Kickstarting translation projects?

[True Puffer]

So many projects get funded by Kickstarter today but why nobody has tried to kickstart translation projects?

If someone like NightWolve, or Aeon Genesis kickstarted english translation of Far East of Eden series or my favourites Anearth Fantasy Stories and Legend of Xanadu II i will gladly contribute 100 bucks for each translation project.  I know there is a donation option but my 100 bucks wouldn't help much but 20k or more will certainly do the trick. Actually nobody is even trying to translate those games!

Imagine if people like Johnny Millenium (pce fanatic) or Joe from Game Sack embrace the project and do a review of the game in Left in Japan or a hidden gem prior to Kickstarter i have no doubt 50k or more would be possible!

[NightWolve]

Hah, it's really funny you said this and mentioned me... It feels like a regret on my part but Kickstarter didn't really exist when I had the most energy, motivation, and wasn't burned-out from all my experiences in doing these projects thanks to the bad people I met and worked with...

Yeah, I think it'll be great for future fan translators to have the option of trying to subsidize a project with things like Kickstarter, Patreon, and/or GoFundMe. I wish I had something like that for the Felghana project because I could've raised some dough IN ADVANCE (and more safely/morally than say temp donationware/or outright selling afterwards!), maybe even set levels like 1st level of money is for the production of a fan patch, 2nd level is to buy an official license and make it all legit meaning I could also distribute the whole game as well (at least, legally, if I wanted to try to do things exactly by the book)...

You are in luck already however. If you look around these forums, you'll find both of the games you're interested in (Anearth Fantasy Stories and Legend of Xanadu II) have had fan translation work done so you might get them eventually! Here go some of the links:

https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=9456.0
https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=14331.0


Now, the concept of your thread does bring up something to consider if you DO try. It's fine for fan credo types who pride themselves on not wanting to take a dime for this kind of work, so they won't have any Paypal icons and everybody loves free so nobody has an issue with them. However, you will get viciousness from a % of the public no matter what you do if you attempt to monetize such projects by some way... This is a fact!

I'm still the subject of verbal abuse EVEN RIGHT NOW because of my Felghana patch and the one month in January 2007 when it wasn't free until it was leaked... I have psycho 4chan/GameFAQs trolls (and on the XSEED forums!) STILL butthurt, STILL just as angry about it even today!! And even then I had an army of 100% free software before it (Ys I, II, IV, Xak III, TurboRip, TocFixer, etc.) but that counted for nothing! So 10+ years of freeloading and all my other free software, but they're still hate-obsessed for that short 35 days when it came to that 2007 Felghana patch... So you could have 15 programs and patches all for free, but they would still zero in and obsess about the one that was not totally free, etc.! One can get my point by now.

Another point on that is Thomas Lipschultz used the drama with the Felghana patch and that I wanted to make a payware patch for Ys Origin as part of his pitch to his boss (Ken Berry) inside of XSEED Games to present me as a PR embarrassment and that is how he accomplished the decision for them to sneak around with my main translating partner, Jeff Nussbaum, and take the worst, unfixed version of the Felghana script on his computer, making sure it was all done without my inclusion and so that I was cheated out of any credit/compensation, selectively treating the situation not as a team effort, but as a "translator who was just sitting in the corner over there by himself with fully translated text to hand over..."

Thomas is a vicious fanatical anti-capitalist and hated that I had Paypal icons even on my website... He stated once that capitalism is the root of all evil and if it could be eliminated, the primary motive for crime would be as well, i.e. mass crime reduction, etc. So he's a true believer! And as far as he was concerned, my attempts to monetize fan translation work were heresy to the fan credo/motto, I was an "infidel" in his eyes (and to others like him who think the same) and so I was the focus of modern evil in the world! Now making one enemy on the Internet is not so bad, but when this enemy got a job at XSEED and was in a position of influence, he made sure to bring some more payback around my way by giving 100% benefit/profit to my main translation partner, etc.! One can see my point.

So yeah, these are things to consider as far as what can happen...

Anyway, my time in the spotlight is mostly over... I don't have that level of energy that I used to when I was in my late 20's/early 30's and got started on fan translation projects. While the idea of Kickstarter/Patreon/GoFundMe is quite appealing to me in principle, I'm not the guy that has the charisma, planning, and leadership to try something like that in the future. I got all the baggage and enemies from the past that would harass me as well, etc. Best I can do is spam Google Ads in my software and see some pennies come back my way because of how simple it is to do that...

