... HuCards shouldn't be lumped together with those clunky space wasters that, as Ceti pointed out, need you to blow on em half the time before they work.

so, how does this "dedicated group of people" who can change the definition differ from these "zionists" who changed what the word "semite" means?

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/14/2008, 06:18 PMAccording to the dictionary, the term "semite" includes a number of Afro-Asiatic linguistic groups, including Hebrew, Arabic, Aramaic, Ethiopic, and some others... but the definition has been corrupted by Zionists to refer exclusively to Jews... to the point that when people say "anti-semitism" it is understood that it is Jews who are being talked about and not any of the other "semites"

You seem to be making two opposing points here- 1) That it's good for dedicated people to change a definition
and 2) that a dedicated group of fanatics who changed a word "corrupted" it and therefore did a bad thing.

:-k Two opposing thoughts that lead fucking nowhere and somehow I'm the tool.


Hey- maybe it is a cartridge and maybe it isn't- but you're most certainly quite the "card". 

In the case of "two opposing thoughts" ... it's all about intentions. The current definition of cartridges doesn't take into account that HuCards are cards, and not clunky hunks of plastic!

The coolness factor of HuCards needs to be taken into account in that definition! The dictionary definition of "cartridge" doesn't seem to really take the gaming community into consideration... by the dictionary definition, it seems like CDs can be considered cartridges, as someone else said above.

I used the example of the term "semite" to show you that the changing of the definition of words has happened in recent history, so accepting the definitions in the dictionary as unchangeable is the behavior of a tool!

Hmmm.  Seems like you completely missed the bit in my initial post where I said right after posting the definition of cartridge- "In this vein most of our wankers can be considered cartridges"...  Now maybe you'd like to show me how I'm going "blindly along with the dictionary definition" instead of actually pointing out how vague it is?

Other than that BLARING mistake you made in sizing up my post- I ask you to point out to me where I state something along the lines of the definitions in the dictionary are unchangeable and/or are not meant to be changed. 

As Bonknuts correctly surmised- this is a thread about semantics.  I am a 'tool' for showing a definition- and then making a joke about the vagueness of it?  Clearly (or maybe not so clearly if you're a muddle headed fool) the reason I picked it as being a cartridge wasn't because I feel so rigidly about the definition.  If you think that I actually consider my penis or anyone else's to be a cartridge in anything other than a joking "poetic-license" sense then you are the entire tool f*cking shed- not just a mere tool.

Now- what was your point again?

My point was that cartridges are for the masses, HuCards are for us!

And don't try to explain away the last sentence of your first post as if we didn't see that!

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/14/2008, 01:10 PMA hucard is most certainly a cartridge.

Most certainly because it fits the dictionary definition! Not that you're pretty sure... but MOST CERTAINLY! Seems pretty rigid to me!

Cartridges are for the masses... SNES, Genesis, NES... those are cartridges.... but HuCards are HuCards!

The dictionary definition doesn't take into account the fact that the TurboGrafx-16 rules, dude!!! HuCards are so awesome they have their own word, and rightly so! :-({|= [-X

By the way Sinistron, I just noticed in the shoutbox you said that you are trying to quit smoking, so it seems I picked a bad time to give you a hard time!! May God bless you and your wife and make things easy for you! [-o<

You guys are crazy. They are the same thing.

One of the oldest usage of the term "cartridge" is for firearms. In this case it replaced loading and packing each round one at a time with a simple interchangeable cartridge. Likewise a NES, Neo Geo, or HuCard cart/card saves you the trouble of actually soldering in all those ROM chips by providing an interchangeable case (or cassette, just means "small case" in French), or cartridge.

Quote from: SignOfZeta on 05/15/2008, 01:36 AMYou guys are crazy. They are the same thing.

One of the oldest usage of the term "cartridge" is for firearms. In this case it replaced loading and packing each round one at a time with a simple interchangeable cartridge. Likewise a NES, Neo Geo, or HuCard cart/card saves you the trouble of actually soldering in all those ROM chips by providing an interchangeable case (or cassette, just means "small case" in French), or cartridge.

Nooooo Sign of Zeta and Sinistron agree on this one... what have I unleashed?? :shock: :mrgreen:

Zeta, if we're crazy, you're no fun! :P

Quote from: SignOfZeta on 05/15/2008, 01:36 AMYou guys are crazy. They are the same thing.

One of the oldest usage of the term "cartridge" is for firearms. In this case it replaced loading and packing each round one at a time with a simple interchangeable cartridge. Likewise a NES, Neo Geo, or HuCard cart/card saves you the trouble of actually soldering in all those ROM chips by providing an interchangeable case (or cassette, just means "small case" in French), or cartridge.

A hucard is not a small case; it does not enclose anything. I don't know if you read my earlier post or not, but I already brought up the firearm cartridge  :P. You can call me crazy, but will you call Sega crazy?

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/15/2008, 01:19 AMMy point was that cartridges are for the masses, HuCards are for us!

And don't try to explain away the last sentence of your first post as if we didn't see that!

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/14/2008, 01:10 PMA hucard is most certainly a cartridge.

Most certainly because it fits the dictionary definition! Not that you're pretty sure... but MOST CERTAINLY! Seems pretty rigid to me!

Act like you didn't see what?  My opinion on the matter- after I showed how vague the dictionary definition is?
Honestly man you need to grow up and develop your brain a little more.

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/15/2008, 01:19 AMCartridges are for the masses... SNES, Genesis, NES... those are cartridges.... but HuCards are HuCards!

The dictionary definition doesn't take into account the fact that the TurboGrafx-16 rules, dude!!! HuCards are so awesome they have their own word, and rightly so! :-({|= [-X

By the way Sinistron, I just noticed in the shoutbox you said that you are trying to quit smoking, so it seems I picked a bad time to give you a hard time!! May God bless you and your wife and make things easy for you! [-o<

Wrong again.  I never said I was trying to quit smoking.  Those on the shoutbox who know me better know that every week I take breaks from smoking- with no intention of quitting.  There were other reasons beyond that that me and my girlfriend (not wife) were having a hard time last night- and if you'd like to air my personal business that I was referring to amongst friends in that regard then I must warn you- I will seriously burn you and make you look more convoluted and desperate than you're already looking- than a bunch of us on shoutbox last night already agreed you look.  I believe that the running joke last night was that I am a zionist for calling a hucard a cartridge.  If you care to be the fodder for more shoutbox humor then so be it.

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/15/2008, 07:27 AMand if you'd like to air my personal business that I was referring to amongst friends in that regard then I must warn you-

The shoutbox is not private, and you shouldn't expect it to be.

Quote from: guyjin on 05/15/2008, 09:19 AM

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/15/2008, 07:27 AMand if you'd like to air my personal business that I was referring to amongst friends in that regard then I must warn you-

The shoutbox is not private, and you shouldn't expect it to be.

You are correct- and I don't expect it to be-
however he A) took information from there that he clearly didn't understand, B) comes on here and adds wrong information about a dispute between me and my girlfriend as if it's comedy- when 1) it isn't and 2) has nothing to do with anything about hucards being cartridges or not. Twiggy came onto the shout trying to be Mr. Personality after calling me a tool- we argued further there and then later on he combed the shoutbox for information that wasn't directed to him but to the few people who were there- and though the shoutbox isn't personal- the misquoted information was and though perhaps I shouldn't have said it there there is zero cause for it to be repeated here. 
 

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/15/2008, 01:53 AMNooooo Sign of Zeta and Sinistron agree on this one... what have I unleashed?? :shock: :mrgreen:

What have you unleashed?  You were not the first person here to say that a hucard isn't a cartridge- and if you were and if you happened to be the first poster here aside from Guyjin you still wouldn't have altered either me or Zeta's opinions.  You have unleashed nothing- this is Guyjin's post - the opinions were already there - a debate on the opinions has been unleashed but certainly not by you.

Guys.. just chill out. This is the third or fourth time I've seen mention of the shoutbox used for "we'll have/had a good laugh at you in the shout box at your expense for what you posted - blah -blah -blah" type of clique crap. It's immature and annoying.

 That out of the way.

 A PCB by itself *is* a card, not a cartridge. A cartridge, in context, is a case the encloses a PCB. A cartridge is a type of case. A hucard does not enclose a PCB. The plastic provides physically structure to support the PCB, not enclosing it like a cartridge. The PCB is fully exposed (the black part). It's the same as with a credit card. The magnetic strip is supported by the card's plastic (as well as some ICs for credit cards). Credit Cards are not cartridges.

Rag- take a breather man. 
I'll respond for you and save you the energy- you look like you need it.

