MSR *WILL* be finished, come hell or high water... hell more likely.

Bernie · 06/22/2012, 07:28 AM

Quote from: OldRover on 06/22/2012, 02:08 AMI'm going to assume that no news is good news at this point.

But they should have at least sent some sort of update, rather than leave a paying customer in limbo. Not to mention with a project that proved so difficult. A short email letting you know everything is ok would be expected, at this point. Other than that, hopefully no news is good news with these numbskulls.

Mathius · 06/22/2012, 10:10 AM

Quote from: JoshTurboTrollX-16 on 06/19/2012, 05:23 PM
Quote from: Mathius on 06/19/2012, 05:09 PM*Gets ready champagne bottle*
The champ-pagne is reserved for the day I hold a copy of this magical adventure in my hands dear Matti.

but hey, it shouldn't be too much longer

Buy two bottles.

Keranu · 06/22/2012, 12:51 PM

Yikes, hold the champaign. Our Turbo train has derailed once again:

"Good morning Keelan,

I was out all day yesterday.

Here is the latest information I received from our replication department.
____________________________________________________________________________________________

We have tried many various ways to read these discs but the format is unusual and we keep getting uncorrectable errors on the transitions. I have to say that we can't do this format.

It seems this master is able to work on a CDR, but the way it is formatted does not allow a stamper to be made for replication. Candidly if the stamping department cannot get a stamper from the master(s) provided, it's safe to say no one can.

Let us know how you wish to proceed
___________________________________________________________________________________________

Keelan, my apologies but at this time we are not able to replicate with the masters provided.

At this point all the print is completed and ready for the discs. But we can not complete the job without the masters completing the stamping process. Please let me know if your mastering guy knows of any other options and if new masters will be sent. I will keep trying. But, after trying 3 attempts we have exhausted every means.

Please let me know how you would like to proceed.

Sincerely,
Brian"

I wish this was just a bad joke, but that's what was in my inbox today. OldMan, any ideas on this one? Unless they've updated their software, it shouldn't be impossible to replicate our format, as we already know from Insanity's production.

Arkhan if you can find your job #, I could email it to them for reference and maybe that will help. Other than that, I'm all out of ideas.

jlued686 · 06/22/2012, 01:10 PM

Yes: get the job # from Arkhan. If he got it done there, you should be able to as well. If nothing else, get Arkhan on the phone with these guys.

Arkhan Asylum · 06/22/2012, 01:16 PM

I sent Brian Rowe an email.

I don't have any of the emails handy for the project and can't find them, but I still have his email in my contacts.

NecroPhile · 06/22/2012, 01:21 PM

NOOOOOOOOOOO! Fuck these fucking fuckers right in the eye socket!

OldMan · 06/22/2012, 01:58 PM

QuoteOldMan, any ideas on this one?

A few. I'm -not- ready to give up on this, damnit....

1) Ask Brian to put the job on hold. And if can give you any more information about the error (and error code, text, -anything-) it would be appreaciated. "Uncorrectable errors" doesn't really tell us anything.
2) Snail-mail me a copy of the master. From what he's saying, it seems to be a problem with the track transitions. We can check / adjust that and re-send.

I want to know what problem they're having, and without being able to see the p-q channel transitions, you would be back to a crapshoot, as far as fixing the actual problem. Sure it might go away, but what about the next game?
Remember, it's not just MSR riding on this. We almost have PP ready, and tuoko is looking at a CD for the Karate game (hopefully) if we can get things straightened out. I really would hate for all that to fall through. This is supposed to be the PCE's year

CrackTiger · 06/22/2012, 02:33 PM

Quote from: TheOldMan on 06/22/2012, 01:58 PM
QuoteOldMan, any ideas on this one?
A few. I'm -not- ready to give up on this, damnit....

1) Ask Brian to put the job on hold. And if can give you any more information about the error (and error code, text, -anything-) it would be appreaciated. "Uncorrectable errors" doesn't really tell us anything.
2) Snail-mail me a copy of the master. From what he's saying, it seems to be a problem with the track transitions. We can check / adjust that and re-send.

