Exile & Exile:Wicked Phenomenon ... Un-Worked Designs

elmer · 01/29/2017, 09:16 PM

Some folks here may be interested in this thread on the RomHacking forum where some kind guy is powering his way through the catalog of Working Designs translated games, returning all the stats and gameplay to the original Japanese settings in order to make them more playable.

romhacking.net/forum/index.php?topic=23436.0

He's already got a patch for Exile on the TG-CD, and I think that he's planning to look at Exile:Wicked Phenomenon soon.

tbone3969 · 01/29/2017, 09:22 PM

I like my games harder anyway. I'll play the US versions.

CrackTiger · 01/29/2017, 09:23 PM

Hopefully they don't remove the good stuff that Working Designs added to Wicked Phenomenon and maybe they can improve the screen scroll point.

EmperorIng · 01/29/2017, 09:39 PM

Quote from: tbone3969 on 01/29/2017, 09:22 PMI like my games harder anyway. I'll play the US versions.

Vic's version of "harder" is the laziest possible way to make things harder: buff enemy stats, debuff your stats.

Exile isn't that bad though you can really feel the inflated boss health at times - inflated health when coupled with Telenet's typically shoddy programming/design makes for some less-than-ideal situations.

I'm not sure how WP was improved other than some parallax in a few stages - the game is practically un-salvageable in its original state with its awful hit detection and camera placement.

I am happy to try out Popful Mail without the wonky "improvements" (read: not improvements) Working Designs made to the mechanics of the game. Popful Mail is a lot like Silhouette Mirage in that both have fantastic and fitting localizations (minus some bad pop-culture references here and there), but have so many mechanical/design changes in them that are truly baffling and bring down the game in the process.

tbone3969 · 01/29/2017, 09:41 PM

Quote from: EmperorIng on 01/29/2017, 09:39 PM
Quote from: tbone3969 on 01/29/2017, 09:22 PMI like my games harder anyway. I'll play the US versions.
Vic's version of "harder" is the laziest possible way to make things harder: buff enemy stats, debuff your stats.

Exile isn't that bad though you can really feel the inflated boss health at times - inflated health when coupled with Telenet's typically shoddy programming/design makes for some less-than-ideal situations.

I'm not sure how WP was improved other than some parallax in a few stages - the game is practically un-salvageable in its original state with its awful hit detection and camera placement.

I am happy to try out Popful Mail without the wonky "improvements" (read: not improvements) Working Designs made to the mechanics of the game. Popful Mail is a lot like Silhouette Mirage in that both have fantastic and fitting localizations (minus some bad pop-culture references here and there), but have so many mechanical/design changes in them that are truly baffling and bring down the game in the process.

Ok maybe it is worth a look. Thanks for the info.

NoSexGex · 01/30/2017, 12:21 AM

Quote from: tbone3969 on 01/29/2017, 09:22 PMI like my games harder anyway. I'll play the US versions.

The type of stuff that builds calluses

xcrement5x · 01/30/2017, 04:43 PM

I'd be happy if he did a modification to Exile: WP, that is one game that really needs it. The rest are nice but not totally needed as the games are easily beatable even though they're a bit more tedious.

PukeSter · 01/30/2017, 08:48 PM

Exile 1 they got rid of the warp spell, not a big deal but did make it harder to escape certain dungeons

TR0N · 01/31/2017, 03:53 AM

Never,bother by the changes in lunar eb and popful mail.Though i agree they were unnecessary to begin with.I just hope the person behind these hacks does one for exile wp it's so broken for the u.s version.

DragonmasterDan · 01/31/2017, 08:06 AM

Quote from: guest on 01/30/2017, 04:43 PMI'd be happy if he did a modification to Exile: WP, that is one game that really needs it. The rest are nice but not totally needed as the games are easily beatable even though they're a bit more tedious.

Yeah, Wicked Phenomenon is the game that needs it way more than the first game does.

JoshTurboTrollX · 01/31/2017, 10:09 AM

Quote from: elmer on 01/29/2017, 09:16 PMromhacking.net/forum/index.php/topic,23436.0.html

He's already got a patch for Exile on the TG-CD, and I think that he's planning to look at Exile:Wicked Phenomenon soon.

Holy shit, this is awesome!! I agree with most here, Exile WP is so broken for US gamers. If they could fix the wall scrolling and stats/buffering to enemies I would love that! The only thing I enjoy is the parallax in the US version, would be cool to keep that!

DragonmasterDan · 01/31/2017, 01:42 PM

Quote from: JoshTurboTrollX-16 on 01/31/2017, 10:09 AMHoly shit, this is awesome!! I agree with most here, Exile WP is so broken for US gamers. If they could fix the wall scrolling and stats/buffering to enemies I would love that! The only thing I enjoy is the parallax in the US version, would be cool to keep that!

I'd say the English text and voices is even more of a priority to me than the parallax

elmer · 01/31/2017, 01:48 PM

Quote from: JoshTurboTrollX-16 on 01/31/2017, 10:09 AMHoly shit, this is awesome!! I agree with most here, Exile WP is so broken for US gamers. If they could fix the wall scrolling and stats/buffering to enemies I would love that! The only thing I enjoy is the parallax in the US version, would be cool to keep that!