Quote from: RaggedyAndy-time4'PoorMan'sTwiggy' on 05/15/2008, 01:19 AM(http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a88/greatmasturbator/rag-time.jpg)

Bonknuts- I'm not following you either.  EVERYTHING you posted so far is for the argument that hucards are not cartridges- and yet in your first post you say you voted for cartridge?  :-s

Quote from: SinistronBonknuts- I'm not following you either.  EVERYTHING you posted so far is for the argument that hucards are not cartridges- and yet in your first post you say you voted for cartridge?  :-s

IMO: Technically it's not a cartridge, but in generality it is a cartridge since it serves the a similar purpose - provide a physical plug in media for a game  rom.

So it is, but it isn't  :-s :-k

Quote from: TurboXray on 05/15/2008, 10:02 AMA PCB by itself *is* a card, not a cartridge. A cartridge, in context, is a case the encloses a PCB. A cartridge is a type of case. A hucard does not enclose a PCB. The plastic provides physically structure to support the PCB, not enclosing it like a cartridge. The PCB is fully exposed (the black part). It's the same as with a credit card. The magnetic strip is supported by the card's plastic (as well as some ICs for credit cards). Credit Cards are not cartridges.

You've pretty much sold me. I forgot that the PCB is just the black part of the HuCARD. It isn't enclosed.

As silly as this debate is, it's obviously been an unanswered question that has been lingering. hehe And though it will probably remain unanswered by some, I'm satisfied. It's not a cartridge.  O:) O:)

It's the whole black or white thing that is getting everyone ruffled here I fear.
I posit forth the notion that  :shock: It IS a cartridge- in the shape of a CARD!   :-"

however a cartridge in the shape of a card is a cartridge first and foremost  :P

But.... It's a cartridge.

Quote from: TurboXray on 05/15/2008, 10:02 AMA PCB by itself *is* a card, not a cartridge.

Sure it is, if it has connector pins meant to be used to plug it into a larger unit for interface.

Quote from: turbo DA hucard is not a small case; it does not enclose anything.

Yes, it is. Yes, it does. Rip apart a HuCard some time. Only a very small percentage of its mass is actual ROM.

Quote. You can call me crazy, but will you call Sega crazy?

Its not crazy, its just a marketable use of language. Nintendo called Famicom carts "cassettes" in Japan and NES "Game Packs" in the US. Sony makes a "Memory Stick®" while most stuff uses an SD "memory card". Is one a "stick", and one a "card"? They are all cartridges in the shape of cards.

Quote from: SignOfZeta on 05/15/2008, 11:10 AM

Quote from: turbo DA hucard is not a small case; it does not enclose anything.

Yes, it is. Yes, it does. Rip apart a HuCard some time. Only a very small percentage of its mass is actual ROM.

Quote. You can call me crazy, but will you call Sega crazy?

Its not crazy, its just a marketable use of language. Nintendo called Famicom carts "cassettes" in Japan and NES "Game Packs" in the US. Sony makes a "Memory Stick®" while most stuff uses an SD "memory card". Is one a "stick", and one a "card"? They are all cartridges in the shape of cards.

yeah- I know hell's freezing over or whatever- but Zeta's 110% right.  There were photos on threads here I believe (or on other pce related sites) that I'm sure most of you have seen where a hucard is taken apart and the card is CLEARLY a case and is clearly mostly plastic- you don't even need to take it apart to see that.  Why is there even any debate?

He's also absolutely right that Sega calling their card-shaped cartridges "cards" was only about marketing- only the foolish would take it so literally.  Are you the same people who believe in blast processing?

Quote from: natSure it is, if it has connector pins meant to be used to plug it into a larger unit for interface.

No so ;). Cards that plug into a mother board, be it ram, video, nic, sound, etc - are not cartridges. They are cards. A cartridge is a case that encloses something, be it bullets, pills, PCBs, etc.

QuoteYes, it is. Yes, it does. Rip apart a HuCard some time. Only a very small percentage of its mass is actual ROM.

I've taken apart many hucards (swapping around the PCBs to play tricks on friends). The plastic card does not enclose the PCB. It's glue to the under side. That's not enclosing or encasing a PCB.

 A car is not a truck, but both are vehicles.

 Its based off of cart technoligy,and the chips are still protected by a protective layer so there is not direct exposure.In the loosest sense of the word its a cart,just compacted so there is no empty space. In the strictest sense it is its own format based off a prior one,the cart. Either way it goes hand in hand.

Quote from: turbo D on 05/15/2008, 03:41 AMYou can call me crazy, but will you call Sega crazy?

Damn right; the way they ran that company into the ground is the epitome of crazy.  :lol:

Quote from: TurboXray on 05/15/2008, 10:02 AMThe plastic provides physically structure to support the PCB, not enclosing it like a cartridge. The PCB is fully exposed (the black part).

Isn't the black part a coating and not integral to the PCB making it fully encased (except for the contacts, obviously)?  I postulate that the white plastic card provides the cartridge back/sides and the black coating is the top.  If you don't buy that argument (who'd blame you?), then would you say that Street Fighter 2, Populous, and the Tennokoe Bank are indeed cartridges?

Both of the sides of the card are plastic straight up and down- meaning that in width the thing is plastic. if just the surface part isn't plastic- but behind it and the sides are all plastic- that's pretty much enclosed and encased MOSTLY in plastic- if you want to be so technical- more than half of it is encased in plastic since both the back and sides are.  More than half is a much better argument for than for against- and anyway the surface part is encased in something which itself is held firm by the plastic which is also level on the bottom surface area- making this sort of a thin scoop.  What's the black coating made of anyway?  :-k

Plastic.  :D

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/15/2008, 11:40 AMBoth of the sides of the card are plastic straight up and down- meaning that in width the thing is plastic. if just the surface part isn't plastic- but behind it and the sides are all plastic- that's pretty much enclosed and encased MOSTLY in plastic- if you want to be so technical- more than half of it is encased in plastic since both the back and sides are.  More than half is a much better argument for than for against- and anyway the surface part is encased in something which itself is held firm by the plastic which is also level on the bottom surface area- making this sort of a thin scoop.  What's the black coating made of anyway?  :-k

Carbonite lol.
Exactly Sini. All that really diff between the cards and carts is the empty space normal carts have. Otherwise the technoligy is still basically the same.

We should have asked the mighty ENIAC in the first place!!!!!

I've been hopping this fence like a rabbit on 6 cups of coffee, but that's it. It's a cartridge. I don't thinking calling it a cartridge is very descriptive, as the HuCARD is not a traditional form of cartridge, but it is a cartridge nonetheless.

:lol: :lol: :lol:
HAHAHA We rolled Ceti over to our side! Take that you bastards!  "A hucard isn't a cartridge"!!  :lol: LOLOLOLOL :lol:  It's not TV! It's HBO!  :wink:

Quote from: guestIsn't the black part a coating and not integral to the PCB making it fully encased (except for the contacts, obviously)?  I postulate that the white plastic card provides the cartridge back/sides and the black coating is the top.  If you don't buy that argument (who'd blame you?), then would you say that Street Fighter 2, Populous, and the Tennokoe Bank are indeed cartridges?

The black part is in fact the PCB and PCB's have coatings, but that doesn't make it an enclosure since the coating to the PCB itself and not part of the card structure. Regarding Street Fighter 2 and the others with pop-ups, the pop-up serves only one purpose: to provided an area for the game label/logo. This is because the PCB is much longer than the normal PCB and therefore would drastically restrict the size of the label/logo.

QuoteBoth of the sides of the card are plastic straight up and down- meaning that in width the thing is plastic.

That doesn't make it a case/cartridge. (Also the top isn't plastic)

 Throwing all the technical jargon aside and going with the obvious/general, if you just look at it then you'll plainly see that it's a card - not a cart or cassette or cartridge in any of the traditional sense of the meaning. Funny, it wasn't till this thread that I really cared, but now I do damn it!!!  :D

Pcbs don't generally have protective coatings,they have layers. The black area covers everything. if it wasn't there there would be exposed pcb,ect and it would look unattractive..

Quote from: PCEngineHell on 05/15/2008, 07:07 PMPcbs don't generally have protective coatings

But they do. If they didn't, then all the lands would be exposed to shorts and what not. Except for the very ancient PCBs, they all have a protective coating. But in the case of the Hucard, that backside is the PCB. Whatever material it is, that is the board in which the lands and rom/ICs are attached to. Regardless of it's esthetics  :wink:

Quote from: PCEngineHell on 05/15/2008, 07:07 PMPcbs don't generally have protective coatings,they have layers. The black area covers everything. if it wasn't there there would be exposed pcb,ect and it would look unattractive..

I dunno, I kind of like the exposed PCB look.  Neoflash's flash carts look awesome, in my opinion.  Of course, it's probably more fragile than an actual hucard since everything is exposed.

Well, here's the real test of whether or not it's a true card. We need to punch holes in it and find a 35 year old computer. I mean, these HuCardWhatchamacallit's are just glorified punch cards, right?

