What TG16 Collectors Need Only Magical Chase?

Tatsujin · 12/19/2010, 12:21 AM

Quote from: TheClash603 on 12/18/2010, 09:58 PMI am a US Sega Saturn collector, because that was my favorite system growing up. I was a big fan of the NES as a kid, but then the 16-bit era kinda sucked to me. At that time, I was always at the arcade, and could care less about home systems. When the PSX and Saturn came out, Saturn was leaps and bounds better, and home gaming was back. To this day, this is my favorite system.

I am buying up Saturn games, and my only requests are that they are complete and cheap. A lot of my games have rental stickers on them, or UPC codes cut out. That's actually better to me, as long as they play, because I am all about getting games on the cheap. I am averaging about $5 per game for this system, which is pretty decent.

Anyway, I think US games are better, because I like the story in game and in the manuals, and I like to read what's going on. I do not read Japanese, nor do I have any intention in doing so, so US games are infinitely better for this reason. If I were able to read Japanese, I suppose I would be on your side, but I cannot. I hope that you can... or else your opinion is confusing to me.

But how could you love the Arcades but not the PSx and JPN saturn games? Because that was exactly the only place, high quality 16/32-Bit arcade games were released. The US and Europe got a shit piece of that whole cake, next to almost nothing.

SignOfZeta · 12/19/2010, 04:20 AM

Quote from: TatsujinBut how could you love the Arcades but not the PSx and JPN saturn games? Because that was exactly the only place, high quality 16/32-Bit arcade games were released.

Yeah, that's what I was going to say. The the things the Saturn was best as were...16-bit games! The one released in arcades in the late 80s to mid 90s. CPS1, CPS2, System 16, Neo Geo...all 16-bit, mostly all during the MD/SNES/SFC/PCE era. A lot of great non-ports on Saturn were also extremely 16-bit-ish in nature; Princes Crown, etc. The US releases were...Mortal Kombat and NBA Jam...some good stuff came out, but with covers like this:

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and

also

And of course, the US cases are about %60 smashed at this point. Giant fragile space hogging shit. The Lincoln Navigators of the gaming world.

Anyone who claims that they collect US games specifically because they need the manuals in English is being obtuse, probably only pretending to be obtuse. Its takes me 5 minutes to read a single sentence in Japanese but I still beat Radiant Silvergun. Am I psychic? A genius? Hell no, I just played the fucking thing. I think some people just see foreign language text and subconsciously think "Oh now, I'm not allowed in here!" and run away. If there was ever a universal language its the video game controller.

I can see paying big bucks for Panzer Dragoon Saga just because of the language, but these examples are few and far between on Saturn (pretty much like the TG-16) and by not buying JP games you are missing out on...most of the good Saturn games, I'd say. Most of the great games that did get a US releases were the Sega stuff, like VF2 and Daytona, and those are the ones that have aged the most poorly. Meanwhile Marvel Super Heroes versus Street Fighter and Astra Super Stars and DoDonPatchi and Batsugun and Pocket Fighter are off limits. Instead you have...FIFA 97...um...Criticom?

shubibiman · 12/19/2010, 07:54 AM

OMFG! I didn't know US Saturn games had shitty covers too! What's with the US artists of the time? Were they amateurs or did they think that US gamers had shitty tastes?

TheClash603 · 12/19/2010, 01:45 PM

I agree that the best games on the Saturn were 2D, but it is 2D that the previous generation of systems were unable to handle. With that said, these games were arcade only, until the Saturn was able to bring that fun home. Since the Saturn was the first system to bring the arcade feeling home, that is why it is my favorite. On top of that, the Saturn was able to bring a game home like Marvel Super Heroes and make it play a lot better than the shameful PSX version.

Cover art on the Saturn is nowhere near as bad as the TG16, and it is a great improvement over the Master System days. That point in moot to me, because the content of the games is what counts.

You are right, there are a lot of games that can be played without being able to read Japanese, but you don't get the full effect. It'd be like if a minor character in a movie didn't speak English... probably wouldn't ruin the plot, but would be annoying. I recently watched half of a George Lopez stand-up comedy special, and he would switch from English to Spanish frequently during the show. Although 98% of the jokes and punch lines were in English, I was completely taken out of the show. Maybe I am being overly dramatic, but language barrier truly hinders my enjoyment of a game.

shubibiman · 12/19/2010, 02:03 PM

To me, the Sega Saturn (jap version) is one of my favourite systems thanks to all its 2D arcade hits that were perfectly handled. I bought mine just 2 years ago and even if I played a lot of Saturn games back in the time witrh friends of mine, I just realised when I got my own Saturn how cool it really was. I don't care wether the arcade ports were basically 2D games : they're excellent and that's what matters to me.

