Will there ever be a TG16 price crash?

[esteban]

I did things backwards: I bought cheap crap games 10-15 years ago. I should have purchased the more expensive titles, but I was too cheap.

Basically, I feel like a dumbass.

But, it's OK.

[geise]

LOL!  We've all been there este!

[tbone3969]

I don't think they will ever crash.

[CrackTiger]

Unless you've decided that only the $100+ games are worth owning, you can't get priced out of shit.  For every overpriced Dynastic Hero there's a dozen comparatively cheap games that are worth less than original MSRP.

Of course there is a price spectrum, and some games are cheap, but more likely than not, a lot of people pick up the cheap, good games relatively fast.

I'm not really talking about collecting for those that want a full set of something I suppose. That has never really interested me, but more collecting and finding games I enjoy, popping a game into the system and getting some really enjoyment out of my hobby. (Although scoring a sweet deal sometimes is even better  )

Of you're blindly buying games just to find out what they're like, you're only creating price inflation.

Why not play through games on cdr/flashcart or emulation first and then decide which ones are worth owning at any price? Then you won't have stacks of games you don't care taking up space and all that saved money to spend on the "permium" priced games that you actually know are worth buying.

Otherwise what you are currently doing is literally gambling with money.

[HotJuicyBurgers]

Unless you've decided that only the $100+ games are worth owning, you can't get priced out of shit.  For every overpriced Dynastic Hero there's a dozen comparatively cheap games that are worth less than original MSRP.

Of course there is a price spectrum, and some games are cheap, but more likely than not, a lot of people pick up the cheap, good games relatively fast.

I'm not really talking about collecting for those that want a full set of something I suppose. That has never really interested me, but more collecting and finding games I enjoy, popping a game into the system and getting some really enjoyment out of my hobby. (Although scoring a sweet deal sometimes is even better  )

Of you're blindly buying games just to find out what they're like, you're only creating price inflation.

Why not play through games on cdr/flashcart or emulation first and then decide which ones are worth owning at any price? Then you won't have stacks of games you don't care taking up space and all that saved money to spend on the "permium" priced games that you actually know are worth buying.

Otherwise what you are currently doing is literally gambling with money.

I'm not sure where you are getting the idea that I am blowing a ton of money on games willly nilly on the hopes of finding a good game, but I should probably make it clear that I literally can't remember a time when I bought a game over like... 10-15 bucks without having done research and knowing pretty much exactly what I was getting.

[Jason_dicarlo85]

God I hope so

[GohanX]

It's not that i'm afraid of being priced out, I'm more curious how many people are close to, or have already been priced out. Just curious what is the point at which people say... "Ok. Maybe instead of buying 5 retro games a month, i'll buy 3, or 2, or maybe 1."

I've pretty much been priced out of TG16/PCE for some time now. Part of it is that I only keep the absolute best games that I love, and the fact that I already have a lot of the essentials. I have maybe 20 hucards and 20 CDs after purging most of my hucard collection. There are a few games that I want, and I still pick up a random game from time to time, but at this point I don't see my collection growing much larger. And it doesn't really need to, I've already got some great stuff.

[Groover]

For far too long I wanted a TurboDuo. I did get one finally a couple of years ago and I picked up a couple of games. This year I have been going hard at picking up games. Also this year is the year I got my Framemiester and RGB became my new favorite analog connection. Im glad for what I have and I will continue to pick up a game here and there. I only wish the price could crash but these things are harder to find and people are less willing to sell. I can't blame them I have all the games I had since I was a kid. I know I'm late to the party I'm just glad I'm here. Growing up my best friend had a Turbo Grafx 16 and we played the hell out of it.

[tbone3969]

Nope, no way, never.  TurboGrafx is better than gold.

[BlueBMW]

Ive been priced out for a while now.  Granted taking a lower paying job and going back to school full time has put an immense damper on my funds so...  But even still, I got tired of the chase, tired of having stuff that got little use.  Now I have a hand picked library of just the stuff I want to have and I am much happier for it.

