Sega Master System games: Did it hurt the Turbo?

[GAUGE]

Do you think Master System games on the Turbo impacted sales and overall perception negatively?

I didn't realize it so much at the time, but it seems like there were an unusually large number of games that showed up at home on the Master System first (Vigilante, Dragon's Curse, Space Harrier, Ys - just off the top of my head).

[NecroPhile]

The games that showed up on both platforms were mostly ports of arcade and PC games where the Turbo game looked superior (as one would expect), so I don't think they made any difference, at least not negatively.

[turbogrfxfan]

 I think it made it more appealing.  better looking arcade games on a newer system.  Plus the systems new games.   ys having cd quality music and voice overs, better grafx.  I think it would of attracted people that had a nes and not a sms to get the pce.  Beccause now they could have some of the cool sega games they didnt get to play on a new system.

[GAUGE]

I was generally just curious if it made an impact with anyone. It definitely didn't for me (I actually rented Ys on the Master System first, because I didn't have all the cash for the CD system - otherwise, I didn't notice the shared titles back then).

The Turbo versions are definitely upgrades, but thought that maybe someone familiar with the SMS library at the time thought it funny/odd to see so many SMS games on the Turbo.

[Joe Redifer]

I didn't see Space Harrier on the Turbo as much of an upgrade.  It doesn't look as good because the graphics are so tiny and not very detailed, not to mention the floor looking, well, stupid.  It does move much, much better and it plays faster but that's it.  I think I even prefer the music on the SMS version better as well.

[NecroPhile]

I didn't see Space Harrier on the Turbo as much of an upgrade.  It doesn't look as good because the graphics are so tiny and not very detailed, not to mention the floor looking, well, stupid.  It does move much, much better and it plays faster but that's it.  I think I even prefer the music on the SMS version better as well.

For those who missed it the first go 'round, there's a fantastic discussion regarding Space Harrier in the comparison thread.  Read it now to discover why Joe is WRONG! 

[Tatsujin]

I didn't see Space Harrier on the Turbo as much of an upgrade.  It doesn't look as good because the graphics are so tiny and not very detailed, not to mention the floor looking, well, stupid.  It does move much, much better and it plays faster but that's it.  I think I even prefer the music on the SMS version better as well.

For those who missed it the first go 'round, there's a fantastic discussion regarding Space Harrier in the comparison thread.  Read it now to discover why Joe is WRONG! 

Lol, while reading Joes post, just the vey same idea came up. Well, there it already was.

[DesmondThe3rd]

Well, I personally think it was a mistake for NEC to release the TG-16 version of Space Harrier after Space Harrier 2 on the Genesis but it does blow away the choppy Master System edition at least.

[NecroPhile]

I actually agree that it ain't much of an upgrade over the SMS version.  It's coloring is closer to the arcade (did they even try on the SMS?), but the voices suck and where's the checkerboard?

[TurboXray]

The Master system version of Space Harrier cuts the roof of your mouth. No good.

[Tatsujin]

the missing checkerboard was the only bad thing in pce space harrier. beside of that, it was a very nice port at that time and had a fast pace, unlike the MD space harrier 2.

[DragonmasterDan]

Since the SMS failed in the US but was popular in Europe. And the TG barely got any European distribution I don't think the two systems effected each other too significantly.

[Arkhan Asylum]

Nah, it didn't hurt the Turbo much.   Most of the dual release games were better on the Turbob anyway.  Ys for TurboCD is notoriously the best classic version of the game.

and, Altered Beast on SMS was a disaster and a half.   So was Vigilante.  Vigilante for Turbo is a better play than the arcade version even!

Though, Space Harrier for the SMS is pretty damn good.  Its a beautiful SMS game.  Even if the ground is scaling kinda retarded.

All in all I would definitely say the SMS didn't have any effect on the Turbo. 

[CrackTiger]

The fact that there were SMS games first didn't hurt it all. Even if it could've turned some people off, it never happened because less people knew (or know now) what the SMS was than the TG-16.