SignOfZeta · 12/19/2010, 06:47 PM

Quote from: TheClash603You are right, there are a lot of games that can be played without being able to read Japanese, but you don't get the full effect. It'd be like if a minor character in a movie didn't speak English... probably wouldn't ruin the plot, but would be annoying. I recently watched half of a George Lopez stand-up comedy special, and he would switch from English to Spanish frequently during the show. Although 98% of the jokes and punch lines were in English, I was completely taken out of the show. Maybe I am being overly dramatic, but language barrier truly hinders my enjoyment of a game.

It just sounds like some sort of strange xenophobia to me. If you can't play a game like MSH vs SF because the endings and instruction manual (both of which I've never read in any language, despite having playing it for hundreds of hours) then you've got some psychological issues. Also...bad taste. George Lopez fucking sucks...although I don't think him putting %2 more anglo in his shit routine is going to help.

termis · 12/19/2010, 07:04 PM

Just like the folks who make a big deal out of collecting US-only titles, I find those who make a giant deal out of cover art even more strange. I mean, when you're playing the game, how does the cover art make any fucking difference whatsoever?

Basically, there's a happy medium -- I mean, I'll buy the US version if the price-premium isn't that much higher, as I'd much rather understand the manual, understand the plot background (however simple it may be), read the taunts in English after a fight in Street Fighter, etc -- these things certainly provide more enjoyment than looking at a pretty cover art. (And this is coming from someone who actually speaks moderate level of Japanese).

I mean, if the US version is ridiculously more expensive than the JP version, sure, I'll buy the Japanese version, but to deride US versions simply for shitty cover art, then going to gamefaqs for gameplay info is more ridiculous. You want good art, then go buy a good poster/painting piece instead.

SignOfZeta · 12/19/2010, 07:45 PM

There is no English version of MSH vs SF on Saturn or at least half of the good Saturn games. Mostly we're talking about library here. These people are so xenophobic that they'll avoid the best games on the system just to purge all the foreign text from their house. When people ask "Why did publishers in the 90s throw away perfectly good art and substitute shit", well, this is why. These guys want to play Japanese games, but don't want to ever be reminded that they are made by Japanese people. Perhaps these publishers really did know what they were doing and the US cover of CF2 moved more copies that it would have otherwise.

As for the language: all Capcom fighters have about a page of text in it, hardly important. I've played tens of thousands of rounds of Street Fighter in my life, easily, and trust me; reading the win quotes isn't important. The endings are even less important since you only see them in 1 player mode, which I rarely use. In KOF that might be more important...but again, there is no US version of KOF on Saturn.

The game is the most important thing, I agree, and that's sort of my point too. US collectors go out of their way to obtain the shittiest version of a game...mainly because of a manual that they'll flip through once.

When it comes to Neo Geo MVS the only things I care about are if the cart functions and it isn't a bootleg/conversion. I don't care about the kit, the sticker, the smell, etc. I just want the data.

But when it comes to something like a CD console game where i can reasonably expect to have a case and such I prefer to have the best one possible. I'm only going to look in the manual for the pictures, and those are in b/w in US manuals (if not deleted completely). The cover doesn't have much purpose, but it servers more of a purpose than a manual I'll never look at.

As for buying a poster...come on, I have something like 300 games...where am I going to put 300 posters, and where the hell would I find them?

Tatsujin · 12/19/2010, 08:33 PM

Quote from: TheClash603 on 12/19/2010, 01:45 PMI agree that the best games on the Saturn were 2D, but it is 2D that the previous generation of systems were unable to handle. With that said, these games were arcade only, until the Saturn was able to bring that fun home. Since the Saturn was the first system to bring the arcade feeling home, that is why it is my favorite. On top of that, the Saturn was able to bring a game home like Marvel Super Heroes and make it play a lot better than the shameful PSX version.

This isn't true, the PSx brought arcade into the own four walls first and much better. The saturn had a lousy starter lineup and couldn't compete against a ridge racer, which was so to speak, damn close to the arcade version for its time.

As for 2D games, so it is kinda toss-up, since most of the BeU are better on the SS, the PSx has some strength on the shoot'em up side (e.g. donpachi series, kaitei daisensou..).

Since both systems have their great exclusives, it is very necessary to own both or em.