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/15/2008, 07:27 AMWrong again.  I never said I was trying to quit smoking.  Those on the shoutbox who know me better know that every week I take breaks from smoking- with no intention of quitting.  There were other reasons beyond that that me and my girlfriend (not wife) were having a hard time last night- and if you'd like to air my personal business that I was referring to amongst friends in that regard then I must warn you- I will seriously burn you and make you look more convoluted and desperate than you're already looking- than a bunch of us on shoutbox last night already agreed you look.  I believe that the running joke last night was that I am a zionist for calling a hucard a cartridge.  If you care to be the fodder for more shoutbox humor then so be it.

Sinistron, sorry for terribly misquoting what you said in shoutbox... I certainly didn't intend it as humor.

Whatever you and your gf are going through I hope that God will bless you and make it easy for you.

The reason I brought it up is just that you seemed to get super upset about my calling you a "tool"... Nat said in previous post that anyone who takes the position that I, Shubi, Superdeadite, and others who are more on the fence, have taken (that HuCards aren't cartridges) are "doofus"(es)

So, following in the spirit of Nat's post, in which he referred to opponents as "doofus"es, I responded by calling you a tool, for being too unquestioning of the dictionary definition... by extension, it also applies to others who feel that HuCards are cartridges because of what the dictionary says...

The reason I singled you out, Sinistron, wasn't for any other reason than you happened to be the one who posted the dictionary definition and then said that your position in the argument was "most certain" after quoting the dictionary definition.

Sorry that talking about your personal situation made you more upset. It wasn't my intention at all.

An apology of sorts- good enough for now.   :D  Let's hug it out- and I won't squeeze too hard- you look breakable.   :o

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/15/2008, 11:28 PMAn apology of sorts- good enough for now.   :D  Let's hug it out- and I won't squeeze too hard- you look breakable.   :o

I'm slim and sleek like a HuCard... not fat and tubby like some clunky cartridge!!! 8)

Oh geez, anyone who took that doofus comment seriously needs to learn a thing or two about Internet humor.  :?

Quote from: nat on 05/15/2008, 11:42 PMOh geez, anyone who took that doofus comment seriously needs to learn a thing or two about Internet humor.  :?

Just as anyone who took my tool comment seriously... I was attempting to respond in the spirit of your post, Nat.

Except that you singled me out as the tool- and in bad context- as I clearly showed how vague the definition was.  Then when I pointed that out you continued to try to justify my being a tool in the unjustifiable context you were aiming at.  You changed your reasoning each time and then landed on you were using me to group everyone together because someone else called you guys doofuses.  I am not above being called a tool- I can take it and laugh heartedly if used in good context, coherence and humor.  You came with none of the three.  I was perhaps the wrong choice for your jibe.  I take on all comers and at the very least will put your reasoning and mettle to the test, all the while peppering my posts with gags that have whiskers  :D

Anyway it looks like your lot came up weak here as the cartridge kids double the card club. 

You definitely need some bigger guns in your debate club.  Even your strongest supporter Bonknuts lacks conviction and voted cartridge.   :-"

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/16/2008, 12:01 AMExcept that you singled me out as the tool- and in bad context- as I clearly showed how vague the definition was.  Then when I pointed that out you continued to try to justify my being a tool in the unjustifiable context you were aiming at.  You changed your reasoning each time and then landed on you were using me to group everyone together because someone else called you guys doofuses.  I am not above being called a tool- I can take it and laugh heartedly if used in good context, coherence and humor.  You came with none of the three.  I was perhaps the wrong choice for your jibe.  I take on all comers and at the very least will put your reasoning and mettle to the test, all the while peppering my posts with gags that have whiskers  :D

Anyway it looks like your lot came up weak here as the cartridge kids double the card club. 

You definitely need some bigger guns in your debate club.  Even your strongest supporter Bonknuts lacks conviction and voted cartridge.   :-"

What unjustifiable context did you perceive me to be aiming at?

That I was rigidly adhering to a dictionary definition of cartridge and suggested the word was unalterable.

Being the first poster to reply was why I dropped the definition- to offer the thread an introductory technical viewpoint on the word's meaning- for I knew that the thread was about semantics.  I then showed the definition to be absurd.  Lastly I said that it's clearly a cartridge and that was merely my opinion.  Clear as in clear to me. 

I really don't know how much more concise I can make it.  That's it in a nutshell- you either get it- or for some obscure reason- you don't.

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/16/2008, 12:20 AMThat I was rigidly adhering to a dictionary definition of cartridge and suggested the word was unalterable.

When I said It's clearly a hucard that was merely my opinion.  Being the first poster to reply was why I dropped the definition- to give the thread a technical viewpoint- which I then showed to be absurd.

The way I interpreted that was that your line about wankers was a joke, but that ultimately a HuCard is "most certainly" a cartridge based on the above quoted definition.

In all of our butting of heads it was the only reason you gave for why you feel that HuCards are cartridges, and most certainly was the only reason you gave in your original post for HuCards "most certainly" being cartridges.

Quote from: TurboXray on 05/15/2008, 08:38 PM

Quote from: PCEngineHell on 05/15/2008, 07:07 PMPcbs don't generally have protective coatings

But they do. If they didn't, then all the lands would be exposed to shorts and what not. Except for the very ancient PCBs, they all have a protective coating. But in the case of the Hucard, that backside is the PCB. Whatever material it is, that is the board in which the lands and rom/ICs are attached to. Regardless of it's esthetics  :wink:

I meant a protective coating covering the layers of chips,resistors,chip sockets,ect. The back side of the normal pcb has exposed solder points too,no protective coating/layer covering those.

Nat's replies were pretty much the same at first- he was pretty much like "they're cartridges".  Seemed so clear to me that an explanation wasn't even really necessary.  Anyway if you open your eyes a little more you can find by easily combing through the thread a post stating exactly why I feel it's a cartridge- and if you take that post into account yet press further that your point was more than a deluded interpretation- then you'd be insisting that I changed my story mid-stream- that I did from jumpstreet take the dictionary definition literally even though I joked about it's vagueness and only changed my true opinion on why it's a cartridge because you called me on it.  To go there would not only be peculiarly reaching at this point- but it'd be a few stops past where you'd really want to have gotten off of this bus.  I can make your trip quite unpleasant- for instance- I can say "no eating on the bus!"...  On second thought I'd have to come up with a more suitable punishment- being that you obviously haven't had a meal since Christ was a pup anyway.

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/16/2008, 12:43 AMNat's replies were pretty much the same at first- he was pretty much like "they're cartridges".  Seemed so clear to me that an explanation wasn't even really necessary.  Anyway if you open your eyes a little more you can find by easily combing through the thread a post stating exactly why I feel it's a cartridge- and if you take that post into account yet press further that your point was more than a deluded interpretation- then you'd be insisting that I changed my story mid-stream- that I did from jumpstreet take the dictionary definition literally even though I joked about it's vagueness and only changed my true opinion on why it's a cartridge because you called me on it.  To go there would not only be peculiarly reaching at this point- but it'd be a few stops past where you'd really want to have gotten off of this bus.  I can make your trip quite unpleasant- for instance- I can say "no eating on the bus!"...  On second thought I'd have to come up with a more suitable punishment- being that you obviously haven't had a meal since Christ was a pup anyway.

Well I found this...

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/15/2008, 11:26 AMyeah- I know hell's freezing over or whatever- but Zeta's 110% right.  There were photos on threads here I believe (or on other pce related sites) that I'm sure most of you have seen where a hucard is taken apart and the card is CLEARLY a case and is clearly mostly plastic- you don't even need to take it apart to see that.  Why is there even any debate?

He's also absolutely right that Sega calling their card-shaped cartridges "cards" was only about marketing- only the foolish would take it so literally.  Are you the same people who believe in blast processing?

This post came after your pic...

Though my calling you a "tool" was off base in the first place, since you didn't base your opinion on the dictionary definition, you do after all this seem to agree with me in that the dictionary definition of "cartridge" is not a good reason to consider HuCards cartridges...

Would you agree with me that those who classify HuCards as cartridges based solely on the dictionary definition are "tools"?  :-k

As for this "sealed chip" nonsense... I'm still not buying the idea that HuCards meet the aesthetic definition of a "cartridge"...

HuCard = 2 door Turbo sportscoupe
Cartridge = cadillac boat

I absolutely would agree with you that those who classify HuCards as cartridges based solely on the dictionary definition are tools- only problem is that I don't believe that anyone here is taking the definition that literally in the first place- I don't see where you picked that up from- from anyone's post here.  Necromancer even did the same thing I did- he showed how absurd one of the definitions would be if applied and then stated that it's a cartridge without giving much reason at first- because it was clear to him too.  Obviously a definition of a word comes into play in a thread about semantics- but mostly in the way in which we've come to know the definition ourselves- not in the way a textbook or all-purpose generalized definition plays out.  Perhaps being that our strong sense of conviction and feeling that the answer was so obvious made us not initially put forth our main reasoning- you falsely suspected that we had no reasoning.  If so you were wrong.