Regardless, I would wish future fan translation teams luck if they can try to harness Kickstarter/Patreon/GoFundMe in some way to raise cash from generous fans that might be out there! It seems like it could be a good workaround to not selling the software after completion, raise cash in advance to produce a free patch in the end is basically the idea. I wonder if that is permissible with either of the websites... Thing is, the vicious % that I mentioned might try to go in Copyright IP protection troll mode and report the campaign to the website if it's raising money towards the cause of producing an unlicensed fan translation. Just to be spiteful, so there are still problems that could arise trying to do this... Certainly using your own website to solicit donations wouldn't be a problem, but yeah, it wouldn't be that easy, etc.

EDIT: If you look at how this site is run below, it appears they're able to do it legally for documents. It would be useful for someone that might want to try monetizing this way.

https://www.patreon.com/shmuplations?ty=h

[True Puffer]

I am glad to hear that you came to the same conclusion. Translating rpg's for free is not sustainable. Actually work for free is form of slavery.

It seems like it could be a good workaround to not selling the software after completion, raise cash in advance to produce a free patch in the end is basically the idea. I wonder if that is permissible with either of the websites...

Another option is to not release the patch to the public right away but to strike an exclusive deal with some repro cart manufacturer and sell the translated game that way until certain number of carts are sold let's say 1000 carts and then dump the free rom on the internet for the community. Usually i try the game on the emulator first but i always buy me a physical copy.

You are in luck already however. If you look around these forums, you'll find both of the games you're interested in (Anearth Fantasy Stories and Legend of Xanadu II) have had fan translation work done so you might get them eventually without donating a dime!

I have heard that some groups have worked on them but i think nobody had finished them but i will use the search function to be sure. Now it is not only translation that i want...

I am Super Famicom cart collector (and as of now PC Engine) and i am really into repro carts and many games that Aeon Genesis had translated for free i have payed for anywhere between 30 and 120 Euros (depending on the packaging) but Aeon Genesis hasn't seen a dime from it. Honestly i also never donated to him but it is not because i am a greedy a**hole but because i have only so much money for the things i want. If he had put his translated games into nice packaging i would certainly bought it from him!

I have heard about Xak III controversy from the Game Sack episode and actually this is how i found this forum. It was just a matter of time before somebody took your work that you published for free and put it in a nice packaging. You need to consider that most collectors love to pay for physical copies of the game not patches! Look at how Shenmue 3 Kickstarter took off when they introduced a physical copy of the game!

Thing is, the vicious % that I mentioned might try to go in Copyright IP troll mode and report the campaign to the website if it's raising money towards the cause of producing an unlicensed fan translation.

If this happens it would also provoke huge debattes and much publicity. It depends on how you look at it!

Certainly using your own website to solicit donations wouldn't be a problem, but yeah, it wouldn't be that easy, etc.

I think it is easier than translating japanese games in english!

P.S.

Thank you for the https://www.patreon.com/shmuplations?ty=h link!

[NecroPhile]

Translation: prettys sitting on my shelf are worth hundreds of dollars, but the translation itself is essentially worthless!

[BigusSchmuck]

Puffer great idea! I say if you want to help out in the mean time, give directly to the guys as they bust their ass off trying to get these fan translations out the door. I will say if Nightwolve or whoever else is involved doing a PCE translation and happens to have a kick starter page I would personally advertise that to everyone that I know and then some (especially if it's something like Macross Ein No Love Song). Also a sub catergory of the kickstarter page could be for donated hardware like pcs, consoles, etc would be a bonus as well..

[Otaking]

I would definitely contribute to any Kickstarters for future PC Engine fan translations.

[EmperorIng]

Wouldn't you run into legal troubles with a huge public drive like a kickstarter? I imagine companies would not like to see someone else "profiting" off of their IPs, as dead as they might be.

Patreon, or just plain "donations" would probably be a more discreet way of encouraging translation. blackoak of shmuplations (one of the coolest sites currently on the web) has a patreon that has a modest amount of subscribers.

[True Puffer]

Translation: prettys sitting on my shelf are worth hundreds of dollars, but the translation itself is essentially worthless!