I wouldn't want to pass on a gradius gaiden or harmful park, so I wouldn't on a Batsugun.

Tatsujin · 12/19/2010, 08:40 PM

Quote from: termis on 12/19/2010, 07:04 PMJust like the folks who make a big deal out of collecting US-only titles, I find those who make a giant deal out of cover art even more strange. I mean, when you're playing the game, how does the cover art make any fucking difference whatsoever?

With that attitude you can also play MAME and other emulators all day long, or go with that new non-physical media trend. I mean, when you're playing the game, how does anything beside the game make any fucking difference whatsoever?

As for me, I'm loving to take a nice case with nice artworks shown in its purest origin of its creation out of the shelf, taking the cart/card/cd out of it, put the game into the console and play it. For me, the packaging and everything around the game is part of the gaming as well. You "play" with your eyes first!

BlueBMW · 12/19/2010, 08:55 PM

I picked up a MUCH cheaper PCE copy of it so I'd never have to worry about tracking down a US copy. Yeah I know my level 1 background isn't as purty but oh well.

SignOfZeta · 12/19/2010, 10:29 PM

Quote from: TatsujinAs for me, I'm loving to take a nice case with nice artworks shown in its purest origin of its creation out of the shelf, taking the cart/card/cd out of it, put the game into the console and play it. For me, the packaging and everything around the game is part of the gaming as well. You "play" with your eyes first!

You said it much better than I ever could.

TheClash603 · 12/19/2010, 11:22 PM

Isn't there some charm to the "bad" (subjective) covers? That Guardian Heroes cover is really funny to me, I wouldn't want it any other way.

blueraven · 12/19/2010, 11:57 PM

I "Need" A JP copy of MC like I need a barrel of buckshot in my right ass cheek.

Gunhed/Blazing Lazers is 10 times the shooter of that pile of "hip-hop hooray super hype"

The game is worth $40 either side. If you want, buy the hype. Don't buy the game.

Chase The Chuckwagon for the 2600 would be a better investment for your kids college fund.

Tatsujin · 12/20/2010, 12:20 AM

Quote from: TheClash603 on 12/19/2010, 11:22 PMIsn't there some charm to the "bad" (subjective) covers? That Guardian Heroes cover is really funny to me, I wouldn't want it any other way.

This leads to the good old statement of "to each his own". I'm a collector from deep heart, I like to have everything as it was meant in the first place. No disimproved ugly shit from an untalented pseudo-artist, who didn't made his homework correctly back in playschool.

SignOfZeta · 12/20/2010, 12:27 AM

Quote from: TheClash603 on 12/19/2010, 11:22 PMIsn't there some charm to the "bad" (subjective) covers? That Guardian Heroes cover is really funny to me, I wouldn't want it any other way.

I totally see where you are coming from, but I guess I lack a sense of humor regarding games from this period.

I think Guardian Heroes is completely awesome (the software) so I don't want a funny/bad cover.

This cracks me up however.

Gunbird (JP Saturn cover, couldn't find PS version)

Gunbird (US Playstation)

The US version also has the art gallery removed, as well as all the endings (saves money on translation).

This is truly boggling to me because this game was published at the absolute peak of the anime/manga boom in the US. The ota-riffic original cover would have moved more units, I'm pretty sure.

exile · 12/20/2010, 02:20 AM

Yeh I'm still in the market for magical chase, but sadly I doubt I'll ever own an original as the price has risen to ludicrous levels. If I ever get one it'll be by trading tons of items I already own

termis · 12/20/2010, 02:41 AM

Quote from: Tatsujin on 12/19/2010, 08:40 PM
Quote from: termis on 12/19/2010, 07:04 PMJust like the folks who make a big deal out of collecting US-only titles, I find those who make a giant deal out of cover art even more strange. I mean, when you're playing the game, how does the cover art make any fucking difference whatsoever?
With that attitude you can also play MAME and other emulators all day long, or go with that new non-physical media trend. I mean, when you're playing the game, how does anything beside the game make any fucking difference whatsoever?

I don't disagree with the MAME statement, but owning English versions not only mean you get 100% of what's going on in game, but as you stated, whatever that came with the product -- manual, box, etc. etc. I simply choose functionality (understanding everything, even the little things) over superficial eye candy (cover art). And again, don't get me wrong, I'm by no means the "buy 100% US type" - I mix-and-match as I see fit, but I'll gladly default to US versions if (1) it's available, (2) it's not censored, (3) and price of it isn't exorbitant compared to the JP version. The cover art has exactly 0% influence on my purchasing decision. In fact, Guardian Heroes is a good example -- I don't know the value of the game these days, but by quickly browsing ebay, I'd gladly pay the $10 premium to be able to fluently read all the dialogs that goes on in the game, despite the shittier cover art.