I want to know what problem they're having, and without being able to see the p-q channel transitions, you would be back to a crapshoot, as far as fixing the actual problem. Sure it might go away, but what about the next game?
Remember, it's not just MSR riding on this. We almost have PP ready, and tuoko is looking at a CD for the Karate game (hopefully) if we can get things straightened out. I really would hate for all that to fall through. This is supposed to be the PCE's year

This is why I don't want to give up. I want factory pressed discs of new games and possibly translated games streaming in for the rest of my life.

Arjak · 06/22/2012, 04:01 PM

Quote from: Keranu on 06/22/2012, 12:51 PMA wall of heart-breaking text.

DAMN YOU, NATIONWIDE!!!!!!!

Mathius · 06/22/2012, 05:00 PM

Maybe Ark and Old Man can straighten this out. I am rooting for you guys!

Arkhan Asylum · 06/22/2012, 06:28 PM

Brian asked me for my project number.

lolcrap.

ParanoiaDragon · 06/22/2012, 06:52 PM

That's it, I'm just going to press Nod to go with Chang's Speedy Discount Pressing House!

OldRover · 06/22/2012, 08:40 PM

You get chicken with your order too...

RegalSin · 06/23/2012, 06:26 AM

Okay so it is time to try another presser? This sounds ridicolous. A cd is just a bunch of burn holes, consisting of trillions of microscopic 1's and 0's, right? This machine basically reads the cd, and replicates those holes.

The pressers, just have to pop it into the machine. It reads the holes, and a laser, or scribe ( or whatever level 1,2,3,4,5,6 device ) goes threw it and carve the same exact holes threw all the discs provided. Then they finish the job?

So my question is what is wrong? They have a 30,000,000 dollar machine right?
it was made to do away with the proccess of indivisual writing, and multiple format issues, right??

In fact what is the model number of the machine they are using? ( as if they will give you that answer?

Right now I would find another presser. An much more older and bolder presser. Seriously, it is basically the same as pressing a sound cd??? I think something else is going on here. What is the pre-gap???

Mishran · 06/23/2012, 07:24 AM

Quote from: guest on 06/22/2012, 06:28 PMBrian asked me for my project number.

lolcrap.

You still have copies of unsold Insanities lying around, right? Wouldn't it also be written on the box(s) that the CDs were packed in? I would assume that they would mark them, so they wouldn't misplace or lose them, with the project # or something. Try checking there? Just an idea.

_Paul · 06/23/2012, 10:18 AM

Can't they just find your project number by looking up your name/zip code or something?

I guess they do have some sort of computerised ordering system....right?

Keranu · 06/23/2012, 01:44 PM

I responded to Brian's email yesterday and Rover will be sending TheOldMan copies of the masters ASAP. We would like to find out as much info as we can from their replication software/hardware before switching companies.

OldRover · 06/23/2012, 04:13 PM

I don't understand why they went ahead and did the manuals and such ahead of time... that was a dumb move. This company has issues.

Bernie · 06/23/2012, 04:15 PM

Quote from: OldRover on 06/23/2012, 04:13 PMI don't understand why they went ahead and did the manuals and such ahead of time... that was a dumb move. This company has issues.

I wonder if they will make yall pay for that part, even if they cannot finish the project??

OldRover · 06/23/2012, 04:25 PM

Everything's already paid for, so... I dunno. We're gonna find out. It's just foolish to go through with such a thing until the stamper arrives... that's how I'd run things. I reckon they just assumed it'd not be a problem. I really hate it when people assume shit so important.

MottZilla · 06/25/2012, 08:29 PM

I really hope you can sort out these issues. It's a real shame that it is so difficult to get CD-ROMs pressed. Not just for this project but as mentioned, for future projects it would be a big boost if discs can be properly stamped. I missed Insanity when it came out, I had no idea any homebrew PCE game had ever been stamped until I stumbled on this thread. I recall Meteor Blaster DX had to be burned on CD-Rs because a company capable of producing the disc couldn't be found.

Arkhan Asylum · 06/25/2012, 09:27 PM

Quote from: MottZilla on 06/25/2012, 08:29 PMI really hope you can sort out these issues. It's a real shame that it is so difficult to get CD-ROMs pressed. Not just for this project but as mentioned, for future projects it would be a big boost if discs can be properly stamped. I missed Insanity when it came out, I had no idea any homebrew PCE game had ever been stamped until I stumbled on this thread. I recall Meteor Blaster DX had to be burned on CD-Rs because a company capable of producing the disc couldn't be found.