Exactly! Who pays for patches anyway? I have a 3ds and every game i bought was a physical copy and i love buying video games! Same goes for retro games! What these guys need (and by guys i mean translators) is a way to the market. The most profitable market in retro gaming is collectors market dealing with tangible items. I cann't wait to put it on my shelf along with my other games. Imagine the Working Designs style packaging of Ys 4!

My wallet is opening by itself!

You are in luck already however. If you look around these forums, you'll find both of the games you're interested in (Anearth Fantasy Stories and Legend of Xanadu II) have had fan translation work done so you might get them eventually! Here go some of the links:

https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=9456.0
https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=14331.0

I have checked both links and Sams last update was in 2014! It is clear that Sam has lost all motivation for finishing both projects and it is completely understandable since he works only for the communitty (or slave labour).

Puffer great idea! I say if you want to help out in the mean time, give directly to the guys as they bust their ass off trying to get these fan translations out the door.

I will give full game price directly to anyone who can provide me Working Designs style translation and packaging of Ys IV or Legend of Xanadu II. Donations and patch purchases doesn't look good on my shelf. 

If the Kickstarter is too big for hackers and translators then make an exclusive deal with some repro cart/CD producer and sell physical copies only through them before releasing the patch to the communitty!!! The communitty usually waits couple of years before a patch is released for free anyway so let them wait 6 months longer!

In this way everybody wins at the end!

[VenomMacbeth]

Copywrite issues aside, I'd totally support this.  There should be a Working Designs type dealio where people can request what games they want translated.

[Psycho Punch]

Nice try, tobias

[xcrement5x]

Wouldn't you run into legal troubles with a huge public drive like a kickstarter? I imagine companies would not like to see someone else "profiting" off of their IPs, as dead as they might be.

Patreon, or just plain "donations" would probably be a more discreet way of encouraging translation. blackoak of shmuplations (one of the coolest sites currently on the web) has a patreon that has a modest amount of subscribers.

I agree with you here.  I think funding someone to devote X amount of time to a project regularly is a much better and sustainable method.  Plus detailed can be shared with patrons about project status, possibly encouraging transparency as to what is happening.

That shmuplations link is pretty neat indeed. 

[NecroPhile]

Nice try, tobias

Post of the day. 

[Psycho Punch]

I can't believe this isn't a troll account or just tobias in a new username. Too perfect!

[elmer]

Nice try, tobias

Hahaha, coming soon ... Tobias's announcement of the "official" PCE Memories "limited edition" Ys IV translation.

It'll look beautiful on your shelves, folks ... and at such a "reasonable" price! 

[True Puffer]

I am not Tobias by the way. I am from Vienna, Austria.

[NecroPhile]

Hahaha, coming soon ... Tobias's announcement of the "official" PCE Memories "limited edition" Ys IV translation.

It'll look beautiful on your shelves, folks ... and at such a "reasonable" price! 

So reasonable he's practically losing money on it! 

Just in case N.W. missed it, Puff the Magic Collectard is a 99 percenter.

[True Puffer]

You guys are funny but i am serious. 

[elmer]

You guys are funny but i am serious. 

I know that I really shouldn't .... but OK, I'll bite and take you seriously.

You'll be happy to hear that you'll soon get the chance to buy Ys IV in a pretty package to put on your shelf, and you won't have to waste any of your money at all by donating to the guys that actually did the translation! A double-win for you! 

You can read all about it here ...

https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=18596.0

The thread is a bit long, but I promise that if you keep reading, you'll get to the part about Ys IV.


Since you also seem to want SamIAm to get off his lazy ass and finish both "Anearth Fantasy Stories" and "Legend of Xanadu II" for your enjoyment, you can read about what has been taking all his time (and so selfishly delaying the progress on the other games) here ...

https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=19035.0

If you read far enough, it'll give you some idea of his position on repros/bootlegs.

Donations and patch purchases doesn't look good on my shelf. 

I'd like to thank you for your true understanding of why it is that the people doing the translations, and the people that originally made the games, actually put in all their hard work! 

[SamIAm]

I could spend hours replying to this. Instead, I'll keep it as short as I can.

Xanadu II and Anearth Fantasy Stories, and other projects too, are starved for hackers above all. I only translate Japanese to English. By the way, Xanadu II's English script is totally done, but the project is in limbo waiting for someone to hack that script into the game. I love Esperknight, the guy who has been the hacker so far, but his output volume isn't exactly high, and he seems to be stuck on a technical hangup.