Ys I & II to this day is one of the main draws of the Turbo/PCE and I don't think that it would've hurt Phantasy Star II if it also included a majorly enhanced port of the original. R-Type and Dragon's Curse are also favorite Turbo games of most non-hardcore Turbo players and Dynastic Hero isn't lessened by the SMS port. The fact that it Ys I - III, Valis, Altered Beast, Wizardries, Operation Wolf, Fantasy Zone, Parodius, Salamander, Gradius, Twinbee, Legend of Valkyrie, etc were also on Famicom/NES doesn't make a difference either. Even the Bonk ports didn't hurt as far as actual content, since they all felt so broken and didn't look as nice. The notion that Bonk was on other platforms might've affected the Turbo brand, but probably not much more than there being Sonic games for SMS, Game Gear and NGP.

The SMS only lessened the impact of the Genesis for me, since I'd played most SMS games up till the Genesis launched and what I most wanted out of graphics (vibrant color and shading) was weaker in the early Genesis games, which looked pale and two-toned.

Most SMS games that were also on NES already looked like a step above. Having Turbo versions that were so much more advanced only added to the next generation feel.

[Tatsujin]

Yeah, in terms of nice colors the SMS could kick some MD ass at the beginning. I still believe that Hang On looks so damn well colored on the SMS, or Aleste, Fantasy Zone II, Dragon's trap etc.

[CrackTiger]

Yeah, in terms of nice colors the SMS could kick some MD ass at the beginning. I still believe that Hang On looks so damn well colored on the SMS, or Aleste, Fantasy Zone II, Dragon's trap etc.

I still liked the look and feel of the early Genesis games, Ninja Spirit is the same way. But it made TG-16 stand out to me as a Genesis player, even with Keith Courage.

[Emerald Rocker]

All my buddies made fun of the Turbo because it had all those old Sega games that no one wanted to play (hence why they all got the NES).  Whereas the Genesis had the sweet new Sega games that EVERYONE wanted to play, like Altered Beast and Golden Axe.  But did they port those to the Turbo?  Of course not!

So yeah, I would say that the proliferation of Master System ports hurt the Turbo a lot.

[Arkhan Asylum]

The fact that there were SMS games first didn't hurt it all. Even if it could've turned some people off, it never happened because less people knew (or know now) what the SMS was than the TG-16.

Ys I & II to this day is one of the main draws of the Turbo/PCE and I don't think that it would've hurt Phantasy Star II if it also included a majorly enhanced port of the original. R-Type and Dragon's Curse are also favorite Turbo games of most non-hardcore Turbo players and Dynastic Hero isn't lessened by the SMS port. The fact that it Ys I - III, Valis, Altered Beast, Wizardries, Operation Wolf, Fantasy Zone, Parodius, Salamander, Gradius, Twinbee, Legend of Valkyrie, etc were also on Famicom/NES doesn't make a difference either. Even the Bonk ports didn't hurt as far as actual content, since they all felt so broken and didn't look as nice. The notion that Bonk was on other platforms might've affected the Turbo brand, but probably not much more than there being Sonic games for SMS, Game Gear and NGP.

The SMS only lessened the impact of the Genesis for me, since I'd played most SMS games up till the Genesis launched and what I most wanted out of graphics (vibrant color and shading) was weaker in the early Genesis games, which looked pale and two-toned.

Most SMS games that were also on NES already looked like a step above. Having Turbo versions that were so much more advanced only added to the next generation feel.

The SMS has some seriously vibrant color.  I love vibrant colored games.  It is one of the reasons why I dont like the C64 even though the RPG library demolished all the other of-the-time computers.  The SMS had really bright, vibrant games.  Even more than the NES usually (compare the double dragon releases).  The library wasn't as great. Not having a good Capcom and Konami base really sucks...

we have to remember though, some of the stuff we're mentioning was PCE only (Altered Beast, Wizardries, and stuff).  We are talking about the Turbo, so these don't properly fall into comparison.   We didn't get Wizardries, Altered Beast, Legend of valkyrie, and Parodius for example. 

So, I think what really hurt the turbo is not localizing all the severely amazing games in the PCE library.  If we had CD versions of the Llylgamyn saga (Wizardry!), holy damn.  We didn't even get a US Might and Magic 1.  The PCE CD ones pummel every other version of these games... mostly due to them being enhanced versions of ancient PC games....the classic dungeon crawler RPGs on PCE are top notch.

which brings me to my next thingy:

All my buddies made fun of the Turbo because it had all those old Sega games that no one wanted to play (hence why they all got the NES).  Whereas the Genesis had the sweet new Sega games that EVERYONE wanted to play, like Altered Beast and Golden Axe.  But did they port those to the Turbo?  Of course not!