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/16/2008, 01:23 AMI absolutely would agree with you that those who classify HuCards as cartridges based solely on the dictionary definition are tools- only problem is that I don't believe that anyone here is taking the definition that literally in the first place- I don't see where you picked that up from- from anyone's post here.  Necromancer even did the same thing I did- he showed how absurd one of the definitions would be if applied and then stated that it's a cartridge without giving much reason at first- because it was clear to him to.  Obviously a definition of a word comes into play in a thread about semantics- but mostly in the way in which we've come to know the definition ourselves- not in the way a textbook or all-purpose generalized definition plays out.  Perhaps being that our strong sense of conviction and feeling that the answer was so obvious made us not initially put forth our main reasoning- you falsely suspected that we had no reasoning.  If so you were wrong.

The dictionary definition was the only reason you gave several pages into the thread so that's why I thought you had based your position on that definition, even though you made a joke about it.

I was wrong.

It's not that I felt you had no reasoning, but that I thought your reasoning was based on the dictionary definition. You said that your reasoning wasn't based on the definition, pointed out that you joked about the definition, then called me a muddle headed fool...

So I responded by showing you that in your first post you did say that it was "most certain" that HuCards were cartridges though you provided no reasoning other than the dictionary definition.

EDIT ~ and you may be right that nobody here is relying on the dictionary definition, but just in case there are any, we have them covered!

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/16/2008, 01:30 AMI was wrong.

(https://web.archive.org/web/20060617205818im_/http://www.gonemovies.com/WWW/MyWebFilms/Oorlog/ApocalypseKilgore1.jpg)

"I love the smell of I'm Wrong in the morning!   Smells like...    victory."

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/16/2008, 01:37 AM"I love the smell of I'm Wrong in the morning!   Smells like...    victory."

Haha victory in the sense that your reasoning was "most certainly" clarified, but HuCards are still not cartridges.

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/16/2008, 01:07 AM

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/16/2008, 12:43 AMNat's replies were pretty much the same at first- he was pretty much like "they're cartridges".  Seemed so clear to me that an explanation wasn't even really necessary.  Anyway if you open your eyes a little more you can find by easily combing through the thread a post stating exactly why I feel it's a cartridge- and if you take that post into account yet press further that your point was more than a deluded interpretation- then you'd be insisting that I changed my story mid-stream- that I did from jumpstreet take the dictionary definition literally even though I joked about it's vagueness and only changed my true opinion on why it's a cartridge because you called me on it.  To go there would not only be peculiarly reaching at this point- but it'd be a few stops past where you'd really want to have gotten off of this bus.  I can make your trip quite unpleasant- for instance- I can say "no eating on the bus!"...  On second thought I'd have to come up with a more suitable punishment- being that you obviously haven't had a meal since Christ was a pup anyway.

Well I found this...

Quote from: Sinistron on 05/15/2008, 11:26 AMyeah- I know hell's freezing over or whatever- but Zeta's 110% right.  There were photos on threads here I believe (or on other pce related sites) that I'm sure most of you have seen where a hucard is taken apart and the card is CLEARLY a case and is clearly mostly plastic- you don't even need to take it apart to see that.  Why is there even any debate?

He's also absolutely right that Sega calling their card-shaped cartridges "cards" was only about marketing- only the foolish would take it so literally.  Are you the same people who believe in blast processing?

This post came after your pic...

Though my calling you a "tool" was off base in the first place, since you didn't base your opinion on the dictionary definition, you do after all this seem to agree with me in that the dictionary definition of "cartridge" is not a good reason to consider HuCards cartridges...

Would you agree with me that those who classify HuCards as cartridges based solely on the dictionary definition are "tools"?  :-k

As for this "sealed chip" nonsense... I'm still not buying the idea that HuCards meet the aesthetic definition of a "cartridge"...

HuCard = 2 door Turbo sportscoupe
Cartridge = cadillac boat

What blows me away is that a guy who has as of yet shown no tech experience is now the ultimate decider of what makes a cart a cart......
And this is priceless:

QuoteHuCard = 2 door Turbo sportscoupe
Cartridge = cadillac boat

Are you referring to the Cadillac Boat Co. located in Cadillac,Michigan. If so they are not very well known to make fat, ugly, or bloated boats. Other then that Ive never actually seen any boat that resembles a Cadillac car.... I think you realized you were trying to give the argument that hucards are diff from carts,then realized your example was 2 car types so you randomly threw in the word boat.

But lets say you did mean for one to be a car,the other a boat,ok from that point of view they are still classified in the same category of being vehicles that assist travel. The only difference being cars have wheels,and boats have propellers.Also,since you even made a boat reference does this mean you have done the floating cart test? I think you should apply hard core science to this Rags. Fill your tub. Drop in a Neo Geo cart. Clearly the biggest and bulkiest of the carts. See if it sinks. If it does then its clearly not a boat,but a Cadillac car. Now take a hu-card,drop it in,does it sink? Then its clearly a car also,and if both = cars then both = carts. Repeat this test 3 times and record the results.

Have you completed the test,great,now its time for dinner. Pat yourself on the back (Rag Time),(everyone else) fire up the grill,trow on a couple of steaks and enjoy some meat med rare with some A1 and booze. See Rag,you put all the labor into proving everyone else right,and the only ones left celebrating at the end of it are the ones saying they are carts right from the start,treating themselves to steak dinners and jokes and good times. We'll all go to sleep well fed and happy knowing they are carts. You'll go to sleep bitter and hungry (for food,not revenge).

Quote from: PCEngineHell on 05/16/2008, 01:40 AMIf it does then its clearly not a boat,but a Cadillac car. Now take a hu-card,drop it in,does it sink? Then its clearly a car also,and if both = cars then both = carts. Repeat this test 3 times and record the results.

Hmmm well within the general category of "cars" there are various subtypes, such as "sedan," "sportscoupe," "compact," etc.... I used "cadillac boat" as a subtype just because I don't know the proper term for those behemoths...

As I see it, this discussion is about the general category of "video game media," and whether or not HuCards fit into the subtype "cartridge," or are a subtype all to themselves.

According to the dictionary definition so eloquently presented by Sinistron, CD-ROM disks are "most certainly" cartridges...

But as gamers we classify them as an independent subtype of "video game media."

I think HuCards belong in their own subtype, because they're aesthetically superior to cartridges.   8)

Well,there are some older cd-rom drives that use cartridges,but that does not mean the disc itself is  a cart. It s a different type of medium. It uses a laser and pits on a reflective layer and plastic. Now your becoming extremely confused. If you ate better this wouldn't happen. See the wonders of how well fed people think the clearest. Theres clearly a reason why Buddha is depicted as wise and all knowing after his starving journey to enlightenment,because hes happy and well fed. The skinny starving years of Buddha were full of confusion and inner conflict until he discovered food is good. Follow the path of Buddha,eat.

Quote from: PCEngineHell on 05/16/2008, 01:59 AMWell,there are some older cd-rom drives that use cartridges,but that does not mean the disc itself is  a cart. It s a different type of medium. It uses a laser and pits on a reflective layer and plastic. Now your becoming extremely confused. If you ate better this wouldn't happen. See the wonders of how well fed people think the clearest. Theres clearly a reason why Buddha is depicted as wise and all knowing after his starving journey to enlightenment,because hes happy and well fed. The skinny starving years of Buddha were full of confusion and inner conflict until he discovered food is good. Follow the path of Buddha,eat.

:mrgreen:

Quote from: PCEngineHell on 05/16/2008, 02:11 AMHa Rag,you edited your post. I guess you clearly came to your senses and realized theres nothing in any dictionary definition stating compact disc are cartridges,and hit that edit button double fast. Priceless. Oh well,Im well fed,happy,and now sleepy. Time for bed.

Seems according to Sinistron's definition, CD's can "most certainly" be considered cartridges...

That's not why I deleted my post... I felt as I was typing it that you were just trolling, trying to coax more responses out of me seeing as how you were making mock of my diet, which is based on my religion, more than you were discussing the topic.  [-(

Ha Rag,you edited your post. I guess you clearly came to your senses and realized theres nothing in any dictionary definition stating compact disc are cartridges,and hit that edit button double fast. Priceless. Lest be clear on this,even one of the greatest plotters and thinkers of all time,Yogi Bear,knew that food was essential to happines and overall well being.(http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a66/Amakusa666/Yogi_Bear.jpg)

Yogi Bear would never ever confuse a cd-rom disc for a cartridge,let alone state a hu-card is anything but a cartridge.
See,the only one ever able to really foil Yogis plots was Ranger Smith,and only because he had easier access to food and clearly wanted to steal it all for himself.