Translation patches are basically the product of two-man hacker/translator teams. I have the endurance to work on this stuff for long hours every week, which is what it takes, but I need someone who can volley my efforts back at me. That's what makes the difference in motivation for me.

Money just isn't something I've spent time thinking about. As long as someone next to me is working hard and we're achieving real results together, that's all I need. That and a good game, of course, but there are a lot of those.

Fortune has smiled upon me recently and sent a sublime programmer my way, and together, we are about to release a translation Zeroigar on the PC-FX. I never dreamed it would look this good. I think you guys will love it.

After that, who knows what will happen...


I'm not going to lie: If I could do this work legitimately for a living, I would. However, achieving true legitimacy is incredibly difficult. I can't imagine it happening without the blessing of the people who hold the license of the original game. Supposing that they can even be tracked down, they're probably a bunch of boring old suits who would either demand impossible terms or would simply say "no".

Translations of any written work do not qualify as original works themselves; permission must be obtained from the source's author. So even free translation projects are well in the legal grey area.

Setting aside whether its really ethical to make money off of someone else's work like that, though, there's also the uncomfortable fact that you risk attracting some dubious bedfellows. I'm speaking, of course, about repro dealers. There's no question that what they do is illegal. As long as we release translation patches for free, we can thumb our noses at them (and will). But should we start accepting money for our work, it would be that much more difficult to distinguish what we do from what they do. At the very least, we would have to make a constant fuss about about only applying the patches to backups of legitimately acquired games.

My further thoughts on repros can be found here.

Certainly, if any license holder decided to threaten me with a lawsuit, you can bet that I would fold faster than Superman on laundry day. You can also be sure that the romhacking community, which has been making free translation patches for 20 years or so now, would react with hostility to someone trying to make large amounts of money from patches. It makes sense: that draws the Zeus-like giant corporations a little nearer to raining legal lightning bolts down on all of them.

Then there's the final issue: Could two people really make a decent living creating translation patches? Even if we were working full time, getting more than three translation patches done per year would not be easy. Four months salary for two professionals is a lot. A few hundred people giving an average $20 each isn't going to cut it. You'd need either more people or more money per person, and I'm not sure we could really muster that.

I appreciate it when people offer to show their gratitude by making donations, but all in all, I'm afraid that money would just poison the well.

[True Puffer]

You can read all about it here ...

https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=18596.0.

I didn't go through all 26 pages but i found few interesting points.

Xak III is my issue and the fact that this f--k is likely getting ready to press Ys IV down the road, and so my hopes of eventually doing it myself someday, the right way (partly), by contacting members that can be, taking votes, working out deals, redubbing any voice actor who refused inclusion (e.g. like BurntLasagna's brother for a soldier character I'd definitely have to redub), etc. that's all dashed as I don't think I could ever catch up to this guy's expertise in doing this and I'm far too busy to even try this year!

If he couldn't do it himself he could strike a deal with some repro manufacturer before releasing it for free.

He does it because as we have seen, there is a demand for these...https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=17720.0

Not everyone can recreate a disc like this, and sure he is making a tidy profit, but that's only because people are paying.

I love this system and I am eager to see the coming translations...however either they need to be done in secret or done without worrying about one shitty profiteer.

There always will be people who want to profit from this because there is a demand for it and instead of hiding and doing it in secret just do it yourself and give people what they want, a nice packaging and use the money to fund other projects!

My wholle point is that donations and charity are not sufficient if someone publish his work for free. Imagine if Nintendo gave their games for free and expected to make a profit from donations.

[True Puffer]

I'm not going to lie: If I could do this work legitimately for a living, I would. However, achieving true legitimacy is incredibly difficult.

Translations of any written work do not qualify as original works themselves; permission must be obtained from the source's author. So even free translation projects are well in the legal grey area.

Setting aside whether its really ethical to make money off of someone else's work like that, though, there's also the uncomfortable fact that you risk attracting some dubious bedfellows. I'm speaking, of course, about repro dealers.

The legal responsibility is on the person who sells. If you strike an exclusive deal with Tobias (before you release both patches for free) if anything happens, it's on him. He is responsible!

Xanadu II and Anearth Fantasy are the two hottest pce rpg's and i am sure they could generate 10k+ profits. You can use these funds to hire a hacker of your choice and finish the work but if you want to do it legit you can use the Kickstarter to fund the project. I am the first who will support that!

