Game Sack

[Psycho Punch]

All RPGs are clones of Ultima, all stealth games are clones of Castle Wolfenstein, all sports games are clones of Pong, all first person shooters are clones of Faceball, all 3D games are clones of Battlezone.

[ClodBusted]

All humans are clones of Adam.

[esteban]

All humans are clones of Adam.

Coleco Adam.

[TR0N]

[MNKyDeth]

Great Episode, I am curious if they were limiting themselves to 8 and 16 bit consoles though?

I mean, most of the games that were cd based in this generation had incredible music I thought. But when you go from some poor 8bit Nes stuff (granted some is good) to a full featured redbook cd-audio it's really hard to go back.

But then I just end right back at Y's 1&2 because this is one of the first games on CD I ever heard and I was immediately blown away until I heard Gate of Thunder that also came with my TurboDuo. I really couldn't get enough of either one of them at the time.

[Gypsy]

Great Episode, I am curious if they were limiting themselves to 8 and 16 bit consoles though?

My assumption is that since this is part 1, there will be more videos covering later consoles/game eras.

[crazydean]

Dave doesn't know what he's talking about. I thought Joe's Mega Man song was great!

[BigusSchmuck]

Awesome episode as usual gents, can't wait for the next one. Lagrange Point should be mentioned as I'm a sucker for weird music.

[ClodBusted]

Good to see some other games mentioned instead of going for the usual games known for great music!

Gauntlet sounds indeed awesome. The Genesis sure has some pleasant surprises in its musical department.

If you happen to own some computer games where you think they've got impressive soundtracks, I wouldn't mind if you incorporate them into a follow-up video. The era from the late DOS to early Windows games has some catchy non-CD based music, be it MIDI (Leisure Suit Larry 6) or MOD/tracker (e.g. Unreal Tournament) stuff.

[Joe Redifer]

But when you go from some poor 8bit Nes stuff (granted some is good) to a full featured redbook cd-audio it's really hard to go back.

That's absurd. Why limit yourself? I like music regardless of if real instruments create it or chiptunes create it. Good music is good music. And I like a lot of music (except country and probably current mainstream pop).

[TurboXray]

But when you go from some poor 8bit Nes stuff (granted some is good) to a full featured redbook cd-audio it's really hard to go back.

I felt this way back in the day, including when CD games would use chiptunes for most of the music.

 Times have changed and I've learned to appreciate those old chiptunes again, with nes right along side CD red book stuffs.

 There are even some nice stereo mod hacks of NES sound tracks. I would love it if someone would have an audio upgrade for the NES, and have the options for stereo separation, reverb (not snes style), bass enhancement, etc. Same for PCE as well (add a choice for filtering on the waveforms, bass boost, etc).

[CrackTiger]

Even good chiptunes with poor sound are great.

The only kind that age poorly for me are SNES-style sample based sound. Even some of the sample shifting mixed into early Neo Geo games can bring down the music when it gets derpy.

[Sarumaru]

This was a great episode. I hope there are many more of these awesome music eps. I liked the inclusion of GoT & LoT (of course)- Made my nips hard.

[esteban]

This was a great episode. I hope there are many more of these awesome music eps. I liked the inclusion of GoT & LoT (of course)- Made my nips hard.

Game Sack.
Hard Nipples.
Stephen Baldwin.
For.
The.
Win.
Dirty.
Blonde.
Hairy.
Areola.
Game.
Sack.

[nopepper]

Such a great episode; I agree with pretty much every selection (except Ecco...). I was especially impressed with the inclusion of Thunder Force II. Although I still feel Thunder Force III has the best soundtrack in the series, the second one doesn't get a lot of love, so it's definitely appreciated you guys giving it a spotlight.

I also agree that it's very hard to pick favorite tunes in Lords of Thunder, as they are all so good. It is one of the most consistently strong soundtracks of any game ever.

Speaking of consistently strong soundtracks, I think I've heard you guys use some tunes from Virtual On in some of your past episodes, so I would be so happy if you include it in a future part of this series. It's such a great, catchy soundtrack, with a good set of 7-8 tunes that are all of equal quality. It's also one of those games I was never really ever to get into, but still played it (both in the Saturn and my cd player) just for the tunes!