Quote from: rag-time4 on 05/16/2008, 02:30 AM

Quote from: PCEngineHell on 05/16/2008, 02:11 AMHa Rag,you edited your post. I guess you clearly came to your senses and realized theres nothing in any dictionary definition stating compact disc are cartridges,and hit that edit button double fast. Priceless. Oh well,Im well fed,happy,and now sleepy. Time for bed.

Seems according to Sinistron's definition, CD's can "most certainly" be considered cartridges...

That's not why I deleted my post... I felt as I was typing it that you were just trolling, trying to coax more responses out of me seeing as how you were making mock of my diet, which is based on my religion, more than you were discussing the topic.  [-(

Ha ha you quoted my removed and revised post,thus making you a double poster,silly silly man. Religion or not,anyone willing to starve themselves to confusion and unhappiness will clearly get my scorn,so you can go play that "making fun of my religion" victim harp somewhere else. I dont care what religion you practice. And for that matter Mr. Pot calling the Kettle Black,I remember not so long ago you bringing up personal matters on Sinis side as ammo for your argument here. Id say you starving yourself is just as personal as Sini smoking,ect... Cant handle the heat??? Then get out of the kitchen. You obviously don't like kitchens anyway.... [-X
Oh well,Im well fed,happy,and now sleepy. Time for bed,for serious this time.

Not a cartridge. coz it is, as its name already says, a card!

Quote from: Tatsujin on 05/16/2008, 11:50 AMNot a cartridge. coz it is, as its name already says, a card!

Wrong!!! Its a slice of bread,as the whiteness implies  :twisted:

Quote from: Tatsujin on 05/16/2008, 11:50 AMNot a cartridge. coz it is, as its name already says, a card!

That's funny.

When I was at the supermarket the other day I tried paying with my Genpei Toumaden card. The cashier just looked at me funny and started snickering. I was embarrassed and confused.

You guys told me it was a card, right?

Serously.  They're not even good 'fer playing poker.  They don't have any suits on 'em!

Even though Genpei Toumaden is clearly a 'Joker'

Quote from: nat on 05/16/2008, 12:07 PM

Quote from: Tatsujin on 05/16/2008, 11:50 AMNot a cartridge. coz it is, as its name already says, a card!

That's funny.

When I was at the supermarket the other day I tried paying with my Genpei Toumaden card. The cashier just looked at me funny and started snickering. I was embarrassed and confused.

You guys told me it was a card, right?

:lol: :shock: :o

That's hilarious. Next time I cross the border I'm going to try using Galaga '90 as my passport.

Quote from: nat on 05/16/2008, 12:07 PMWhen I was at the supermarket the other day I tried paying with my Genpei Toumaden card. The cashier just looked at me funny and started snickering. I was embarrassed and confused.

You guys told me it was a card, right?

It's a card alright, but that one in particular won't get you far. You can't pay with a valueless card, you know. Next time, try paying wih Ankoku Densetsu...worked for me.

Voted "not a cart"

To me carts have pcb that are sperate from the shell/casing and are easily removed.


If there wasn't a difference my camera would use memory cartridges.  8-[

Quote from: bust3dstr8 on 05/16/2008, 02:21 PMIf there wasn't a difference my camera would use memory cartridges.  8-[

But indeed it does :P

I'm not a huge fan of TechWeb (unsubscribing from their insidious web of email communications is a nightmare) but their TechWeb encyclopedia has some content which does not suck.

They define a cartridge as:

"A removable storage module that contains magnetic disks, optical discs, magnetic tape or memory chips. Cartridges are inserted into slots in the drive, printer or computer."

If I put on my Tool Hat and go by this definition, a HuCard quite easily meets the cartridge standard. It is a removable storage module and it contains memory chips. It is also inserted into a slot in the PC Engine, which fully qualifies as a computer (if someone starts arguing semantics with me over the term computer you get smacked with the Flaming Web Troll stick).

It's clear most of the plastic of the HuCard is simply something to hold on to, to give it form and substance, and is thus a container, holding the usually quite small memory chips that contain the game.

Frankly, I don't mind wearing the Tool Hat on this one. The TechWeb definition is quite specific and, IMO, accurate.

Well we might as well just lock 'er up after that one. Well put.

Yep,that last reply put it nicest.

"A removable storage module that contains magnetic disks, optical discs, magnetic tape or memory chips. Cartridges are inserted into slots in the drive, printer or computer."

 That's bullshit. What is that, some self appoint dictionary site? By that definition, a ram board is a cartridge. That's insane. A PCB stocked with ram is most certainly not a cartridge. Hell, I guess spoons are cartridges too. Credit cards are really credit cartridges. Shit, anything and everything is a cartridge. That proves it right there. End of discussion.

I've actually heard of RAM sticks called RAM cartridges from time to time. Not often, but occasionally.

Dunno 'bout spoons, though. I could probably stick them in a slot in a computer somewhere, but I'm not sure the sticking of the spoon in the slot would actually facilitate any of the assumed transfer of data that would be on whatever storage medium I've spooned with my spoon. Spoon is a lovely word; thank you for mentioning it.

I take the view that the word cartridge is a very general term that can indeed be used more broadly than narrowly. And yeah, it does seem like a credit card might be able to be considered a cartridge on the outside, though a HuCard meshes with the definition much more neatly.

And let's face it. Almost any definition can be abused or misread somehow. That's the joy of language; that powerful specificity, and lack thereof, of concrete meaning. And no, TechWeb is not a self-appointed dictionary site. It's a self-appointed technology site (and publication source) that also happens to host, among other things, a brief tech encyclopedia. I honestly was just poking around there for shits and giggles and discovered I approved of their definition of cartridge.

But you're welcome to borrow my Tool Hat, if you like.

A HuCard is a cartridge in the shape of a card.  End of story.  :P

Quote from: guest on 05/16/2008, 06:07 PMBut you're welcome to borrow my Tool Hat, if you like.

Ha-ha, you said tool.  I have my own tool hat, thank you; I take off my detachable penis cartridge and wrap it around my head like a turban.

I have a friend who's name is Atul. Another fellow I knew in college could not say, without giggling, "Hi, I'm Atul." And he said it often.

Quote from: TurboXray on 05/14/2008, 05:05 PMInteresting. So we are arguing semantics?

 I voted for cartridge, but technically it's not IMO. It's a card. A cartridge is a hollow case(usually two halves) that houses a PCB. A card is either glued to or molded with, a slim PCB. The share the same purpose (protecting the PCB), but are nothing alike in design.

I don't care what other folks call our little Hueys.... but I think it is a card. For the record.

Quote from: PCEngineHell on 05/16/2008, 01:40 AMOther then that Ive never actually seen any boat that resembles a Cadillac car....

Dude, my first car was a '75 Cadillac DeVille (http://photos.ebizautos.com/6046/1176795_8.jpg) (yes, that's the color I had).

I learned how to drive on that boat.

It was most certainly a boat. IIRC, the driving test in NJ required me to parallel park in a 25' spot... the DeVille was 22'+ long... and it felt WIDE too.

It was awesome sailing around Manhattan in that DeVille.

Also, for the car buffs out there, I think the year I had ('74 or '75 or '76) was the best-looking (see photo). The seemingly subtle differences between the years really makes a difference...

Technically it is a cartridge, but I like calling them "cards" (same goes for Sega Master System cards) simply because they are far less bulky than other non-card cartridges.  They are the same size as a credit card, you can collect and trade them like baseball cards, you can use them to buy alcohol (not many people under 21 collect for the TurboGrafx), you can shuffle them and play games with them and you can build pyramids out of them.

Card.

(I can't vote "not a cartridge", but I would vote "card" over "cartridge").

Quote from: PCEngineHell on 05/16/2008, 02:31 AMHa ha you quoted my removed and revised post,thus making you a double poster,silly silly man. Religion or not,anyone willing to starve themselves to confusion and unhappiness will clearly get my scorn,so you can go play that "making fun of my religion" victim harp somewhere else. I dont care what religion you practice. And for that matter Mr. Pot calling the Kettle Black,I remember not so long ago you bringing up personal matters on Sinis side as ammo for your argument here. Id say you starving yourself is just as personal as Sini smoking,ect... Cant handle the heat??? Then get out of the kitchen. You obviously don't like kitchens anyway.... [-X
Oh well,Im well fed,happy,and now sleepy. Time for bed,for serious this time.

I wasn't using Sini's personal matters as ammo, it was a misguided attempt to get him to calm down a bit. It seemed like he was getting mad so I tried to say something nice on a personal level to try to calm things down. Part of this was that the way he was talking to me was getting me upset, so I tried to say something nice and disengage from the conversation for a while.

Obviously, it's presumptuous to assume why someone else may be getting mad, so I'm sorry I did that, and I made it even worse by not even quoting what he said in shout correctly, so I'm sorry for that too.