QuoteAs for me, I'm loving to take a nice case with nice artworks shown in its purest origin of its creation out of the shelf, taking the cart/card/cd out of it, put the game into the console and play it. For me, the packaging and everything around the game is part of the gaming as well. You "play" with your eyes first!

Trust me, I DO get the whole "purest origin" thing. I choose to buy Korean-released blu-rays of Korean movies -- because it's the original release, has all the "original" stuff (things such as Directors/actor's commentary in Korean) and all that, but hey, I speak Korean. I wouldn't do the same for say, a Russian film where I wouldn't understand what the hell's going on, even if it had much prettier cover art, even if the movie was super-simple enough to understand without subtitles -- there's no denying that you just wouldn't get everything without speaking Russian or without English subs.

QuoteYou "play" with your eyes first!

I definitely disagree with this statement -- to turn it around, it seems some folks here would not only default to a JP version, but would even pay a premium for superficial eye candy even at the cost of functionality, like being able to fully understand what's being said in the game. I personally think that's retarded, but we can all agree on one thing -- "to each his own".

SignOfZeta · 12/20/2010, 02:55 AM

The "superficial eye candy" is a slippery slope of an argument. If visuals didn't matter we'd still be playing NES games. All of us care, to some extent, about "eye candy".

Regardless, I consider the art related to the game to be part of the game.

shubibiman · 12/20/2010, 03:45 AM

Quote from: Tatsujin on 12/19/2010, 08:33 PMThis isn't true, the PSx brought arcade into the own four walls first and much better.

Good point here but as I personnaly prefer 2D games, I'm much more fond of the Sega Saturn.

Quote from: SignOfZeta on 12/20/2010, 12:27 AMGunbird (US Playstation)

The US version also has the art gallery removed, as well as all the endings (saves money on translation).

What?!

Tatsujin · 12/20/2010, 04:49 AM

Quote from: shubibiman on 12/20/2010, 03:45 AM
Quote from: Tatsujin on 12/19/2010, 08:33 PMThis isn't true, the PSx brought arcade into the own four walls first and much better.
Good point here but as I personnaly prefer 2D games, I'm much more fond of the Sega Saturn.

Yeah but as I have also stated, the PSx got plenty of 2D releases, and they are in circa equal to the one of the saturn.

Both have their absolute indispensable exclusive titles and as for the games which got released on both systems its a toss-up on which they're looking better. Sometimes SS wins, sometimes PSx.

As of one of my most important reason to own a PSx is Akumajo Dracula X - gekka no yasou kyoku, which is miles better on the PSx. The saturn got some few neat extras but which never making it up to equalize the general quality of the PSx release.

Also there are plenty great exclusives on the PSx like Gradius Gaiden, Harmfull Park, R-Types etc.

As for BeU the Saturn is truly and undeniable king of these two systems, but as for shoot'em ups I would strongly recommend to get a PSx.

shubibiman · 12/20/2010, 06:21 AM

Quotebut as for shoot'em ups I would strongly recommend to get a PSx.

According to my shmupping tastes, the Sega Saturn is by far the one I need (and already own anyway), even though it doesn't have games such as R-Type Delta, Raiden or Gradius Gaiden. Anyway, I have a Playstation 2 so I can play those games so it's not a problem. Compared to those 3 PS1 exclusives, there are so many excellent shmups for the Saturn that were not released on the Sony console!

alexsduo · 03/14/2011, 05:50 AM

Some of us do still play nes games

I would love to find a MC US or JP, buteven the Japanese ones are way over $100 on ebay, and the same people are "selling" them. I don't understand why they keep listing and relisting them at 175, 199 and etc, but then I figure they must have paid like $10, and they figure some bozo in the US will pay the 175 and hence all the fees for relisting now make sense.

As far as video game collectors go, I am not sure that the Turbo Grafx stuff will go back to normal ever. The only thing I can think of that could lower the price is a Zombie (or otherwise) apocalypse where things of value are no longer valuable, and guns,food and shelter rule the day.. Or when these collectors die off, and their heirs sell their stuff at estate sales or whatever, and have no idea of the perceived value.

I have been looking for MC for quite a few years, and I passed on a couple chances because I thought the prices were ludicrous. Now, those deals seemed too good to be true.