The guy's been working like a madman, and he released an Exile WP patch today!

AFAIK, he's only interested in changing things like the stats/rewards to get them back to the Japanese versions. He doesn't seem to want to mess with the actual translations, or any bugs/issues in the underlying games themselves.

So you get the Working Designs game, but without the silly stats changes.

xcrement5x · 01/31/2017, 03:07 PM

Wow, very nice!

If he want to do some modifications to the cut-scenes for Cosmic Fantasy 2 I wouldn't mind a bit more Babbette

ParanoiaDragon · 01/31/2017, 04:41 PM

Quote from: guest on 01/31/2017, 03:07 PMWow, very nice!

If he want to do some modifications to the cut-scenes for Cosmic Fantasy 2 I wouldn't mind a bit more Babbette

IIRC, Babs is the same in the Jp version. It's only in the Visual Collection where it's un-edited.

Gypsy · 01/31/2017, 09:27 PM

Oh so Exile WP will be actually playable in English now? Kickass.

OldRover · 01/31/2017, 10:04 PM

Did Exile really need a return to the original stats? WD's conversion is pitifully easy, and to think that the original is even easier... WP, on the other hand, is flawed as fuck any way you slice it (see what I did there? didja? huh? oh.) so it doesn't matter either way.

Gypsy · 01/31/2017, 11:07 PM

Yeah the first one it is completely not needed. The game is still extremely easy and a quick play.

EmperorIng · 02/01/2017, 01:00 AM

Quote from: Gypsy on 01/31/2017, 09:27 PMOh so Exile WP will be actually playable in English now? Kickass.

cue PCEworks Exile: Wicked Phenomenon Deluxe Edition "as the developers intended", packaged with a complementary to-scale toenail clipping, as seen on the box!

Keith Courage · 02/01/2017, 03:31 AM

Play and beat the U.S. version of exile WP like a real man! I did when I was 16 so it can't be all that bad.

xcrement5x · 02/01/2017, 01:25 PM

Quote from: ParanoiaDragon on 01/31/2017, 04:41 PM
Quote from: guest on 01/31/2017, 03:07 PMWow, very nice!

If he want to do some modifications to the cut-scenes for Cosmic Fantasy 2 I wouldn't mind a bit more Babbette
IIRC, Babs is the same in the Jp version. It's only in the Visual Collection where it's un-edited.

Ah, I remember they made at least one change where it was from a middle finger to a fist shake so I thought that had done changes to the shower scene as well

ginoscope · 02/01/2017, 03:45 PM

Quote from: Keith Courage on 02/01/2017, 03:31 AMPlay and beat the U.S. version of exile WP like a real man! I did when I was 16 so I can't be all that bad.

Haa haa I beat US Exile WP last year and it was such a pain. The first scorpion in the game could end you. It's possible to beat but you have to memorize the game like we did when we were kids. The last tower part took quite some time to beat.

I agree with Exile 1 being super easy the way we got it from the working design.

exodus · 02/01/2017, 05:38 PM

for WP I just did about two hours of grinding before moving on! it was not fun.

ginoscope · 02/02/2017, 10:46 AM

Thanks for the heads up on this Elmer I tried out the Popful Mail patch and that really makes the game so much better in my opinion. I compared the original game and one enemy took me from 100hp to 79hp and with the patch I went down to 94hp.

The patching process was not that straight forward but that could be my old xp box I use for windows based stuff like this.

spenoza · 02/02/2017, 12:26 PM

I wonder how hard it would be to patch in all the stuff in Cosmic Fantasy 2 that the original developers clearly never finished. It would be quite a list!

CrackTiger · 02/02/2017, 01:44 PM

Quote from: guest on 02/02/2017, 12:26 PMI wonder how hard it would be to patch in all the stuff in Cosmic Fantasy 2 that the original developers clearly never finished. It would be quite a list!

The game needs an original makeover to become balanced. The original artistic vision of the devs was flawed in the first place. Adding more of it won't help much.

DragonmasterDan · 02/02/2017, 02:48 PM

Quote from: guest on 02/02/2017, 01:44 PMThe game needs an original makeover to become balanced. The original artistic vision of the devs was flawed in the first place. Adding more of it won't help much.

And this was made around the time that Telenet was gradually declining in quality. This is evident in the Mega CD port which got even worse.

Serega81 · 02/06/2017, 04:09 AM

I actually liked Exile WP's challenge, a Dark Souls of yesteryear, sure it's difficult, but that satisfaction when you finally beat it, priceless

DragonmasterDan · 02/06/2017, 05:36 AM

Quote from: Serega81 on 02/06/2017, 04:09 AMI actually liked Exile WP's challenge, a Dark Souls of yesteryear, sure it's difficult, but that satisfaction when you finally beat it, priceless

Demon Souls and Dark Souls at least pace things out well, and while there's lots of cheap deaths and memorization requires it doesn't have problems like you're needing to be 90% to the right or left of the screen to advance and scroll ahead where you get hit by enemies off screen.