So yeah, I would say that the proliferation of Master System ports hurt the Turbo a lot.

They ported them to the hardware....  What they didn't do, was localize them to the US.    Having Altered Beast on Turbo would have helped, I think.

same with a few other games we didn't get in the US that we should have.

[Emerald Rocker]

They ported them to the hardware....  What they didn't do, was localize them to the US.    Having Altered Beast on Turbo would have helped, I think.

same with a few other games we didn't get in the US that we should have.

You're confused.  You're probably thinking of Jyuouki and Goruden Akkusu, and they really don't count since they never came to the US.

Altered Beast and Golden Axe were hella better than those two well-documented stinkers.

[TurboXray]

TG16 might have debuted in late '89, but '90 was the real year for it. Master system? I didn't even remember it existed by 1990, let alone by 1989. If I did see games in magazines for it (reviews) like in Gamepro, VG&CE, EGM, I must have subconsciously skipped over them. I knew of one kid at school that had an SMS and we made fun of him for it. One kid in my whole grade (1988 I think, middle school). Or at least, he was the only one that admitted it. Bobby Sweetpea (or however the fuck you spell his last name).

 Little off topic:
 Funny. In High school, people didn't talk casually about games much (unless you were a vidiot; video gaming idiot and usually a nerd. Generally uncool or a geek). It was considered 'cool' to put away childish things like the NES, act 'older', getting into trouble, and chasing ass. That was 1990 and I was a freshman. Sega didn't get that 'edgy' vibe yet, so video gaming was looked at as either computer gaming (very-very nerdish) or just NES which was seen as childish (the graphics weren't 'realistic' then were 'kiddie'. But that's because they were 8bit. The themes were kiddish. Etc). Not unlike those DnD kids. Arcade games seemed to be immune during that time because there were a little more mature looking and didn't require some strange obsession to play them in all your free time. There was no stigma attached to arcade gaming. Even considered desirable because it was a hang out. Strange how the gaming culture changed so much over just those two years (from 1990 to 1992).

[Emerald Rocker]

So, I think what really hurt the turbo is not localizing all the severely amazing games in the PCE library.  If we had CD versions of the Llylgamyn saga (Wizardry!), holy damn.  We didn't even get a US Might and Magic 1.  The PCE CD ones pummel every other version of these games... mostly due to them being enhanced versions of ancient PC games....the classic dungeon crawler RPGs on PCE are top notch.

Sorry for the double post, but I missed this part!  If you think PCE Might & Magic is better than the original PC version, then you are sorely mistaken!

Here, read my review: Might & Magic PCE

It's got some colorful re-drawn artwork, but is much worse than the PC original.

[Emerald Rocker]

Funny. In High school, people didn't talk casually about games much (unless you were a vidiot; video gaming idiot and usually a nerd. Generally uncool or a geek). It was considered 'cool' to put away childish things like the NES, act 'older', getting into trouble, and chasing ass. That was 1990 and I was a freshman. Sega didn't get that 'edgy' vibe yet, so video gaming was looked at as either computer gaming (very-very nerdish) or just NES which was seen as childish

Totally bizarre story, but when I moved in 8th grade to a new state and therefore new school, I was seen as a nerd by this one guy who led his cool clique.  He didn't try to physically bully me or anything (he was "cool" but not a jock) but made fun of me for getting good grades.  So one day in gym when I'm changing back into my normal clothes, he grabs my wallet, rifles through it, and finds my NINTENDO FUN CLUB CARD.  Yeah, the lame thing I stuck in there back in 5th grade and for god knows what reason never removed from my wallet.

I was so humiliated.

But then he says: "whoa, you like Nintendo?  I always thought you were a nerd, but this is pretty cool."  We then became friends and that was the beginning of my rise to fame and glory.

[Arkhan Asylum]

Sorry for the double post, but I missed this part!  If you think PCE Might & Magic is better than the original PC version, then you are sorely mistaken!

Here, read my review: Might & Magic PCE

It's got some colorful re-drawn artwork, but is much worse than the PC original.

Presentation/quality wise its better.  Gameplay wise, its better.  It lacks customization, and yeah that definitely does suck.. but makes up for it in every other category, especially the magic portion.  The original PC one is a bit rough in that regard.  I blame the era and limitations of the release time.

I'm big into the Might and Magic games!  I like the PCE CD one alot more than the original DOS one, and I prefer it over the NES one too.  Some of it may have to do with the over-Japanification of it and with the fact that I never really used the lightning bow when I played the DOS one...