That said, cadillac boats are not sportscars and HuCards are not cartridges! How's that for a muddled analogy? :mrgreen:

Quote from: ceti alpha on 05/16/2008, 01:02 PMThat's hilarious. Next time I cross the border I'm going to try using Galaga '90 as my passport.

better go for sure and use the X.E.V.I.O.U.S!

Haha, we're up to seven pages of this? Awesome!

Quote from: Lord Thag on 05/17/2008, 12:34 PMHaha, we're up to seven pages of this? Awesome!

Seriously! The good news is that there we have a consensus: Card. Period.

Consensus is agreement, dude. I have yet to agree upon "card". Nobody took me up on my offer to punch holes in a HuCard and see if a Univac would accept it, and until I'm convinced a HuCard would make a fine punch card I don't see how I can be won over.

Quote from: guest on 05/17/2008, 04:41 PMConsensus is agreement, dude. I have yet to agree upon "card". Nobody took me up on my offer to punch holes in a HuCard and see if a Univac would accept it, and until I'm convinced a HuCard would make a fine punch card I don't see how I can be won over.

Card. We all know it. End of story, really.

;)

apparently we don't all know it if more of us voted for cartridge  :P

You guys got some more votes in for your side- but hucards are a nutritious part of this complete breakfast is gaining on ya'  :lol:

that'd be sad as hell if you guys lose pace to that option lol

Quote from: Tatsujin on 05/17/2008, 02:11 AM

Quote from: ceti alpha on 05/16/2008, 01:02 PMThat's hilarious. Next time I cross the border I'm going to try using Galaga '90 as my passport.

better go for sure and use the X.E.V.I.O.U.S!

lol. What was I thinking?!  :mrgreen:

Quote from: Tatsujin on 05/17/2008, 02:11 AMbetter go for sure and use the X.E.V.I.O.U.S!

That is a weapon of mass awesomeness and might result in cavity probing from a TSA agent.

Quote from: nat on 05/15/2008, 10:50 AMBut.... It's a cartridge.

Quote from: TurboXray on 05/15/2008, 10:02 AMA PCB by itself *is* a card, not a cartridge.

Sure it is, if it has connector pins meant to be used to plug it into a larger unit for interface.

What about video cards for computers?  Big PCB with pins meant to plug into the motherboard slot?


Theyre based off BeeCards anyways, so its Hudson having TWO kinds of cards that rule.

hey at least were not calling them TurboChips

Quote from: guestWhat about video cards for computers?  Big PCB with pins meant to plug into the motherboard slot?

A video card is a fragile bare PCB. It has no case/cartridge. It is only what it is. A HuCard is what it has to be, plusa durable hunk of plastic. Its made for constant installation and removal.

I'm late to the party, but I've always called them cards, not cartridges. I guess I call them hucards more specifically. Technically you could call it a memory card - it looks more like a memory card than does a PS2 or N64 memory card...those things look like cartridges!

Card, definitely.

Card = it IS the entity.
Cartridge = case that CONTAINS the entity

Hmm,but wait....what then is an "empty cartridge case".  An empty case that does not contain a cartridge (so the non-contained entity is the cartridge), or a cartridge case that is empty (so the case is the cartridge, therefore the non-contained entity is NOT the cartridge)?

Still...credit card, playing card, game card.  None of them protected by, held in place by, enclosed by, a case.  No case = no cartridge, therefore:

Still going with "card"

Charlie

(if only all of life's questions were this hard!)

Quote from: SignOfZeta on 10/14/2009, 01:16 AM

Quote from: Psycho ArkhanWhat about video cards for computers?  Big PCB with pins meant to plug into the motherboard slot?

A video card is a fragile bare PCB. It has no case/cartridge. It is only what it is. A HuCard is what it has to be, plusa durable hunk of plastic. Its made for constant installation and removal.

but what about the big metal mounting point on the end of it?

Video cards arent very fragile! Ever use those sweet savage video cards?  Built like a tank


But either way, all those things that plug into ISA/PCI/AGP slots are referred to as cards

The only difference between them and a HuCard being the HuCard has a bunch of plastic so you can touch it and whatnot.   


It reminds me too of all those hardware mods for old computers.  you buy a card/board and have to put it in a cartridge yourself.   So until then its just a expansion card/board.

You cant bust a hucard into two shells and have a PCB in between.   Thats generally what a cartridge is, a shell around a thing.

Quote from: guestThe only difference between them and a HuCard being the HuCard has a bunch of plastic so you can touch it and whatnot.  

I agree, and that is precisely what the difference is between a card and a cartridge. The HuCard is...


A Card-shaped Cartridge!

 :? :-s :-k
Hmmmm.......... I have always thought of a Hucard totally differently. I think it is just natural to think of them differently. And then you have the suggestion from  NEC that they are Hucards and they are shaped like a card. But I think it is those that have them, that would see them so different than other game carts. I perceive them that way, always have. They have always fascinated me. The only gaming console where you can carry all of the games that you own for it in a little bag. You can't do that with an NES, SNES, N64, Genesis, Jaguar, or a NEO GEO system.

This has been some serious disscussion over it.

Are you serious? Are we REALLY reviving this ridiculous thread? Rather than say something abrasive and inadvertently hurtful to someone, I'll just quote myself from last year:

Quote from: natI just don't even see how there could be any debate.

I mean..... It's. a. cartridge.

Quote from: SignOfZeta on 10/14/2009, 06:40 PMA video card is a fragile bare PCB. It has no case/cartridge. It is only what it is. A HuCard is what it has to be, plusa durable hunk of plastic. Its made for constant installation and removal.


...I agree, and that is precisely what the difference is between a card and a cartridge. The HuCard is...

A Card-shaped Cartridge!

This pretty much sums it up.

As for some of the side topics involving carts in general, I don't consider arcade pcbs to be cards, although I do consider arcade carts like STV and MVS to be carts. I don't have any special rules for the number of sections for the casing or the shape or anything else. If the game is a pcb in a wooden sphere but it plugs into a console it's still a cart.

I can see how people could debate whether something like an UMD is within cart territory.

I don't take this stuff too seriously, but HuCards, Sega My Cards, MSX Bee Cards, etc are all real actual cartridge games that are also card games. One doesn't have to exclude the other.

Quote from: nat on 10/14/2009, 07:59 PMAre you serious? Are we REALLY reviving this ridiculous thread? Rather than say something abrasive and inadvertently hurtful to someone, I'll just quote myself from last year:

Quote from: natI just don't even see how there could be any debate.

I mean..... It's. a. cartridge card.

Ha, nat, you are hilarious! By invoking my own quote from last year, I have fixed your typo.

This thread rules. :)

Quote from: esteban on 05/17/2008, 03:23 PM

Quote from: Lord Thag on 05/17/2008, 12:34 PMHaha, we're up to seven pages of this? Awesome!

Seriously! The good news is that we have a consensus: Card. Period.

yeah my bad for reviving it rofl.

I didnt check t he dates, i just clicked the pasted link and replied ._.

oooops
 O:)

I think if I could split it in half and have the board in between, itd be more like the traditional cartridge.

Quote from: guest on 10/14/2009, 02:42 AMblame turbo d for me resurrecting it.

I hath summoned the great Arkhan to fight by the HuCard Allies side against the army of cartridge-wielding giant flying octopuses of the axis powers!

:lol:

Quote from: turbo D on 10/15/2009, 01:57 AM

Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 10/14/2009, 02:42 AMblame turbo d for me resurrecting it.

I hath summoned the great Arkhan to fight by the HuCard Allies side against the army of cartridge-wielding giant flying octopuses of the axis powers!

:lol:

Quote from: natI just don't even see how there could be any debate.

I mean..... It's. a. cartridge.

did you just call nat a giant FLYING octopus? O_O

 :-" :-" :-"
      :-$
 :-" :-" :-"

* swish * * swish * * swish *

Is that the ban hammer I hear?  Quick, proclaim your love for Deep Blue!  It's your only hope!

as the name itself simply implies, it's a CARD, so therefore it's not a cartridge :idea:

Quote from: Tatsujin on 10/15/2009, 06:59 AMas the name itself simply implies, it's a CARD, so therefore it's not a cartridge :idea:

O_O Logic Prevails!

I think the internet just went *facepalm*

Since I have a different account from when this thread first started, I re-voted. It that illegal? And... I changed my vote this time too ;)

Quote from: Tom on 10/15/2009, 11:54 AMSince I have a different account from when this thread first started, I re-voted. It that illegal? And... I changed my vote this time too ;)

Yes. As punishment, I will lock this thread.

Arise, controversy!

For the record, the vote tally before I reset it:
A HuCard is:
A cartridge.    - 25 (46.3%)
Not a cartridge.    - 22 (40.7%)
I don't know and have no opinion.    - 0 (0%)
A nutritious part of this complete breakfast    - 7 (13%)

Quote from: Tatsujin on 10/15/2009, 06:59 AMas the name itself simply implies, it's a CARD, so therefore it's not a cartridge :idea:

Nintendo 64 -clearly a 64-bit system.