What really gets me is a particular guy who sells on ebay... I asked him if he had MC, because of the items(s) he was selling, and he told me he had 6 or 8 copies. And when I keep harassing him, presumably to sell me a copy, he told me he was holding on to them for investment purposes.

I guess it brings a tear to my eyes, when I think of those magical chases sitting in some guys house, not being played, or coveted, but just waiting until they can fetch the highest price, almost certainly on the bay. This aggression will not stand.

TGX16 · 03/14/2011, 02:30 PM

The biggest problem (as I see it)on Ebay is not those big money BIN's...It's the fact that some fools acctuly pay them!
If no one accepted the high asking prices, price would eventuly go down but there are allways some stupid ass willing to pay top dollar for something they want.

alexsduo · 03/14/2011, 10:22 PM

Yeah, I hear that... I would probably jump on a $600 BIN loose, or something like that, just to complete my collection...

I guess we need a Magical Chase Support Hotline. So I can call in and speak with an operator how I want to spend on a copy of MC, and they can calm me down, and tell me that rent is more important, and eating what whatnot, and tell me that $300 is tops for a loose copy....

Dalder · 04/07/2011, 07:21 PM

Magical Chase is nearly impossible to be obtained yes but have to be patient and you will finally be able to obtain one. Just look around and ask friends etc. It took me a while to find one again for my collection. But I heard there is a guy who has about 17 of Magical Chases sitting in his collection. Not sure if it is TRUE or BS.

alexsduo · 04/07/2011, 10:33 PM

I am semi patient

, I am really trying to find a copy... I would love to trade like $650 of vintage games, but I doubt anyone would be interested...

Speaking of people with multiple copies of MC, there is a very person who has several copies, and frequents this very forum! I would not release this highly confidential information, out of respect.

I found someone who wanted $500, but by the time I contacted him again he sold it

I know one day someone on this forum will make me a happy dude....

NecroPhile · 04/08/2011, 09:41 AM

Quote from: alexsduo on 04/07/2011, 10:33 PMI would not release this highly confidential information, out of respect.

And with disrespect for everyone else. Bravo.

nat · 04/08/2011, 08:52 PM

Anyone hoarding more than one copy of Magical Chase is a first-class douchebag, in my humble opinion.

PunkCryborg · 04/08/2011, 08:58 PM

I keep one in my wallet all time cause it's credit card sized. Sometimes I accidentally use it at the grocery store and now it's all scuffed up on the side SILLY ME!!!1

alexsduo · 04/14/2011, 12:37 PM

I don't have disrespect for everyone else broseph. I was kinda just being a little silly. I just feel like the internets have become a place for hating, and I only want to semi-be a part of that. I mean if you were to search ebay, you would begin a while goose chase that would end after about a minute, and you would find the alleged culprit. I am hoping to have the Magical Chase gods smile upon me eventually, so I do not want to piss them off... If I had multiple copies of MC I would blackmail nerds into doing crazy shit, like programming a money stealing virus not unlike the movie Hackers or Office Space. I would then give the game after my illicit plans were laid.

machomadness · 05/12/2011, 03:35 AM

Quote from: guest on 01/23/2010, 08:54 AM
Quote from: SignOfZeta on 01/23/2010, 01:30 AMWell, this is just my theory, but basically US collectors don't have a very large selection of games to latch onto, so due to the relative scarcity and overall goodness of the game they decided via their huge, spendaholic hive mind that MC would be the thing they will pay FUCKING ANYTHING for,
Thank goodness that is your theory which i have heard over and over and......
There are some ass hat collectors out there for the US games i agree but come on man let up a little, so much hate.

maybe start a hate club zeta... this could be you (insert US TG16 Logo)

I HAVE THAT SHIRT! ZOMG! lol

Anyways, I feel the pain that you guys have. ESPECIALLY those like me who live in the Northeast, where for some damn unknown reason, retro games are hard to find and when you DO find them, the prices are ASTRONOMICAL! I mean $25 for a LOOSE copy of Friday the 13th for the NES! $300 won't get me far in a retro store around here(I'm looking at YOU Cash For Games, Turnabout, and Digital Press(although Digital Press is the cheaper of the three). But, if you go down South to where flea markets, thrift stores, and mom & pop gaming stores are the norm, $300 will get you a TRUCKLOAD of stuff! Although, now that these hillbillies are discovering computers and especially ePay, it's changing RAPIDLY!

I usually go by the Digital Press Online Rarity Guide, but those prices are no where NEAR what people are charging now......