Imagine if Xanadu II and Anearth Fantasy get retro release like Pier Solar did. I didn't get a chance to even purchase Pier Solar back in the day they were all gone before i could type in my credit card information!

[BigusSchmuck]

I'm not going to lie: If I could do this work legitimately for a living, I would. However, achieving true legitimacy is incredibly difficult.

Translations of any written work do not qualify as original works themselves; permission must be obtained from the source's author. So even free translation projects are well in the legal grey area.

Setting aside whether its really ethical to make money off of someone else's work like that, though, there's also the uncomfortable fact that you risk attracting some dubious bedfellows. I'm speaking, of course, about repro dealers.

The legal responsibility is on the person who sells. If you strike an exclusive deal with Tobias (before you release both patches for free) if anything happens, it's on him. He is responsible!

Xanadu II and Anearth Fantasy are the two hottest pce rpg's and i am sure they could generate 10k+ profits. You can use these funds to hire a hacker of your choice and finish the work but if you want to do it legit you can use the Kickstarter to fund the project. I am the first who will support that!

Imagine if Xanadu II and Anearth Fantasy get retro release like Pier Solar did. I didn't get a chance to even purchase Pier Solar back in the day they were all gone before i could type in my credit card information!

Uh I don't think people want the men in black knocking on their doors.

[CrackTiger]

Holy fuck. I can't bring myself to post anything serious or sarcastic. It's been a long time since someone so aggressively oblivious has hit the ground running like this. Bravo True Collectard.

We really need to start updating the Hall of Shame.

[Psycho Punch]

The legal responsibility is on the person who sells. If you strike an exclusive deal with Tobias (before you release both patches for free) if anything happens, it's on him. He is responsible!

Xanadu II and Anearth Fantasy are the two hottest pce rpg's and i am sure they could generate 10k+ profits.

oh my god

[CrackTiger]

Exactly! Who pays for patches anyway? I have a 3ds and every game i bought was a physical copy and i love buying video games! Same goes for retro games! What these guys need (and by guys i mean translators) is a way to the market. The most profitable market in retro gaming is collectors market dealing with tangible items. I cann't wait to put it on my shelf along with my other games. Imagine the Working Designs style packaging of Ys 4!

We don't need to imagine, Vic posted the cover art for the 100% translated, yet unreleased TurboDuo Ys IV on the old Working Designs website years ago.

[True Puffer]

Bravo True Collectard.

We really need to start updating the Hall of Shame.

Thank you CrackTiger i am honoured. It's a shame Vic never released it and NightWolve never got a cut for his hard work.

[esteban]

TrueHeffer: Stop now. You have clearly NOT considered the long-term ramifications of your posts/arguments.

If you actually want to see MORE translation/dubbing projects in the future, then stop being so willfully ignorant & selfish.

Re-read Sam's post IN THIS THREAD. He explained things so clearly.

[NecroPhile]

This goober has got to be trolling.  Even accounting for English presumably not being his first language, nobody can be this stupid.

[BigusSchmuck]

This goober has got to be trolling.  Even accounting for English presumably not being his first language, nobody can be this stupid.

You would be surprised (Mad Pooper anyone?). Had a doctor call me up asking what his password was for his personal pc last week and the same doctor bitching to IT Pandora wasn't working on that same day. Even worse it was on a Mac Book, the true pc for dummies. To top it off this doc is a god damn brain surgeon. Ugh.

[CrackTiger]

This goober has got to be trolling.  Even accounting for English presumably not being his first language, nobody can be this stupid.

Although this is if anything, a watered down version of the collectards in other forums, after skimming over more of the posts it's way too conveniently tailored to recent sensitivities in particular and not just a general caricature. The posts isolated to particular threads makes it all the more obvious. But who has the energy to put in this kind work just make people's eyes roll?

[esteban]

This goober has got to be trolling.  Even accounting for English presumably not being his first language, nobody can be this stupid.

Although this is if anything, a watered down version of the collectards in other forums, after skimming over more of the posts it's way too conveniently tailored to recent sensitivities in particular and not just a general caricature. The posts isolated to particular threads makes it all the more obvious. But who has the energy to put in this kind work just make people's eyes roll?

Hahahhahahhahah. I think you are correct.