Jaguar -the hardware and software packaging all clearly say "64-BIT".

PC Engine -how exactly do I hook it up to my PC to power it?

Turbochip -I know from the name that these are CHIPS and therefore not CARTS, but what exactly sets them apart from HuCards?

Sega My Card -whose card is it exactly, since it's not "Our Card"?

NES "Game Pak" -as the name itself simply implies, it's a PAK, so therefore it's not a cartridge

SMS "Mega Cartridges" -what is it that makes these carts "Mega"?

Genesis "16-Bit Cartridge" -what is it that makes these carts "16-bit"? I know that the hardware contains a non-fake 16-bit cpu and that that is the only true definition of 16-bitness, so is there a 16-bit cpu in every Genesis cart?

Jaguar "Interactive Multimedia Cartridge" -again, how are these carts Interactive Multimedia in a way that sets them apart from boring old vanilla carts?


 :wink: :wink: :wink:  :idea:  :wink: :wink: :wink:

Quote from: guest on 04/21/2011, 06:05 PMGenesis "16-Bit Cartridge" -what is it that makes these carts "16-bit"? I know that the hardware contains a non-fake 16-bit cpu and that that is the only true definition of 16-bitness, so is there a 16-bit cpu in every Genesis cart?

Genesis cartridges also contain 16-bit-wide ROM chips, primarily.  If a CPU accesses memory 16 bits at a time, it stands to reason that the things it accesses also have to dish out data 16 bits at a time, right?

Hence, 16-bit cartridge.

Don't try to be cute, BT; ya sound like George Carlin on an off-off-day.  :)

Quote from: ccovell on 04/21/2011, 06:15 PM

Quote from: CrackTiger on 04/21/2011, 06:05 PMGenesis "16-Bit Cartridge" -what is it that makes these carts "16-bit"? I know that the hardware contains a non-fake 16-bit cpu and that that is the only true definition of 16-bitness, so is there a 16-bit cpu in every Genesis cart?

Genesis cartridges also contain 16-bit-wide ROM chips, primarily.  If a CPU accesses memory 16 bits at a time, it stands to reason that the things it accesses also have to dish out data 16 bits at a time, right?

Hence, 16-bit cartridge.

Don't try to be cute, BT; ya sound like George Carlin on an off-off-day.  :)

There's your first mistake.  :wink:

Why was this thread resuscitated? It's a stupid argument. By the very definition of the word "cartridge," HuCards are cartridges and arguing otherwise you're basically arguing to change the definition of the word. A stupid argument indeed.

someone in the fighting street thread was reminiscing about it. I thought it would be fun to see how/if opinions have changed :)

(https://junk.tg-16.com/images/huey_timeline.jpg)

hahaha. I can't believe this thread has be given life.

its a card.  it says hucard

A nutritious part of this complete breakfast.

Quote from: turbogrfxfan on 04/22/2011, 08:53 PMits a card.  it says hucard

No it does'nt We're talking Turbografx here don't we?
So it's a Chip......Turbochip...... :-k

Quote from: TGX16 on 04/23/2011, 03:24 AM

Quote from: turbogrfxfan on 04/22/2011, 08:53 PMits a card.  it says hucard

No it does'nt We're talking Turbografx here don't we?
So it's a Chip......Turbochip...... :-k

Yes, the printed manuals/literature referred to them as a "TurboChip", but THANKFULLY they never put that god-awful term on the actual card itself. "HuCard" is prominently emblazoned on North American and Japanese cards.

I wonder why they called it a turbochip in the manual.. to make it sound more fun? and then the hucard (hudson card) was like the tech term for the card?  I think the hucard was hudsons invention so instead of just having a pattent number the came up with "hucard".  And with that, and if it was a cartridge..................wouldnt of they called it a Hucart????  so therefore its not a cartridge its a card.  lololololol :dance:  i think i figuredit out!

QuoteA HuCard is...

FUCKING AWESOME.

It's called a TurboChip in the USA because the machine is called the TurboGrafx-16 and "chip" sound "small", and the cards are small. Solved. :P

It's a Card - for the reasons Ceti cites on page one.

The Master System plays cards and cartridges, not cartridges and cartridges.

The strict definition argument has some merit, but there are enough media variations in the world of video games to warrant specific terminology.   Just like cars and trucks are both automobiles, CDs, Turbochips, and game packs are all cartridges.     

Quote from: turbogrfxfan on 04/23/2011, 11:33 AMI wonder why they called it a turbochip in the manual.. to make it sound more fun?

To make it sound too flippin' extreme.

"Turbochip" is the kind of thing one plays after a day of riding the wave, shootin' the curl, and going totally aggro on the halfpipe.

Quote from: VestCunt on 04/23/2011, 06:19 PM"Turbochip" is the kind of thing one plays after a day of riding the wave, shootin' the curl, and going totally aggro on the halfpipe.

http://youtu.be/7g0l-FApQGU

\o/

Who remembers the "THEM"/"US" promos where they were knocking the NES for having sound akin to a kiddie record player? :)

Quote from: OldRover on 04/23/2011, 06:47 PMWho remembers the "THEM"/"US" promos where they were knocking the NES for having sound akin to a kiddie record player? :)

I do. It was aired as a commercial in the NYC area.

i do :)

Quote from: VestCunt on 04/23/2011, 06:19 PMIt's a Card - for the reasons Ceti cites on page one.

The Master System plays cards and cartridges, not cartridges and cartridges.

The strict definition argument has some merit, but there are enough media variations in the world of video games to warrant specific terminology.   Just like cars and trucks are both automobiles, CDs, Turbochips, and game packs are all cartridges.     

So the PS3 doesn't read various formats of "discs" and CDs, DVDs and BluRays are all something different?

Quote from: OldRover on 04/23/2011, 06:47 PMWho remembers the "THEM"/"US" promos where they were knocking the NES for having sound akin to a kiddie record player? :)

http://youtu.be/7mF8Ab3CxE4  :mrgreen:

Yeah, that one. :)

Quote from: guest on 04/23/2011, 06:19 PMIt's a Card - for the reasons Ceti cites on page one.

The Master System plays cards and cartridges, not cartridges and cartridges.

The strict definition argument has some merit, but there are enough media variations in the world of video games to warrant specific terminology. Just like cars and trucks are both automobiles, CDs, Turbochips, and game packs are all cartridges.

By strict definition, which is really what you have to go by, HuCards are just another form of cartridge. The Master System takes two forms of cartridges; however, since there is no specific term for the 'classic' cartridge format (SMS, NES, Atari, Intellivision, Coleco), you really are forced to differentiate the two by calling one a card and the other a cartridge. SD cards are also, by strict definition, cartridges, but it's more accurate to call them cards. I feel the same way with HuCards. I think it's just more accurate to refer to them as cards as opposed to cartridges, since 'cartridge' is such a broad term.

Now, excuse me while I blow my brains out. lol

I'll agree with everything Ceti just said.

It's just the suggestion that HuCards are somehow NOT cartridges that boggles my mind. You can't argue with dictionary definitions, people.

Quote from: nat on 04/23/2011, 10:45 PMYou can't argue with dictionary definitions, people.

Of course you can... that's how dictionary definitions are changed.

QuoteHuCards are just another form of cartridge

QuoteSo the PS3 doesn't read various formats of "discs" and CDs, DVDs and BluRays are all something different?

And another example from another realm.

QuoteJust like cars and trucks are both automobiles,

I believe the point is that 'card' is a specific type of 'cartridge' (although it is actually the other way around), much like a 'cd' or 'dvd' is a specific type of optical media. And just because a more restrictive definition exists does -not- imply that it has to be used.

Quotethere are enough media variations in the world of video games to warrant specific terminology. 

QuoteBy strict definition, which is really what you have to go by...

I feel it is no more wrong to describe the pce media as cartridges than it is to describe human beings as mammals. Moreover, by the strict definition ruling, one could never call anyone 'human'; you would need to specify caucasoid, negroid, amerind, etc.
There are times when it is just awkward to list out to possible sub-classifications, and the more generic one sounds better. Or does radeon-based personal computer interface video display edge card really sound better to you than "PCI VGA Card" or even "Video Card" ?

Deal With It.
---------------------------------------------

QuoteYou can't argue with dictionary definitions, people.

If every dictionary had the same definition all the time, I might agree. But definitions differ depending on who edits the dictionary, and words change in meaning all the time. Keep in mind even dictionary editors agree that their definitions are based on "common useage" - that is, the way people use the words: not any specific meaning, but the meaning in relation to other commonly used words.

Show me a definition of "cartridge" that would exclude the HuCard medium from falling under the term.