Isles of Terra ruled on PCE.  I wish World of Xeen was brought to PCE CD also.  I can only dream of how badass the tunes wouldve been.

This brings up an interesting thought.  Order of the Griffon took out character customizing too.  All of the other Goldbox games had customizing.  I wonder why they tried doing M&M 1, and OotG without it?

They ported them to the hardware....  What they didn't do, was localize them to the US.    Having Altered Beast on Turbo would have helped, I think.

same with a few other games we didn't get in the US that we should have.

You're confused.  You're probably thinking of Jyuouki and Goruden Akkusu, and they really don't count since they never came to the US.

Altered Beast and Golden Axe were hella better than those two well-documented stinkers.

 Nice.

TG16 might have debuted in late '89, but '90 was the real year for it. Master system? I didn't even remember it existed by 1990, let alone by 1989. If I did see games in magazines for it (reviews) like in Gamepro, VG&CE, EGM, I must have subconsciously skipped over them. I knew of one kid at school that had an SMS and we made fun of him for it. One kid in my whole grade (1988 I think, middle school). Or at least, he was the only one that admitted it. Bobby Sweetpea (or however the fuck you spell his last name).

I got picked on for getting a Dreamcast in 6th grade.  I even got punched in the face for it.  What is it with owning sega and getting made fun of, lol.

Little off topic:
 Funny. In High school, people didn't talk casually about games much (unless you were a vidiot; video gaming idiot and usually a nerd. Generally uncool or a geek). It was considered 'cool' to put away childish things like the NES, act 'older', getting into trouble, and chasing ass. That was 1990 and I was a freshman. Sega didn't get that 'edgy' vibe yet, so video gaming was looked at as either computer gaming (very-very nerdish) or just NES which was seen as childish (the graphics weren't 'realistic' then were 'kiddie'. But that's because they were 8bit. The themes were kiddish. Etc). Not unlike those DnD kids. Arcade games seemed to be immune during that time because there were a little more mature looking and didn't require some strange obsession to play them in all your free time. There was no stigma attached to arcade gaming. Even considered desirable because it was a hang out. Strange how the gaming culture changed so much over just those two years (from 1990 to 1992).

Everyone talked about video games when I was in school, even the jocks.  Gaming has evolved enough that almost everyone plays them now.  Jocks talked about sports, racing and FPS, all the dorks talked about RPGs, but everyone talked about stuff... and sometimes we could find middle ground and talk about fighting games in the midst of the jocks razzing the dorks/outcasts.  Pretty strange when you have an indepth conversation about street fighter with someone who just threw a bottle of gatorade at your head a few days earlier.... only to have him wing a twinkie at you hours after the conversation!

but, then we got picked on for playing D&D and stuff still...  

[Joe Redifer]

Although I love Wonder Boy 3 with a passion, one thing about it that always bothered me about it is the crappy 30fps scrolling (like Gex on the 3DO).  I'm not sure why it doesn't scroll as smooth as it could.  There certainly didn't seem to be anything special going on technically that would limit it to half the rate it normally runs at.  The TurboGrafx-16 sprite hack of Wonder Boy 3 known as Dragon's Curse scrolls smoothly at 60fps and has very pleasing music, so I prefer that version.  Hell, it also lets you save instead of writing down a clumsy password so that makes it even better.

[TheClash603]

The SMS hurt the TG16 if the buyer wanted to play some kick ass Hang-On.

Otherwise, they co-existed painfully forgotten on the shelves with no real affect on each other.

[Arkhan Asylum]

They formed a "The US sucks balls" support group, and played each others awesome games together.

They had a child, but noones seen or heard of it.

The Turbo Master Grafx-16 System

[VestCunt]

Going back to the OP - yes, but only slightly.

Nintendo's exclusive development policies did the real damage that kept popular titles away from both systems.

After that, the shared Sega ports did give the TG16 a certain weirdnesss in the eyes of Nintendo kids.  To indicate how weird non-Nintendo games were perceived at the time in my area, I remember standing in a local rental store and picking up NES Shinobi, in all its crazy Tengen packaging, and asking my friend, "what the heck is this?" He said, "oh, that's a Sega game.  Ninja Gaiden is better."