Somebody who is bored and/or has a (legendary) axe to grind:

Nulltard
Mussolini
Leonard Nimoy
Dogi
Wil Wheaton

[True Puffer]

I am looking at this from collectors viewpoint.
All we want is new Working Designs and PCE Works is like a substitute for us but unfortunately translators and hackers are still getting screwed out of their work.
The other thing is the most money in the retro community is to be found in repro physical releases and i think translators and hackers should tap this source. That's all!

[EmperorIng]

I don't know about you, but blank cds with sharpie labels look pretty nifty sitting in a modest heap on the corner of my shelf.

[esteban]

I am looking at this from collectors viewpoint.
All we want is new Working Designs and PCE Works is like a substitute for us but unfortunately translators and hackers are still getting screwed out of their work.
The other thing is the most money in the retro community is to be found in repro physical releases and i think translators and hackers should tap this source. That's all!

Again, do you want future projects to proceed?

Support the folks doing the real work.

That is all.

[CrackTiger]

I am looking at this from collectors viewpoint.
All we want is new Working Designs and PCE Works is like a substitute for us but unfortunately translators and hackers are still getting screwed out of their work.
The other thing is the most money in the retro community is to be found in repro physical releases and i think translators and hackers should tap this source. That's all!

The people doing these projects aren't looking to make a profit and many have said that if anyone sells repros of their translations they will not translate any more games. This forum/community is also predominantly of the opposite mentality of the kind of people you insist translators and bootleggers cater to and you are presenting yourself as. If you actually sample some of the popular threads around here it is very clear.

You've essentially jumped straight into the "Haul" thread on nintendoage and declared "The Sega Genesis is the best console off all time and that is why it won the 16-bit war! Let's do a kickstarter to publish some of those unreleased games! Carts with plain labels only, fuck collectors!".

That is all.

I don't know about you, but blank cds with sharpie labels look pretty nifty sitting in a modest heap on the corner of my shelf.

A collectard on atariage wasted a few pages complaining because he heard that Mysterious Song occassionally has load times as long as a popular PSX RPG. He stated that he had no intention of ever opening the game, because he had nothing to play it on, because he was never going to open his sealed TurboDuo. But he said that he had been misled and cheated.

[esteban]

A collectard on atariage wasted a few pages complaining because he heard that Mysterious Song occassionally has load times as long as a popular PSX RPG. He stated that he had no intention of ever opening the game, because he had nothing to play it on, because he was never going to open his sealed TurboDuo. But he said that he had been misled and cheated.

Surely that was a troll, because he used the most profound definition of "cheated" I have ever encountered! It simply is too divine to be a genuine post.

[CrackTiger]

A collectard on atariage wasted a few pages complaining because he heard that Mysterious Song occassionally has load times as long as a popular PSX RPG. He stated that he had no intention of ever opening the game, because he had nothing to play it on, because he was never going to open his sealed TurboDuo. But he said that he had been misled and cheated.

Surely that was a troll, because he used the most profound definition of "cheated" I have ever encountered! It simply is too divine to be a genuine post.

I'm pretty sure that he was a longtime member of that forum and other collector based ones he referenced. Plus he was not alone. Most complained about the game not coming sealed, asking "what's the point of buying a hame new if it's not sealed?" and similar complaints.

EDIT: I found the thread I was thinking of, although I remember thete were similar complaints on digitpress or something. The first complaint the sealed TurboDuo owner had after he actually had the game in hand (his third or fourth complaint in the thread), was that the game arrived undamaged. The packaging was unacceptible... yet the game arrived with "zero damage".

[Psycho Punch]

If I ever get to release a homebrew for any classic console I'm going to unseal them all before sending to buyers... or maybe put in a piece of paper shaming collectards clearly visible behind the sealing. It certainly would be funny to see a VGA graded case with something like that inside lol.

[roflmao]

If I ever get to release a homebrew for any classic console I'm going to unseal them all before sending to buyers... or maybe put in a piece of paper shaming collectards clearly visible behind the sealing. It certainly would be funny to see a VGA graded case with something like that inside lol.

Ha! I wholeheartedly support this!

[True Puffer]

If I ever get to release a homebrew for any classic console I'm going to unseal them all before sending to buyers... or maybe put in a piece of paper shaming collectards clearly visible behind the sealing. It certainly would be funny to see a VGA graded case with something like that inside lol.

You are so funny like the other guys on this forum.