You couldn't change the definition of "cartridge" and still have it describe all the items it currently does, but not HuCards, short of tacking "except HuCards" on the end of the definition.

cartridge:
A small modular unit designed to be inserted into a larger piece of equipment.
-OR-
A removable unit in a computer, such as an integrated circuit, containing software.

There ya have it. :D A HuCard is a cartridge. :)

But..  I thought it was a breakfast item??

Anything can be a breakfast item. It need not be exclusive to one definition only. :)

For me:

CDs, DVDs, floppys and various flat rotating media are "disks".
Small plastic enclosures containing a pcb with some sort of memory are "cartridges".
An exposed circuit board is either a "board", "circuit board", or "pcb".
Hucards, Bee Cards, Sega Cards, credit cards, business cards, or any similarly shaped thing is a "card".

We have reached a consensus: the HuCard is a card.

Next topic... :)

Quote from: CrackTiger on 04/23/2011, 08:49 PMSo the PS3 doesn't read various formats of "discs" and CDs, DVDs and BluRays are all something different?

All of the things the PS3 reads have "disc" in the name of them.

Compact Disc, Digital Video Disc, BluRay Disc, and they all fit in the same slot.

With the master system example.  Carts go in the cart slot, cards go in the card slot.

Does your PS3 have a new opening for each disc?  No.

Anyway, cartridges are just cards shoved in a plastic shell.  They're pussy versions of HuCards.  They need big protective shells when all the HuCard needs is sleek plastic.

Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 04/24/2011, 12:42 PM

Quote from: CrackTiger on 04/23/2011, 08:49 PMSo the PS3 doesn't read various formats of "discs" and CDs, DVDs and BluRays are all something different?

All of the things the PS3 reads have "disc" in the name of them.

Compact Disc, Digital Video Disc, BluRay Disc, and they all fit in the same slot.

With the master system example.  Carts go in the cart slot, cards go in the card slot.

Does your PS3 have a new opening for each disc?  No.

No, but that's my point, they are all types of discs. Gamecube discs are tiny as well, but they're still a type of disc. The 32X accepts different types of carts through the same slot like the PS3. The DS has(had) two different cart slots, for two different types of carts, just like the SMS.

The overall method that "discs" interact with hardware is the same.
The overall method that "cards" and "carts" interact with hardware is the same.
The overall method that "digital downloads interact" with hardware is the same.
The overall method that "cassette tapes" interact with hardware is the same.
The overall method that "disks" interact with hardware is the same.

SMS/SG-1000/Mark III card games coexisted with standard cart games. They had to call them something to indicate the difference. Especially since they were asking the consumer to buy an add-on to run them. Same with the MSX. They couldn't just call them "Wimpy Carts", there had to be some sort of marketing to sell them.

Famicom carts say that they're "Cassettes". NES carts say that they are "Paks". It doesn't matter what kind of marketing term they're presented with, they're still types of cartridge games.

QuoteAnyway, cartridges are just cards shoved in a plastic shell.  They're pussy versions of HuCards.  They need big protective shells when all the HuCard needs is sleek plastic.

Obviously. 8)

Quote from: esteban on 04/24/2011, 11:46 AMWe have reached a consensus: the HuCard is a card.

Next topic... :)

yup it sure is a card

Come on guys, 11 pages on that! What a waste of time  [-X OBEY!!! Go play  :twisted:

Quote from: guest on 04/24/2011, 07:17 PM....Gamecube discs are tiny as well....

They look like cookie

Quote from: BlueBMW on 04/24/2011, 09:17 PM

Quote from: guest on 04/24/2011, 07:17 PM....Gamecube discs are tiny as well....

They look like cookie

Just tried it. Not so yummy :D

 :arrow: :arrow: :arrow: :arrow: :arrow:

I'd say it meets the definition of a cartridge, its just a more compact variation.

If a Hucard is no Card anymore but a Cartridge, I wonder how peeps would get mad if they suddenly have to carry around MD, SFC or even Neo Geo sized "Cartridges" to get some cash out of an ATM.

that would be freaking awesome.

ATM: "please insert cartridge to begin"
me:(inserts Samurai Showdown)
ATM:(splits in half, spilling money like sakura petals all over the place)

I'd have to carry a backpack though.  :mrgreen:

Wait wait, how about

Its a card, because Hudson said so.

It says Card on it.  its a card.  The bee doesn't lie.

eerr... it's a card.

BeeCard, HuCARD, Sega Card etc.. they are all card media, simple, no argument.

The clue was in the name  :-s


edit: haven't read through the entire topic just in case this conclusion was already reached.

And the SNES doesn't have cartridges either then, eh?  Just Game Paks and Cassettes.

Quote from: Tatsujin on 04/25/2011, 11:58 AMIf a Hucard is no Card anymore but a Cartridge, I wonder how peeps would get mad if they suddenly have to carry around MD, SFC or even Neo Geo sized "Cartridges" to get some cash out of an ATM.

The 'pro-cartridge' people aren't saying that it's not a card as well, it's the 'pro-card' people who are saying that it's not a cartridge.

The opening post and poll aren't even asking if HuCards/Turbochips are carts or cards, only if they count as carts:

Quote from: guyjin on 05/14/2008, 12:59 PMWas watching a youtube video this morning talking about Famicom cartridges; while doing so, it was suggested that PC Engine/Turbografx HuCards are not cartridges.

Are they, or aren't they? And what, exactly, is the definition of a cartridge?

QuoteA HuCard is:

A cartridge.
Not a cartridge.    
I don't know and have no opinion.
A nutritious part of this complete breakfast

Although the "it's a card because it says so" people are ignoring the contradiction of their own logic, with various carts labeled as Paks, Cassettes, Chips, etc... the thing is that they don't even say "Card", they say "HuCard". Because Hudson had to copyright something original. What's the best way to market slim carts that are similar in size to business cards? Incorporate "card" into the made-up name.

As I said early on, if a console's cart games were pcbs encased in wooden spheres (with a connection to plug into the console), they wouldn't be "Spheres" and not "Carts". It'd be fine to call them Spheres and if they were made by Hudson, maybe they'd be stamped with a moniker like "WooSpheres". But that wouldn't mean that they weren't technically cartridge games.

What if HuCards were called "CD-ROM2 System Compact Discs"? Would they still not count as carts?

I probably should have brought this up earlier, but I have a copy of a PC Engine game from a little known format that Hudson marketed for a while after the SuperGrafx bombed. I'm surprised that I'm the only one hardcore enough to be aware of it. :roll:

They're called "HuConsoles". The one I have is Snow Bros. Game magazines at the time incorrectly listed the game as being planned for CD, because they were really just guessing. Although they function exactly the same as Cartridge, Cart, Pak, Cassette, etc, games... it's obviously a "Console" and not a "Cart", -because it says so right on it! =;

(https://web.archive.org/web/20190511122848im_/http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/huconsole2.png)
(https://web.archive.org/web/20190511122848im_/http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/huconsole1.png)
(https://web.archive.org/web/20190511122849im_/http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/huconsole3.png)

Holy Crapola!!   What is that?  How does it work?  Ive never seen anything like it.  Looks neat.

Quote from: guest on 04/25/2011, 08:02 PM(https://web.archive.org/web/20190511122849im_/http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/huconsole3.png)

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Well, seems that the inventor of the cartridge based gaming console has just recently passed away:

Cartridge Inventor Passes Away (http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/13/jerry-lawson-creator-of-cartridge-based-video-game-consoles-di/)

https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=9613.msg168458#msg168458 (https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=9613.msg168458#msg168458) *cough*

Finally, we have reached a consensus.

A card is, quite simply a card. A card is not a cartridge, for the same reason that a card is not a wildebeest--they're entirely different beasts!

(https://junk.tg-16.com/images/cartridges.jpg)

Heh, you should add a .22 round for the PCE and a .50 for the NeoGeo.

Quote from: guest on 04/26/2011, 09:38 AMHeh, you should add a .22 round for the PCE and a .50 for the NeoGeo.

If HuCards were cartridges, I would definitely do that :pcds:

Quote from: guyjin on 04/25/2011, 10:26 PMhttps://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=9613.msg168458#msg168458 (https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=9613.msg168458#msg168458) *cough*

lol Guy.

HuCards are Chips.  much like chips found in SNES or Genesis carts.  Just without all the wasted plastic shells!

Chips!  TurboChips!!

Get it?

mmmm CHIPS.

i need some.

Quote from: ceti alpha on 04/25/2011, 09:27 PMWell, seems that the inventor of the cartridge based gaming console has just recently passed away:

Cartridge Inventor Passes Away (http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/13/jerry-lawson-creator-of-cartridge-based-video-game-consoles-di/)

I had no idea that the inventor of the video game cartridge was black. Nice post Ceti!

My personal definition of cartridge relative to video games requires that there is a PCB that has a shell. A HuCard, Lynx game, DS Game or Sega Card are not a "cartridge".