People tend to lump new things into familiar categories.  While neither system was terribly well known, the shared ports probably led some to write the Turbo off as another loser system.  The initial TG16 launch included four ports shared with the SMS:  Fantasy Zone (featuring one-time Sega mascot Opa-Opa), Space Harrier (another big-name Sega title with both 3-D and regular versions on the SMS), R-Type (a new 4-mega game heavily advertised by SMS standards), and Vigilante.  Definitely enough to give a SMS connotation to those familiar with other systems.

[Arkhan Asylum]

anyone who writes off the turbob as a loser system is a retart.

[turbogrfxfan]

anyone who writes off the turbob as a loser system is a retart.

*retard.

[Arkhan Asylum]

anyone who writes off the turbob as a loser system is a retart.

*retard.

No, retart.

I typed it just like I wanted it to be spelled.

as in

BOBBY GIT DA SHOTGUN OUT YOUR MOUTH YOU GOT DAMNED RETART.

[turbogrfxfan]

ha ha ha ah

[nat]

In my area, nobody had heard of a Sega Master System but just about everyone knew what the TurboGrafx-16 was. Fuck, I didn't even learn what a SMS was until the waning days of the 16-bit era.

Those who owned TG-16s were actually viewed as "cool" by their peers, with "cool" parents that ignored the trends of the time and bought Turbos instead of a Genesis or NES. That was me, and a handful of others. Kids all around the neighborhood wanted to come over and play TG-16 games; a welcome break from the NES and Genesis monotony they were forced to endure at home. I remember many a hot, sticky summer afternoon with neighborhood kids gathered around my TV taking turns at "Air Zonk" while I sat and played Catacomb Abyss 3D on the computer.

So to answer the initial question.... no.

[turbogrfxfan]

Here in beautiful central New Jersey everyone had either a sms or nintendo but more had a nes.  I wanted a sms but my brother talked me out with mario, and kid icarus. During christmas of 89 i is when I got my turbo.  It was hard to choose over the genny but I think I went with the better choice.  never did anyone compare the sms to the turbob.  It was all about the 16 bit war against the genny. snes wasnt even a factor imo cause it wasnt even out yet.  When I saw r-type for the turbo, I was excited to get it cause I always wanted it and the sms.

[Arkhan Asylum]

My cousin mike had a SMS.  I loved it.  The first time I played it was post sega genesis days.

My aunt and uncle had a turbo.  they're awesome. they're the cool kind of relatives. Tattoos, motorcycles, concerts, TURBO GRAFXXXXXXXXXXXXX!



I had every system growing up.  I just wanted to play tons of games and didn't give a rats ass about trends or advertising.  I was like 4!

I may sound spoiled, but the reality of it is my grandma worked at sears and got discounts and access to stuff that sold out fast....and me and my sister who shared the game systems are her only grandkids, so she hooked us up good.

and then all my aunts/uncles were teens/early 20s at the time so they'd give me stuff when they got bored with it.   hand me down NES's and Square RPGs, fuck yeah!

[Mishran]

Hey all, new member. Love the TG16 and been occasionally checking out these forums for a couple years now, but been doing it more frequent recently so I decided to join up.

On topic, I just can't believe how pathetically passionate people can be when it comes to game systems. When I was younger I saw many friendships break because of people buying that "other system". One person stops talking to another because he got the SMS instead of the NES. This person beats up that person for buying a TG16 instead of the Genesis. I too was lucky enough to have cool family and had most every console growing up. I was sort of an outcast in school though since everyone considered me a traitor to their cause. But now I'm older and only past gen system I still own is my trusty turbo collection.

BTW, where is the best place to post gaming questions about specific games here? Getting stuck on a certain level, trouble beating a boss character, etc.

[termis]

On topic, I just can't believe how pathetically passionate people can be when it comes to game systems. When I was younger I saw many friendships break because of people buying that "other system". One person stops talking to another because he got the SMS instead of the NES. This person beats up that person for buying a TG16 instead of the Genesis.

Man, that's some serious folks you hung around.  Even as a typical NES kid back in the days, I remember being fond of the few SMS owners I knew after realizing some of my favorite games had better looking ports on the SMS (i.e. Double Dragon, After Burner), and seeing Phantasy Star was mindblowing back in 1988.  I eventually "got" the SMS by getting the power base converter (still have it ).

Anyway, welcome aboard.

And back to original topic, nah, I can't see how SMS had any effect, either positive or negative on the Turbo, but I didn't get the TG until its waning years (92... or so IIRC).