[CrackTiger]

Nope, no way, never.  TurboGrafx is better than gold.

Then why can't you sell a sealed copy of Dragon Slayer?

[Mathius]

Ive been priced out for a while now.  Granted taking a lower paying job and going back to school full time has put an immense damper on my funds so...  But even still, I got tired of the chase, tired of having stuff that got little use.  Now I have a hand picked library of just the stuff I want to have and I am much happier for it.

This is the way to go. I see full on collecting as more of a burden. Just buy the games that you want to play.

[Opethian]

Nope, no way, never.  TurboGrafx is better than gold.

Then why can't you sell a sealed copy of Dragon Slayer?

shots fired

[Otaking]

I was just reading through this old thread and I noticed o.pwuaioc edited and deleted one of his messages.
it's message number #198 https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=16341.198
(can someone tell me how to link to a particular post in a thread?)

It seems really random to go to some random post in some random old thread and remove it before nuking your own account.

But was it a random message? What did the message say???



Disclaimer I have no problem with o.pwuaioc deleting his own post, that's totally up to him if he wants to do that, (I think I may have done it myself in the past), but my curiosity is piqued on this one

[NightWolve]

https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=16341.msg419995#msg419995

Is March 30, 2016 also around the same time he nuked his account ? Whatever the case, I suppose if you run into him at the DoxPhile chatroom you could ask him there...

[NecroPhile]

Yarr, 'tis strange to delete some random old post.

<<  edit  >>

Make it posts, plural.  He removed dozens of 'em (many of which were quoted anyway), and most all of 'em were presumably quite innocuous. 

(can someone tell me how to link to a particular post in a thread?)

The title of each specific post contains that posts direct address.  Right click it and 'copy link address' in Chrome or whatever the equivalent is in IE, Firefox, etc.

[Psycho Punch]

I did things backwards: I bought cheap crap games 10-15 years ago. I should have purchased the more expensive titles, but I was too cheap.

Basically, I feel like a dumbass.

But, it's OK.

The origin to esteban's timeball obsession was finally revealed.

[esteban]

I did things backwards: I bought cheap crap games 10-15 years ago. I should have purchased the more expensive titles, but I was too cheap.

Basically, I feel like a dumbass.

But, it's OK.

The origin to esteban's timeball obsession was finally revealed.

POSSIBLY!

Blodia was often thrown in as a free, loose HuCARD back in the day.

But I always thought Timeball was unappreciated.

GODDAMIT! Don't get me started...

[Otaking]

The general price of US TG16 games seems to have constantly been going up and up as the years go by.
Do you think the prices will keep going up indefinitely or the prices will stop increasing and plateau or even possibly dip and have a price crash?   
Say for example if the market gets flooded with high quality repros of the more expensive games this I think could cause a price crash.
 

3 years on from when I made this thread and still no sign of a crash, I'm starting to suspect there never will be one.

[Mathius]

I'm finding myself flip-flopping with this idea. But with the YT scene bloated with nostalgic gamers, Facebook bloated, forums bloated, conventions bloated, ...you can't say the word Magical Chase anymore without getting slammed with 3,000 different emotions from 1,000 different directions........it seems logical that "retro" is self sustaining yet completely illogical at the same time. I truly and lovingly hope that we'll see a healthy implosion of the market.

[Sparky]

I doubt there will be. These old post are great to awaken as going throw you can remember all the douches back in the day

[Psycho Punch]

Q: TG16 price crash?
A: lol no
Source: 19 pages of unfulfilled $10 magical chase fantasies

[TheClash603]

http://gamevaluenow.com/turbografx-16

If you like manuals and this chart is to be believed, it already happened.

[DildoKKKobold]

http://gamevaluenow.com/turbografx-16

If you like manuals and this chart is to be believed, it already happened.