Again, great episode, like pretty much all of your episodes. Thank you for doing such high quality work!

[Enternal]

Great Episode, I am curious if they were limiting themselves to 8 and 16 bit consoles though?

I mean, most of the games that were cd based in this generation had incredible music I thought. But when you go from some poor 8bit Nes stuff (granted some is good) to a full featured redbook cd-audio it's really hard to go back.

But then I just end right back at Ys 1&2 because this is one of the first games on CD I ever heard and I was immediately blown away until I heard Gate of Thunder that also came with my TurboDuo. I really couldn't get enough of either one of them at the time.

You just need the right guy doing the music



Give him something like this.


Expect this game to have a cute whimsical opening.

No, Follin don't care, he'll set the atmosphere to awesome and give you this.

Even when you go 1-bit. Follin don't care, he don't give a shit about limitations.

And when a game is cancelled by the publisher. Follin don't care, it doesn't stop his music

[EvilEvoIX]

VERY Impressed with the Sega Genesis Version of Gauntlet 4.  I have to get that game.

[Speedy]

You just need the right guy doing the music

Glad to see someone mention Tim Follin, the dude is absolutely godly. Has he ever made a bad soundtrack? I don't think so.

[ccovell]

Hitoshi Sakimoto's Gauntlet IV music is some of the best tunage ever!  À propos: guy who made Gauntlet III's music?  Tim Follin.

[jtucci31]

Beat ya Tron

[CrackTiger]

I've never heard anything by Tim Follin that I've liked. He's good at manipulating sounds, but it's all beat-based European style music that feels so out of place in most games and I'm is not within my taste in general. There is some European game music that I like, but all of Follin's stuff is the sound equivalent of the visuals in one of those demo scene tech demos. I still find it impressive, but I'm more impressed by great compositions with poor sound usage.

[ccovell]

He's good at manipulating sounds, but it's all beat-based European style music...

I really disagree.  Most of his stuff has unusual or varied time signatures because he's heavily inspired by classic and progressive rock, NOT the Eurovision song winners of whatever year.

[esteban]

I've never heard anything by Tim Follin that I've liked. He's good at manipulating sounds, but it's all beat-based European style music that feels so out of place in most games and I'm is not within my taste in general. There is some European game music that I like, but all of Follin's stuff is the sound equivalent of the visuals in one of those demo scene tech demos. I still find it impressive, but I'm more impressed by great compositions with poor sound usage.

Officially crazy = CrackTiger

You may not like his stuff, but to say that they are not "great compositions" are fighting words.



Seriously.

I find it hilarious when folks try to dismiss entire swaths of utterly fantastic music by merely labeling it "European", whilst having an orgasm over equally banal tripe from a Japanese or American composer.

The Terminator (Sega CD) = BUTT ROCK (Tallarico)
Final Fantasy VII = lame, just like the tunes from the entire series.

[Joe Redifer]

Butt Rock came in the mid-to-late 90's. Terminator CD was much too early to be proper Butt Rock. Of course there's no official definition of what Butt Rock actually is I don't think.

[wildfruit]

I tell you who also did great music, still does, David Wise.

[esteban]

Butt Rock came in the mid-to-late 90's. Terminator CD was much too early to be proper Butt Rock. Of course there's no official definition of what Butt Rock actually is I don't think.

Sega CD Terminator = BUTT ROCK = highly derivative Muzak (not a typo) that dim-witted apes (human males) "listen to" (passively, with occasional, unthinking head nods and grimaces) whilst guzzling down Budweiser and talking about tits-n-ass.



Surely you understand this...and it certainly isn't as controversial as condemning all "European music".

However, I will add that 99% of all Japanese RPGs and horse-racing simulations feature shite Muzak.



100% trüe storie.

[Joe Redifer]

Well then Lords of Thunder = Butt Rock.

[esteban]

Well then Lords of Thunder = Butt Rock.

It's slightly better than average butt rock.

[sirhcman]

Well then Lords of Thunder = Butt Rock.

Speaking of butts, when will the fart return to the gamesack intro?

[esteban]

Well then Lords of Thunder = Butt Rock.

Speaking of butts, when will the fart return to the gamesack intro?

Seriously!