There once was a repro cart manufacturer known as Timewalk games and they used to seal their repro carts before shipping them. Their customers believed that this was a special little touch from Timewalk games to impress their customers because they didn't understand that this was deliberately planned to please sealed game collectors like my friends at:

http://www.sealedgameheaven.com/

Sealed game heaven are elite conglomerate of big spenders and cream of the cream collectors. If somebody manages to impress them with the quallity of packaging, like the guys from Timewalk did, they will soon become looked upon and honoured in the retro game market and also very rich. This is something that even Tobias doesn't get it!

Here is a Mr. Big Mike, a famous collector:

Marvel at those heavenly prices and compare them to yours donations accounts:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Bahamut-Lagoon-SNES-Super-Nintendo-English-Timewalk-Games-BRAND-NEW-Square-/171864120667?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2803e65d5b

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dragon-Quest-I-II-Super-Nintendo-Timewalk-Games-Very-Rare-/261960467280?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cfe0f8350

[esteban]

TruePuffer, let's talk about any game you are currently playing—it does not have to be TG-16/PCE.

I am revisiting Bloody Wolf (TG-16), Gyruss (NES), Rampage (NES) and Pyramid Plunder (TG-16).

I don't know why I chose the NES port of Rampage to introduce my daughter to the game, other than the fact that I used to play it with my brothers when I was a kid. Ha!

I told her the arcade version is much better, but the NES port is proving to be more fun than I remember it.

[True Puffer]

I am playing Wonder Boy 5 - Monster World 3 for the first time on the Genesis and i am comparing it to the Hudson Soft port of Dynastic Hero. I hate to say it but Hudson Soft dropped the ball on this one. Character designs are less appealing and music is not good as the original version which is surprising to me. Dragon's Curse and Monster Lair versions on TG-16/PCE were so much better than the SMS/Mega Drive versions so it is really a big surprise to me.

After i finish both of those i will move on Monster World IV which is only to be found on the Mega Drive. For some reason Hudson never ported this game and it came out only in Japan. Crazy!

Now i must buy i repro copy for this game ...

[esteban]

I am playing Wonder Boy 5 - Monster World 3 for the first time on the Genesis and i am comparing it to the Hudson Soft port of Dynastic Hero. I hate to say it but Hudson Soft dropped the ball on this one. Character designs are less appealing and music is not good as the original version which is surprising to me. Dragon's Curse and Monster Lair versions on TG-16/PCE were so much better than the SMS/Mega Drive versions so it is really a big surprise to me.

After i finish both of those i will move on Monster World IV which is only to be found on the Mega Drive. For some reason Hudson never ported this game and it came out only in Japan. Crazy!

Now i must buy i repro copy for this game ...

I think a lot of folks would agree that some of the character designs are *weird* because they do not fit the typical Wonderboy style. The bosses are different.

I wish I had more than the handful of shots below:

https://www.tg-16.com/screenshot_comparisons_rpg.htm#Dynastic_Hero

(to help aid our discussion, and folks who aren't as familiar with both versions)

As you may know, the characters were redesigned so Hudson could cash-in on some trendy IP of the time (Bikkuriman anime...)

MY TAKE: I don't think one style is aesthetically superior to the other, necessarily. In fact, I could make the argument that the new sprite designs are *more charming* than the bland originals. However, to prevent any battle between us, let's agree that the aesthetics are a matter of personal preference, and I would not try to convince you that the protagonists of Dynastic Hero have more personality and a far more intriguing look than no-frills Classic WB.

Both games are great. Both soundtracks are excellent. I am glad that MD and PCE are not identical, because it is fun to have variations on a theme. The loss of a little parallax in PCE  is lame, but not major, since the game is clearly fun as hell, regardless.




AWACK'S TAKE: He's the fellow who captured all those screenshots as he compared all the games and he said that PCE eliminates parallax, PCE adds a few more colors and slightly improved animation for a boss, ...but MD vs. PCE games were essentially the same.



BONUS: You might find this somewhat interesting:

https://archives.tg-16.com/Dengeki_PC_Engine_1994_06.htm

YOU CAN MAKE THAT YOUR DESKTOP IMAGE

[BigusSchmuck]

If I ever get to release a homebrew for any classic console I'm going to unseal them all before sending to buyers... or maybe put in a piece of paper shaming collectards clearly visible behind the sealing. It certainly would be funny to see a VGA graded case with something like that inside lol.

You are so funny like the other guys on this forum.