You didn't miss Insanity, lol.

It's still available.

Bernie · 06/25/2012, 09:41 PM

Quote from: MottZilla on 06/25/2012, 08:29 PMI really hope you can sort out these issues. It's a real shame that it is so difficult to get CD-ROMs pressed. Not just for this project but as mentioned, for future projects it would be a big boost if discs can be properly stamped. I missed Insanity when it came out, I had no idea any homebrew PCE game had ever been stamped until I stumbled on this thread. I recall Meteor Blaster DX had to be burned on CD-Rs because a company capable of producing the disc couldn't be found.

Nope, you can still order Insanity right from Arkhan.

He may even signs it, making it uber rare!!

Mathius · 06/25/2012, 10:48 PM

Quote from: Bernie on 06/25/2012, 09:41 PM
Quote from: MottZilla on 06/25/2012, 08:29 PMI really hope you can sort out these issues. It's a real shame that it is so difficult to get CD-ROMs pressed. Not just for this project but as mentioned, for future projects it would be a big boost if discs can be properly stamped. I missed Insanity when it came out, I had no idea any homebrew PCE game had ever been stamped until I stumbled on this thread. I recall Meteor Blaster DX had to be burned on CD-Rs because a company capable of producing the disc couldn't be found.
Nope, you can still order Insanity right from Arkhan. He may even signs it, making it uber rare!!

I sold my signed copy on eBay for "sex with Scarlett Johansson". That was the BIN that kept on giving.

MottZilla · 06/26/2012, 12:18 PM

Quote from: guest on 06/25/2012, 09:27 PMYou didn't miss Insanity, lol.

It's still available.

To clarify, I was not browsing PC Engine forums around the time it first came out. So I missed its release. Glad I did not miss its availability. And I hope it's just the first of many new games pressed to discs.

Arkhan Asylum · 06/26/2012, 12:20 PM

Quote from: MottZilla on 06/26/2012, 12:18 PM
Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 06/25/2012, 09:27 PMYou didn't miss Insanity, lol.

It's still available.
To clarify, I was not browsing PC Engine forums around the time it first came out. So I missed its release. Glad I did not miss its availability. And I hope it's just the first of many new games pressed to discs.

Ohhh. Ok. I get you.

Yeah, I thought you thought it was gone forever. Its not. I got a huge box of them left, lol

MottZilla · 06/26/2012, 02:48 PM

Just curious, how many units did you have to order to get it manufactured? I was surprised when I saw on I think that National Disc place a 300 unit order minimum for pressed discs in jewel cases. I'd have thought you'd have to order more units than that. I guess times have changed.

Arkhan Asylum · 06/26/2012, 03:04 PM

500.

300 is the minimum, but to get 200 more copies is like an extra hundred bucks or something.

Keranu · 06/26/2012, 04:37 PM

I've received some uplifting news!

"Hi Andrew (Arkhan),

We have found your job and are looking into what was done.

Keelan, I will keep you up to date as to what we find.

Sincerely,
Brian"

Arkhan Asylum · 06/26/2012, 05:11 PM

Worddddd up.

Lets hope they don't go "Oh, this was with our old software. You're fucked"

MottZilla · 06/27/2012, 12:34 AM

I certainly hope they figure it out. It would really suck if they can't do it anymore.

Mishran · 06/27/2012, 04:17 AM

If all else fails, we still got the AbCard...

Arkhan Asylum · 06/27/2012, 09:19 AM

yeah, but MSR would never work on an AbCard, lol .

It'd need rewritten all over the place

OldRover · 06/27/2012, 10:22 AM

I have other things planned for AbCard anyway.

Mishran · 06/27/2012, 02:08 PM

Didn't exactly mean MSR, I meant in general.

CrackTiger · 06/27/2012, 02:40 PM

AbCard games will be cool, but I'd still like to see CD games produced, even if it means doing them like Meteor Blaster DX.