[Joe Redifer]

Honestly it might come back for a one-off in some random episode but never permanently.

[esteban]

Honestly it might come back for a one-off in some random episode but never permanently.

I know it was juvenile, but there was something charming about it, too.

[CrackTiger]

I've never heard anything by Tim Follin that I've liked. He's good at manipulating sounds, but it's all beat-based European style music that feels so out of place in most games and I'm is not within my taste in general. There is some European game music that I like, but all of Follin's stuff is the sound equivalent of the visuals in one of those demo scene tech demos. I still find it impressive, but I'm more impressed by great compositions with poor sound usage.

Officially crazy = Black_Tiger

You may not like his stuff, but to say that they are not "great compositions" are fighting words.



Seriously.

I find it hilarious when folks try to dismiss entire swaths of utterly fantastic music by merely labeling it "European", whilst having an orgasm over equally banal tripe from a Japanese or American composer.

The Terminator (Sega CD) = BUTT ROCK (Tallarico)
Final Fantasy VII = lame, just like the tunes from the entire series.

I said that I don't like it, not that it's bad.

There are many PC Engine soundtracks with good or effective music, but the sound aren't special or are crude by PCE standards.

The only reason I use a description like "European" is because I have the same reaction and feelings when listening to and hearing so many European games soundtracks from the 8 and 16-bit generation and European games seem to most often features soundtracks which felt completely out of place in their games. I also don't like arpeggio in general, but the odd time I do it's been in Japanese games.

Whether anyone likes or dislikes the music is idependent of all that. When North American and Japanese composers produce similar music and sounds that give me the same feeling, it also makes me think of European games.

[TDIRunner]

I really enjoyed the most recent video.  Nice to see some more Tomb Raider gameplay.  One of my favorite game series of all time.  The original is still in my top ten games of all time (and I'm in the middle of another play through - just made it to the last level last night).

[esadajr]

someone should reboot Greendog.

[NightWolve]

I got to watch this episode last week and was pleased to see Joe appreciated the Gate of Thunder soundtrack as much as I did. Almost all the tracks were recorded to tape for listening in my car (along with Ys and some FF) BITD which I've mentioned around here in the past.

If I could do Youtube videos, this comes very close to the kind of tribute I would've liked to have done for this game. Nice touch in pointing out how a Duran Duran member and his friend Nick Wood were behind this "Syn Sound Design" company and what led to one of the greatest soundtracks in videogame history! It's too bad they didn't do more soundtracks for videogames though!

I actually shared Gate of Thunder with at least one neighbor/friend a few years after I bought my Turbo Duo in the late 90's. In knowing that system was an underdog, I wanted it to get a bit more love outside of myself. Anyway, it's cool these games live on past their plastic prisons and can be obtained for all nowadays.

[TurboXray]

someone should reboot Greendog.

I HATED that game.

[esteban]

I've never heard anything by Tim Follin that I've liked. He's good at manipulating sounds, but it's all beat-based European style music that feels so out of place in most games and I'm is not within my taste in general. There is some European game music that I like, but all of Follin's stuff is the sound equivalent of the visuals in one of those demo scene tech demos. I still find it impressive, but I'm more impressed by great compositions with poor sound usage.

Officially crazy = CrackTiger

You may not like his stuff, but to say that they are not "great compositions" are fighting words.



Seriously.

I find it hilarious when folks try to dismiss entire swaths of utterly fantastic music by merely labeling it "European", whilst having an orgasm over equally banal tripe from a Japanese or American composer.

The Terminator (Sega CD) = BUTT ROCK (Tallarico)
Final Fantasy VII = lame, just like the tunes from the entire series.

I said that I don't like it, not that it's bad.

There are many PC Engine soundtracks with good or effective music, but the sound aren't special or are crude by PCE standards.

The only reason I use a description like "European" is because I have the same reaction and feelings when listening to and hearing so many European games soundtracks from the 8 and 16-bit generation and European games seem to most often features soundtracks which felt completely out of place in their games. I also don't like arpeggio in general, but the odd time I do it's been in Japanese games.

Whether anyone likes or dislikes the music is idependent of all that. When North American and Japanese composers produce similar music and sounds that give me the same feeling, it also makes me think of European games.

What a reasonable, logical response to my incendiary trolling. 