EmperorIng · 02/06/2017, 09:09 AM

"Dark Souls of yesteryear", however overused DS is as a benchmark, should probably be reserved for a game that has some thought put into it, like Daimakaimura or Ninja Gaiden. WP is just a bunch of assets thoughtlessly strung together into a half-finished mess.

xcrement5x · 02/06/2017, 03:51 PM

Quote from: EmperorIng on 02/01/2017, 01:00 AM
Quote from: Gypsy on 01/31/2017, 09:27 PMOh so Exile WP will be actually playable in English now? Kickass.
cue PCEworks Exile: Wicked Phenomenon Deluxe Edition "as the developers intended", packaged with a complementary to-scale toenail clipping, as seen on the box!

I don't think Tobias will go for any of the Working Designs releases since Vic is still around and active in the industry. I had mentioned the Dungeon Explorer II reprint on the Gaijinworks forum and Vic seemed a bit interested in that one considering WD had worked on it and technically still had some rights to the localization script. (If I remember the details correctly)

If you look at PCEWorks site now you notice that he hasn't reprinted that one yet? I would guess Vic or someone else in the Working Designs legal contacted them about knocking that shit off, and as actual rights holders who have been infringed on there would be a solid case against him and bringing down the whole pyramid.

elmer · 03/22/2017, 02:05 AM

Cosmic Fantasy 2 has now had the treatment, too ...

romhacking.net/forum/index.php?msg=332108

NecroPhile · 03/22/2017, 11:13 AM

QuoteI've started looking at Cosmic Fantasy 2. So far, my conclusion is that this game basically sucks even without Working Designs' help, and is best played with random encounters disabled and your stats hacked to absurdity. The story and cutscenes are all right, but everything else...

Well.... fuck him.

CrackTiger · 03/22/2017, 12:00 PM

No mention of the floppy disk item being restored. Hopefully missing stuff did all get put back and it's not simply a stats adjustment.

xcrement5x · 03/22/2017, 12:01 PM

Quote from: elmer on 03/22/2017, 02:05 AMCosmic Fantasy 2 has now had the treatment, too ...

http://www.romhacking.net/forum/index.php/topic,23436.240.html

Looked at his changelog and he did change the shaking fist back to a middle finger in this one. LOL!

Looks like he did a Saturn hack for Rayearth too, but the changes on these last couple are pretty minimal.

Gypsy · 03/22/2017, 01:36 PM

Difficulty changes for Rayearth seem to be the main thing. The funny thing is, I don't remember having any trouble with Rayearth at all, so the Japanese version must really just about play itself...

SignOfZeta · 03/22/2017, 02:50 PM

Quote from: guest on 03/22/2017, 11:13 AM
QuoteI've started looking at Cosmic Fantasy 2. So far, my conclusion is that this game basically sucks even without Working Designs' help, and is best played with random encounters disabled and your stats hacked to absurdity. The story and cutscenes are all right, but everything else...
Well.... fuck him.

I pretty much agree. It will always be a special game for me because it was the first thing like it (a menu based JRPG with CD cinemas) I had ever played. It's not good though as a game. As an RPG it's worse than any NES RPG I can remember playing. The cut scenes change everything.

Later games in the series are another story. The art still outweighs the game but the package as a whole is extremely good.

NecroPhile · 03/22/2017, 03:10 PM

Quote from: SignOfZeta on 03/22/2017, 02:50 PMI pretty much agree. It will always be a special game for me because it was the first thing like it (a menu based JRPG with CD cinemas) I had ever played. It's not good though as a game. As an RPG it's worse than any NES RPG I can remember playing. The cut scenes change everything.

Later games in the series are another story. The art still outweighs the game but the package as a whole is extremely good.

Well.... fuck you too.

SignOfZeta · 03/22/2017, 03:17 PM

Yeah...

ParanoiaDragon · 03/24/2017, 12:50 AM

CF2 holds a special place in my heart. It was my first turn based RPG. Closest thing to an RPG I had played previously was the Zelda & Ys games. I remember seeing teh cinemas in EGM & falling in love. It was also the first game to make me cry, but I won't say why, just incase anyone isn't spoiled that's reading this.

As for Rayearth. I wonder if any stat changes were actually done by the original creators of the game? Didn't most of the code have to get rebuilt because they lost all the data?

CrackTiger · 03/24/2017, 06:33 PM

It wouldn't take much to make CF2 much more enjoyable. A run button and less frequent battles would go a long way.

FraGMarE · 03/24/2017, 06:56 PM

CF2 is awesome, except for the fact it's WAAAAY too easy and that is primarily because they fucking NERFED the game (assumedly last minute) so that enemies, even bosses, never use ANY sort of magic/poison/curses against you. It's literally all melee attacks, every time, all the time. All this DESPITE there being items in the game to protect against such enemy attacks. It's kind of hilarious. And it's also that way in the Japanese version, so you can't blame WD for that one.