[DragonmasterDan]

Man, that's some serious folks you hung around.  Even as a typical NES kid back in the days, I remember being fond of the few SMS owners I knew after realizing some of my favorite games had better looking ports on the SMS (i.e. Double Dragon, After Burner), and seeing Phantasy Star was mindblowing back in 1988.  I eventually "got" the SMS by getting the power base converter (still have it ).

Anyway, welcome aboard.

And back to original topic, nah, I can't see how SMS had any effect, either positive or negative on the Turbo, but I didn't get the TG until its waning years (92... or so IIRC).

I knew a total of two people growing up who had an SMS. One was fairly wealthy and also had a NES. The other was quite the reverse and was dirt poor and had the SMS 2 which was 50.00 (the price of a first party NES cart) in 1990.

Added in edit: Seeing the SMS was a novelty, practically no one owned them. I'd see them in stores a bit, and I remember the commercials but actually being able to play one was rare. The Atari 7800 was even less common, I remember the "More Games at about half the price" commercials vividly, and I remember seeing the system for sale at Service Merchandise and a few other stores. But I knew no one who owned the 7800.

I knew a lot of people who had TGs, but that's partly because I grew up within a nearly single digit mile radius from NEC USA headquarters who apparently did a much more thorough job of marketing the system in my area.

[turbogrfxfan]

I dunno why people keep comparing the turbo to the sms???  Maybe the east coast was different but back in the day it was either the nes or sms..    the turbob wasnt even a factor..  for me at the time.  nintendo didnt have its snes out so it was the genny and turbo in compitetion with each otheras the next generation.  imo the sms lost to nintendo and it was a decision on buying the turbo or genny.  It makes no sense for someone to think of buying a sms when the genny was in compiption w/ the turbo.  Was anyone alive when this all went down?

[DragonmasterDan]

I dunno why people keep comparing the turbo to the sms???  Maybe the east coast was different but back in the day it was either the nes or sms..    the turbob wasnt even a factor..  for me at the time.  nintendo didnt have its snes out so it was the genny and turbo in compitetion with each otheras the next generation.  imo the sms lost to nintendo and it was a decision on buying the turbo or genny.  It makes no sense for someone to think of buying a sms when the genny was in compiption w/ the turbo.  Was anyone alive when this all went down?

The SMS comparisons are due to a fair number of games shared in their library, Ys, R-Type, Space Harrier, Fantasy Zone.

The Turbo I always think of as competing with the Gen and not the SMS.

By 1989 when the Turbo came out the SMS was relegated to niche status in the US as Sega's second tier system to the Genesis.

[VestCunt]

I dunno why people keep comparing the turbo to the sms???  Maybe the east coast was different but back in the day it was either the nes or sms..    the turbob wasnt even a factor..  for me at the time.  nintendo didnt have its snes out so it was the genny and turbo in compitetion with each otheras the next generation.  imo the sms lost to nintendo and it was a decision on buying the turbo or genny.  It makes no sense for someone to think of buying a sms when the genny was in compiption w/ the turbo.

Besides the games we've talked about, the TG16 and SMS have a surprising amount in common that makes them worthy of comparison.  Unlike their competitors, they're both unusual in that they don't fit neatly into the categories of "console generations" that has been widely adopted in recent years.  Wikipedia and Gamefaqs might list them as forth- and third-generation consoles respectfully, but things aren't black and white and they co-existed for most of the same years.  The Mark III came out in '85 and the PCE followed two years later in '87, a year before the Mega Drive.  North American stores started cleaning out their SMS carts in '92 and the Turbo stock hit the bargain bins only a year later in '93.  The PCE was fairly well supported in Japan through 95, the SMS in Brazil through '97.  CD-ROM upgrades aside, it could also be argued that the capabilities of their hardware are a little closer than other "8-bit" and "16-bit" systems:  the SMS was technically superior to other third-generation systems while the TG16 was unique in the forth generation in that it had an 8-bit core processor.  The SCD games definitely have that "16-bit" feel, but, IMO, those early PCE titles seem a little closer to high-quality SMS/NES caliber. 

Anyway, the discussion hasn't been whether the SMS arose from the verge of death in '91 and stole potential Turbo buyers, but whether the reappearance of games already made popular on the SMS (lol, there's an oxymoron) "impacted sales and overall perception" of the TurboGrafx.