Given that there was no fluctuation in the loose price, I bet dollars to donuts that he implemented the CIC/CIB separation algorithm in Oct of '16. Also, no other console saw a substantial drop in prices (according to GVN charts) after Oct of '16. This just appears to be a 'correction factor' for cardboard.

[Otaking]

People on eBay are stupid.
Not Turbografx or PC Engine, but I was just bidding on a seller who had 20 different retro games auctions I was interested in.
ALL 20 separate game auctions got bid up and ended considerably higher than you could buy the same games for a buy it now, right now. Any of those bidders could of searched eBay and found the same games right now for cheaper than the amount they bid. That is literally throwing money away, or actually just giving it away just because they were so fucking desperate to win the auction.

I don't remember it being this bad before where people would bid more than buy it nows. So is this the problem with prices and the current state of eBay? bidders having so desperately to win auctions at all costs??

I think I'll call them "Bidtards" from now on.

PS I know that what I just said is moving a bit off subject from a "TG16 price crash", it was just the way those auctions ended (and loads of others I've seen recently) made me think of this thread and the mind set of "I must have this game at any cost".

[esteban]

Bidtards.

I like it. 

[Mathius]

Bidtards.

I like it. 

Aye. I chuckled.

[Alt-Nintega]

they pay over 30 dollars for games that cost 5 dollars a year ago

http://www.ebay.com/itm/JACK-NICKLAUS-TURBO-GOLF-CIB-TurboGrafx16-TurboDuo-TurboExpress-/132117689769?hash=item1ec2d3f5a9:g:uW8AAOSwCU1Yvb1X

no price crash ever

[StarDust4Ever]

People on eBay are stupid.
Not Turbografx or PC Engine, but I was just bidding on a seller who had 20 different retro games auctions I was interested in.
ALL 20 separate game auctions got bid up and ended considerably higher than you could buy the same games for a buy it now, right now. Any of those bidders could of searched eBay and found the same games right now for cheaper than the amount they bid. That is literally throwing money away, or actually just giving it away just because they were so fucking desperate to win the auction.

I don't remember it being this bad before where people would bid more than buy it nows. So is this the problem with prices and the current state of eBay? bidders having so desperately to win auctions at all costs??

I think I'll call them "Bidtards" from now on.

PS I know that what I just said is moving a bit off subject from a "TG16 price crash", it was just the way those auctions ended (and loads of others I've seen recently) made me think of this thread and the mind set of "I must have this game at any cost".

Yeah I've seen these assmonkeys in action before. A couple times I saw a nice CIC game sitting there with a BIN and I'd just jump on it the minute I got outbid, or it would disappear and I would watch helplessly as I got sniped and walked away with nothing. Then after the auction goes much higher than existing BINs prior to the auction's existance, subsequent BINs are listed based on the new auction benchmark. So one can review the "sold listings" on eBay and sort by date, see this pattern happening across many games, and once an auction price goes higher than the BIN, it sets a new bar and new BINs at the previous rate are a thing of the past, or very rarely when they do, they get snatched within minutes of the posting.

It's just seems these dumb bidders are contributing to the inflation problem even more than the sellers who post stupid money BINs.

[jonebone]

http://gamevaluenow.com/turbografx-16

If you like manuals and this chart is to be believed, it already happened.

Given that there was no fluctuation in the loose price, I bet dollars to donuts that he implemented the CIC/CIB separation algorithm in Oct of '16. Also, no other console saw a substantial drop in prices (according to GVN charts) after Oct of '16. This just appears to be a 'correction factor' for cardboard.

I can confirm that is true, he changed the pricing algorithm then.  Prior to that, CIC and CIB wasn't really designated but it is treated separately going forward.  Owner is a good guy and always open to feedback if anyone wants to improve his algorithms or tracking.