ParanoiaDragon · 06/27/2012, 09:23 PM

Yeah, AbCard's will be cool, but if it was only AbCard's....that'd leave me drifting in the wind, with maybe the minor exceptions of pcm sound effects, & feedback. But there'd be no more redbook tunage, nor voice acting for me to contribute to

sirhcman · 06/27/2012, 11:35 PM

I hope this works out.. I'd hate to have thrown away money because of an inept 3rd party. Please keep us up to date.. sending positive vibes!

OldRover · 06/29/2012, 02:40 AM

PD, if you can compose, you can use Squirrel. It's just music notation. A squirrel could use Squirrel. And we all know you can compose.

RegalSin · 06/29/2012, 07:29 AM

Brain, one name I will never name my son.

Quote from: OldRover on 06/23/2012, 04:13 PMI don't understand why they went ahead and did the manuals and such ahead of time... that was a dumb move. This company has issues.

They did that to lock you in, on purpose. Apparently they are applying divide and conquer. Print everything else, first then do the writing, and say oh well, you still have to.

Maybe you get it pressed at another place, and send the unmarked discs to them, to finish the job. It sounds kinda foolish in the process, because the other presser will put the discs, inside cases, then they will take out every single CD.

Or even stupider, Get all the packaged umarked and unfinished discs sent to a new presser, and have them print. However they probably need clean cds to press. They would have to take out every single disc. That is another idea.[/quote]until the stamper arrives[/quote]
Stamper? they have everything their ?

roflmao · 06/29/2012, 07:39 AM

Replicators typically take care of the printed portions first because it takes longer for them to dry than it does to crank out the discs. From what I recall, they often times do the print on day one and the disc on day two so they can start assembling everything as the discs are being completed. I seriously doubt it was to lock you in. Many replicators don't even have the capabilities to print in-house and have to get the print done by a local 3rd party and back to them before they even start the disc pressing.

I've run into issues with replicators in the past where they had completed the print but we ran into problems with the replicator, so we had them ship the prints to another replicator. We paid replicator #1 just for the print and replicator #2 for the discs and assembly. I hope you don't have to go down that route.

Arkhan Asylum · 06/29/2012, 09:54 AM

They printed ahead of time because that's how the entire process works. It's sort of like an assembly line. CDs come down the line and merge with the packaging that was done in parallel, and CDs fall into a box.

then a gerbil car delivers them to UPS.

It's not normal to encounter all of these errors with discs. They acted in the manner that keeps their processes running smoothly.

If they waited til the CD arrived to print the stuff out, they would have wasted some time, and once the CDs are done, you'd have to wait like 2-3 extra days for printing/drying/assembling.

ParanoiaDragon · 06/29/2012, 06:06 PM

Quote from: OldRover on 06/29/2012, 02:40 AMPD, if you can compose, you can use Squirrel. It's just music notation. A squirrel could use Squirrel. And we all know you can compose.

Maybe, but I feel like I have a million times more control using my midi keyboard & ye old MMT-8 sequencer then when using squirel, especially since, even though I can compose, I don't know notes. I've never had training, I just figure everything out with my ears, & find each key on my keyboard. If I were able to use my keyboard & MMT-8 in conjunction with Squirrel, then hell yeah! Maybe someday though...

Keranu · 06/29/2012, 06:32 PM

I think as long as you can make midis, you can convert those straight to MML with Squirrel.

_Paul · 06/30/2012, 03:24 AM

Quote from: Keranu on 06/29/2012, 06:32 PMI think as long as you can make midis, you can convert those straight to MML with Squirrel.

This is true.

ParanoiaDragon · 06/30/2012, 03:42 AM

This intrigues me, though, I'd assume I'd have to go buy a new sound card to transfer the midi? My old sound card had midi inputs on it, but I never could get it working right.

Keranu · 07/01/2012, 05:40 PM

I moved the Mac war to Fighting Street.

No word from Brian yet, lets hope we'll get some meaty tidbits of info this coming week.

spenoza · 07/01/2012, 06:50 PM

Thank you, Keranu.

As for MSR, the folks who pre-ordered must be waiting with bated breath.

soop · 07/02/2012, 09:41 AM

Quote from: RegalSin on 06/29/2012, 07:29 AMBrain, one name I will never name my son.

I don't think there's any chance of any of your progeny aquiring that name.

Keranu · 07/02/2012, 06:45 PM

lol I love RegalSin, he's my favorite user!