Was anyone alive when this all went down?

Hell yeah!

[VestCunt]

Here's a list of games.  Let me know if I missed anything.

Games released in the U.S. on both the SMS and TG16
Fantasy Zone
Wonderboy/New Adventure Island (significant differences)
R-Type
Space Harrier
Vigilante
Ys Book I

Games on both the SMS and PCE
The Addams Family (different games sharing name only)
Afterburner
Altered Beast
Chase HQ
Cloud Master
Columns
Forgotten Worlds
Ghouls and Ghosts
Golden Axe
Klax
Lemmings
Ninja Gaiden (different games sharing name only)
Operation Wolf
Outrun
Populous
Prince of Persia
Rainbow Isles
S.C.I.
Shadow of the Beast
Shinobi
Space Invaders
Street Fighter II
Strider
Thunder Blade
Wonderboy in Monsterland
Wonderboy in Monster World/Dynastic Hero
Wonderboy III/Dragon's Curse

[Arkhan Asylum]

The SMS is awesome.

I dunno why it gets alot of flak.

but it still doesnt compare to the PCE , like at all.

The same games also exist on the MSX for the most part (and others that are PCE+MSX, but not SMS), and that cant touch the PCE either.

[Tatsujin]

The SMS was the best real 8-Bit console (8-Bit league player). Sure it won't compare to the PCE, since PCE was a 16-Bit league player.

Those are two different worlds.

[CrackTiger]

Here's a list of games.  Let me know if I missed anything.

Games released in the U.S. on both the SMS and TG16
Fantasy Zone
Wonderboy/New Adventure Island
R-Type
Space Harrier
Vigilante
Ys Book I

Games on both the SMS and PCE (All regions)
The Addams Family
Afterburner
Altered Beast
Chase HQ
Cloud Master
Columns
Forgotten Worlds
Ghouls and Ghosts
Golden Axe
Klax
Lemmings
Ninja Gaiden
Operation Wolf
Outrun
Populous
Prince of Persia
Rainbow Isles
S.C.I.
Shadow of the Beast
Shinobi
Space Invaders
Street Fighter II
Strider
Thunder Blade
Wonderboy in Monsterland
Wonderboy in Monster World/Dynastic Hero
Wonderboy III/Dragon's Curse

Addams Family, New Adventure Island and Ninja Gaiden are completely different games. Not sure how the all-regions breaks down, but not all of those games were released in all regions or only the U.S. Those are still all names or brands that crossed between SMS and TG-16, but the Genesis/MD probably has more shared names/brands with the SMS, especially as far as games that are more or less supposed to be the same.

[VestCunt]

Yeah, I didn't know how to phrase it for the 2nd list referring to games that may not have been released in the same regions.  I'll edit out "all regions" and factor in your comments.

[Arkhan Asylum]

The SMS was the best real 8-Bit console (8-Bit league player). Sure it won't compare to the PCE, since PCE was a 16-Bit league player.

Those are two different worlds.

I find it hard for the SMS to beat out the NES, personally.

I blame the lack of RPG presence.

Its kind of like why I hate the N64 so much.


Visually, SMS pummeled the NES though.  Hands down.  No questions.

Imagine if Capcom had been putting Mega Man games on SMS too.  oooh I bet they'd look sexy.

[Tatsujin]

YEah, the whole soft lineup is an other story sure. But the SMS had a good arcade action line up, me likes!!

[VestCunt]

I find it hard for the SMS to beat out the NES, personally.

I blame the lack of RPG presence.

Granted the SMS had a terribly small selection of RPGs, but the ones it did have were very good.

I'd say the following games hold their own against the NES equivalents.
Phantasy Star = Final Fantasy
Ultima IV = Ultima Avatar
Golden Axe Warrior < Zelda 1
Ys > Dragon Warrior
Miracle Warriors = ?

Throw in psuedo rpgs like Lord of the Sword, Golvellius, Spellcaster, Gauntlet, Kings Quest, Populous, Dragon Crystal, and Alex Kidd High-Tech and the SMS wasn't that bad.

[Joe Redifer]

Vestcunt, Wonderboy 3 and Dragon's Curse were both released in the USA.

[Tatsujin]

Unfortunately not in Japan. Still have to get me that back bone adaptor and and Dragon's trap, Vigilante, rastan saga and choplifter. And FM here it comes