As far as bubble popping on a whole, I'd expect gradual lulls or pullbacks (especially seasonally, like during summer), but a "crash" where $1000 games became $100 or less isn't happening.  There are simply so many resellers in the hobby that games would be scooped up as prices dropped and then relisted as BINs.  Even if they weren't selling, sellers would be stubborn and let them rot.

[jonebone]

People on eBay are stupid.
Not Turbografx or PC Engine, but I was just bidding on a seller who had 20 different retro games auctions I was interested in.
ALL 20 separate game auctions got bid up and ended considerably higher than you could buy the same games for a buy it now, right now. Any of those bidders could of searched eBay and found the same games right now for cheaper than the amount they bid. That is literally throwing money away, or actually just giving it away just because they were so fucking desperate to win the auction.

I don't remember it being this bad before where people would bid more than buy it nows. So is this the problem with prices and the current state of eBay? bidders having so desperately to win auctions at all costs??

I think I'll call them "Bidtards" from now on.

This has been happening for years, and will continue to happen all the time.  Like items, listed at auction, always do well together, many times selling for higher than they should.

The main reason is just simple marketing.  What yard sale would do better, one in the middle of no where or 10 all located together at an annual event?  Same concept, say a seller is selling 20 games.  They can be found with one click of "view seller's other items", instead of running 20 separate searches. 

Also a convenience thing, sometimes people will bid higher trying to get combined shipping if offered.  Some buyers are also only after specific titles, maybe a Bonk or Bomberman, so that's all they search.  Then when they look at seller's other items, maybe they'll throw some small bids at other titles of interests that they don't actively search for (and may not be familiar with the exact price of all BINs available).

TLDR - Like items listed together at 0.99 always do well.

[nicksbrain]

not sure if it's already been mentioned but... bitdards (love that...) that are interested in their childhood games again grow older and whilst in that process get (statistically) richer
that and the fact that people are stupid points me towards increasing prices for quite some time. scientifically proven!

[SignOfZeta]

I've seen that phenomenon as well. Ive mentioned this before and I can't remember the details but a while ago I sold a component GC cable on eBay. I think I chose a BIN of like $80 but it ended up going for like $120 which was not only more than my BIN but more than the BIN on several other GC component  video cables at that very moment, other auctions and other BINs.

Since there are no pirate versions and region was irrelevant (I had no box) there is no sane way to explain this other than to say these people are dumb.

[NoSexGex]

they pay over 30 dollars for games that cost 5 dollars a year ago

http://www.ebay.com/itm/JACK-NICKLAUS-TURBO-GOLF-CIB-TurboGrafx16-TurboDuo-TurboExpress-/132117689769?hash=item1ec2d3f5a9:g:uW8AAOSwCU1Yvb1X

no price crash ever

Oh my god that's bad, $35CAN for Jack golf.

[StarDust4Ever]

I've seen that phenomenon as well. Ive mentioned this before and I can't remember the details but a while ago I sold a component GC cable on eBay. I think I chose a BIN of like $80 but it ended up going for like $120 which was not only more than my BIN but more than the BIN on several other GC component  video cables at that very moment, other auctions and other BINs.

Since there are no pirate versions and region was irrelevant (I had no box) there is no sane way to explain this other than to say these people are dumb.

You mean $80 reserve, or one of those BID XXX or BIN for YYY auctions, and some moron still bid more than the BIN price? If it was BID $120+ or BIN $80, and I was interested in the item, I would sure as heck chose the BIN option and end it immediately. It would be like the ultimate snipe, or let them pay more. eBay even warns users if they set a max bid above the BIN price. :p

[nicksbrain]

they pay over 30 dollars for games that cost 5 dollars a year ago

http://www.ebay.com/itm/JACK-NICKLAUS-TURBO-GOLF-CIB-TurboGrafx16-TurboDuo-TurboExpress-/132117689769?hash=item1ec2d3f5a9:g:uW8AAOSwCU1Yvb1X

no price crash ever

Oh my god that's bad, $35CAN for Jack golf.

Probably because there are the magic words...