Anyway, since I still want to start a fight, I will simply point out that your ANTI-ARPEGGIO stance = UNACCEPTABLE.

I am too lazy to go into a rant now, but I know I must have some old rant I can copy-n-paste from years ago.

Ok.

Seriously, though, I want to be your therapist and try to understand where your Arpeggio Phobia came from. Surely, some traumatic gaming event has been repressed.

PM me.

[Gentlegamer]

I'm ignorant, is arpeggio the type of music common in C=64 games?

[esteban]

I'm ignorant, is arpeggio the type of music common in C=64 games?

It's a technique that composers/musicians can use...sadly the ANTARP coalition has been spreading FUD about arpeggios in general (and in relation to C64/SID in particular)...



In case you didn't realize, THIS IS WAR.

Not really. I was just trying to mess with B_T and the rest of the ANTARP coalition.

[seieienbu]

Wait, people are actually anti-arpegio?  Are they modernistic 12 tone bastards that don't understand classical composition and instead choose ear-grating garbage?

[Joe Redifer]

I wouldn't say  that I fall into the anti-arpegio camp, but I feel that they can be overused very easily. On ancient videogame hardware it can create kind of a displeasing sound when every note is arped. The Flash for the Master System jumps to mind. I don't remember the music specifically, but I remember not liking it at all. Arping sounds better on medium and lower notes than it does high notes, that's for sure. Systems like the Master System can't do many low notes. Stuff like Golvellius sounds tons better than stuff like The Flash.

[TurboXray]

In general, I dislike Arps. It's overuse in most 8bit Euro music for small home computers and SMS, it's super grating on the ear - no good. Like Joe said, there are some exceptions. When it isn't in your face "nothing but arps", then it's ok. And to be honest, outside of modern chiptunes emulating that old style, the NES euro musics seem to do it best (that arp usage is more subtle).

 Speaking of which. Impossamole sucks for a few reasons, but one of them is the ARP'd out sound track. Frankly, it's a down right disgusting use of the PCE soundchip.

[esteban]

In general, I dislike Arps. It's overuse in most 8bit Euro music for small home computers and SMS, it's super grating on the ear - no good. Like Joe said, there are some exceptions. When it isn't in your face "nothing but arps", then it's ok. And to be honest, outside of modern chiptunes emulating that old style, the NES euro musics seem to do it best (that arp usage is more subtle).

 Speaking of which. Impossamole sucks for a few reasons, but one of them is the ARP'd out sound track. Frankly, it's a down right disgusting use of the PCE soundchip.

YOU.

CRAZY. 



The Impossamole soundtrack is fantastic (the main tune, anyway....during the opening cinema, I have to listen to the rest of the stage music and get back to you... .

And your anti-arp bias has been DULY NOTED.

A poor composition is a POOR COMPOSITION, and will remain so with or without arpeggio.

My heart breaks when I think about this topic

Every time an arpeggio sings, another angel gets his wings...

—Pliny the Elder

[CrackTiger]

I like how Magical Chase and Somer Assault use them.

[Joe Redifer]

I think they sound better on sound chips that are more fuzzy and buzzy like NES and PCE than ones with proper tones like SMS.

[TurboXray]

Yeah, Magical Chase usage is pretty decent. I like it there. Solstice on the NES has arp usage too (title screen music), and while it's more pronounced - it still sounds decent. 

Edit: I don't heart arps in Some Assault.

[ccovell]

Joe, please define fuzzy, buzzy, and proper, by your reckoning.  Both the NES and SMS have 2 square wave channels which can sound identical.

[TurboXray]

Joe, please define fuzzy, buzzy, and proper, by your reckoning.  Both the NES and SMS have 2 square wave channels which can sound identical.

Probably because the SMS only has 50% duty cycle, and no triangle waveform. The SMS already sounds harsh/same-y as it is.

 Edit: Somer Assault is the kind of PCE chipsound that I don't like. Thin/steel-y leads, coupled fat 50% duty square base. It sounds generic. I dunno.

[CrackTiger]

Somer Assault has one of those soundtracks that I like several tracks from and think the sound works for exactly that. Ninja Spirit is the same, but I don't like the sound in most other Irem PCE HuCards.