There once was a repro cart manufacturer known as Timewalk games and they used to seal their repro carts before shipping them. Their customers believed that this was a special little touch from Timewalk games to impress their customers because they didn't understand that this was deliberately planned to please sealed game collectors like my friends at:

http://www.sealedgameheaven.com/

Sealed game heaven are elite conglomerate of big spenders and cream of the cream collectors. If somebody manages to impress them with the quallity of packaging, like the guys from Timewalk did, they will soon become looked upon and honoured in the retro game market and also very rich. This is something that even Tobias doesn't get it!

Here is a Mr. Big Mike, a famous collector:

Marvel at those heavenly prices and compare them to yours donations accounts:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Bahamut-Lagoon-SNES-Super-Nintendo-English-Timewalk-Games-BRAND-NEW-Square-/171864120667?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2803e65d5b

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dragon-Quest-I-II-Super-Nintendo-Timewalk-Games-Very-Rare-/261960467280?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cfe0f8350

Marvel, more like disgusted. I'm pretty sure the fan translators that translated those games aren't receiving a single penny from those repros and if anything (as others have stated) this deters these fan translator groups from doing anymore.

[True Puffer]

Marvel, more like disgusted. I'm pretty sure the fan translators that translated those games aren't receiving a single penny from those repros and if anything (as others have stated) this deters these fan translator groups from doing anymore.

My thoughts exactly!!!

I have offered few solutions for this problem in this thread so i will highlight them now:

1) Kickstart your translation project and use the money to obtain legal licence to publish the game. Proclaim that you are the New Working Designs and include (if possible) physical copies of the game and you will get all the collectors behind you which are the most important group when it comes to financing your Kickstarter campaign. They are the main purchasing power, the big spenders!

2) If the Kickstarter option is too big of undertaking for some of you then don't release translated patch to the public for free but make a deal with some repro cart manufacturer and they can sell all the physical copies exlcusively through their online store.

a) You can ask for percentage and collect your money that way;

b) or you can ask for a down payment in advance before you hand over the patch

3) Become a repro seller and do everything yourself!

4) Release a patch for free to everybody but don't complain when you get ripped off because you will!

[True Puffer]

Both games are great. Both soundtracks are excellent. I am glad that MD and PCE are not identical, because it is fun to have variations on a theme.

This is a good argument. I would say thank god for Mega Drive version.

The loss of a little parallax in PCE  is lame, but not major, since the game is clearly fun as hell, regardless.

This is something i don't get it, Super Air Zonk had the same problem. Air Zonk had beatifull parallax scrolling and CD version almost none! Was it developed by different studio just like Dynastic Hero?

[esteban]

Both games are great. Both soundtracks are excellent. I am glad that MD and PCE are not identical, because it is fun to have variations on a theme.

This is a good argument. I would say thank god for Mega Drive version.

The loss of a little parallax in PCE  is lame, but not major, since the game is clearly fun as hell, regardless.

This is something i don't get it, Super Air Zonk had the same problem. Air Zonk had beatifull parallax scrolling and CD version almost none! Was it developed by different studio just like Dynastic Hero?

Sadly, I think it might have been time/budget constraints...which is lame, of course...

[CrackTiger]

Air Zonk was done by the Coryoon team. They were brought in to just drop RED's designs and assets into the Ciryoon engine. Super Air Zonk was made by someone else.

I believe that Westone handled all of their Wonderboy/Monster World ports to PC Engine. Unfortunately, they were lazy when it came to programming in parallax. Blood Gear has a few examples, so they were capable of lines scrolls at least. But there are too many possible reasons why some developers dropped the ball when it cane to parallax in PCE games, so there's no point in speculating. The hundreds of PCE games that do have parallax show that there was no excuse though.

Many people just assume that Westone was a Sega developer who just happened to let Hudson buy the rights to some of their games, but they were actually a 2nd party developer for Hudson as much as Sega and made more 16-bit console games for Hudson than they did for Sega.

[True Puffer]

There is an interview with the creator of Wonder Boy series Ryuichi Nishizawa in which he talks about the relationship between Hudson and Westone.

http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/wonderboy/wonderboy-interview.htm

and here is the second interview (English translation is halfway down the page):

http://www.outcast.it/intervistamonsterworld/

[EmperorIng]

Proclaim that you are the New Working Designs

Bring on the fart humor and pop-culture references, NightWolve.