CIB
 

[LostFlunky]

I've seen that phenomenon as well. Ive mentioned this before and I can't remember the details but a while ago I sold a component GC cable on eBay. I think I chose a BIN of like $80 but it ended up going for like $120 which was not only more than my BIN but more than the BIN on several other GC component  video cables at that very moment, other auctions and other BINs.

Since there are no pirate versions and region was irrelevant (I had no box) there is no sane way to explain this other than to say these people are dumb.

You mean $80 reserve, or one of those BID XXX or BIN for YYY auctions, and some moron still bid more than the BIN price? If it was BID $120+ or BIN $80, and I was interested in the item, I would sure as heck chose the BIN option and end it immediately. It would be like the ultimate snipe, or let them pay more. eBay even warns users if they set a max bid above the BIN price. :p

The BIN option goes away once a bid is placed on those auctions.  It is called breaking the BIN.

[xcrement5x]

I've seen that phenomenon as well. Ive mentioned this before and I can't remember the details but a while ago I sold a component GC cable on eBay. I think I chose a BIN of like $80 but it ended up going for like $120 which was not only more than my BIN but more than the BIN on several other GC component  video cables at that very moment, other auctions and other BINs.

Since there are no pirate versions and region was irrelevant (I had no box) there is no sane way to explain this other than to say these people are dumb.

You mean $80 reserve, or one of those BID XXX or BIN for YYY auctions, and some moron still bid more than the BIN price? If it was BID $120+ or BIN $80, and I was interested in the item, I would sure as heck chose the BIN option and end it immediately. It would be like the ultimate snipe, or let them pay more. eBay even warns users if they set a max bid above the BIN price. :p

Underpriced BINs are basically the only way left to get a "good deal" on ebay anymore, there are so many eyes on like every auction it's rare for something to go cheap anymore.

[spenoza]

What would a TG16 price crash look like, anyway? It's not like there's millions of these things sitting around unwanted, waiting for someplace to go.

[xcrement5x]

What would a TG16 price crash look like, anyway? It's not like there's millions of these things sitting around unwanted, waiting for someplace to go.

It's an interesting point.  Since the prices are driven by demand it means that people will have to no longer want to buy/own/collect older video games, which is probably going to be driven by a number of factors.  I think that probably the biggest thing that has influenced the rise in price is the prevalence of "geek/nerd cred" within our current pop culture at the time, but speculation is probably the next largest variable I'd guess.

The comic book crash in the 90s is cited as the biggest example of what is coming/will happen, and that was mainly caused by speculators I think, but the publishers had a hand in it too.  The difference there though, is not all retro gamers necessarily enjoy modern games, so there is probably a disconnect going on for the people buying older games vs new limited editions filled with widgets of some sort.

[LostFlunky]

What would a TG16 price crash look like, anyway? It's not like there's millions of these things sitting around unwanted, waiting for someplace to go.

It would look like this:

http://www.ebay.ca/sch/Video-Games/139973/i.html?_from=R40&_sop=2&_nkw=atari+2600

and this:

http://www.ebay.ca/sch/Video-Games/139973/i.html?_from=R40&_sop=2&_nkw=intellivision

And in case you think I am picking on old stuff:

http://www.ebay.ca/sch/Video-Games/139973/i.html?_from=R40&_sop=2&_nkw=ps3

[SignOfZeta]

What would a TG16 price crash look like, anyway? It's not like there's millions of these things sitting around unwanted, waiting for someplace to go.

First, it has to peak. All crashes looked like an upward line until the actual crash. You can't see it as a crash until it has crashed. "There has never been a crash in this segment." is not an economic indicator and it isn't protection from anything. See: The Big Short. They hurt so many people because so many people don't see it coming.

Since we first started speculating on this here I've noticed a few trends. New...stuff, gadgets, games, music, media is ever more obsessed with miniaturization, simplification, and cheapification. However, while that is the biggest market it's not the only one and there is a multi-billion dollar "long tail" that exists now in multiple retro markets because iPhones have one button, because lightweight Bluetooth headphones suck and blow at once, because new games don't have manuals, because iTunes downloads and Spotify streams don't have liner notes, because really, honestly, if we're being *really* honest, 8 and 16 bit games looked better in RGB on an SD monitor they do on that jackoffs giant TV no matter how much he's spent on super high tech scalers.

And because if this Turbo games are expensive. Also, quality mid-range stereo equipment from the 1970s holds its value *astoundingly* well, people still hoard VHS, etc. The current leaders of the electronics industry are clearly leaving something on the table if so many people would rather pay more just to ship a Laserdisc than it would to have a BluRay. Just look at sales of vinyl records. Many many people want the fun of the entire experience more than they want just the single stated purpose of the thing's existence.

Until this changes, old shit will continue to be as popular as dumb beards and shitty tattoos. However, there is a limit to each individual thing's potential fame. After a while, the people who care just die off, literally, then you only have second gen fans who are never going to be quite as devoted as the people who lived it. So really, someday someone's going to say "What the zorking farp is a Bonk?" and nobody will care. If the scene is sufficiently entrenched we'll see a plateau for a long time (just look at comics and sports cards...shit holds it's "value" forever even when nobody is actually buying it) but eventually it will crap out. Consider 78 RPM records. Sure, some are priceless but most are completely worthless. Same with Popeye colectables which used to be huge. The younger people will have their own dumb shit to blow their money on. They aren't going to be able to go sky surfing twice a year while maintaining their fuck robot collection *and* keep propping up the economy of a game machine they've never heard of. There are only so many people in the world and dollars in the economy.

A plateau would almost be a crash, at least by normal investment standards. We've being seeing %100 gains per year on even the lamest shit so a flattening would represent serious shrinkage.

[CrackTiger]

What would a TG16 price crash look like, anyway? It's not like there's millions of these things sitting around unwanted, waiting for someplace to go.

Game players of all consoles are increasingly switching to flash carts, ISO drives and bizarrely, fake hardware to run physical media from.

It is inevitable that an artificially inflated market based strictly on possession enthusiasm and flipping investments will crash once the ceiling has been reached of what a majority of speculators can afford. When people have no choice but to liquidate their investments and take a loss on everything, even those scooping up the below peak deals will only get hurt that much more as it staggers downward.

The reason that this particular market has remained out of control for so long is that it's backed by a generation who have reached an age of earning power combined with easy to acquire credit. I regularly see threads on collectard friendly forums, where people say that they need to cash out because  they went to far into debt to acquire everything and/or, can't be bothered to collect at all unless they can complete sets and do it fast enough.

[ginoscope]

The crazy thing about Turbo is that you don't see it at retro stores and even at most conventions.  I went to a local Dallas meetup and no one had any turbo games.  Same with the conventions I been to the last year in this area.  The only place to get some of this stuff is here or on ebay. 

I would expect to see something like Bonk 3 at a convention even if the price was stupid inflated.  I think we will see other more common systems crash like nes/snes before turbo stuff crashes.

[Gentlegamer]

Another component to what a crash will look like is when "repros" get so good that it's hard for even the truly knowledgeable to tell the difference, the value of everything will crash under a pile of bootlegs, no one will want to risk spending on anything that is potentially fake, and for those who already knowingly buy fancy premium bootlegs, the "prestige" of owning LE bootlegs will crash, and thus the interest and prices.

[spenoza]

Yes, yes, I appreciate the lessons on what a crash is, but the TG16 is a much smaller portion of a much larger market. I don't foresee that a TG16 crash would look anything like our housing crash, or like the comic book market crash, or even like the Atari-induced video game crash of the early 80s. Aside from digital releases, new items are not being manufactured to market. As hardware and HuCards age, more and more items are removed from the market's available pool of salable items. Even as collectors cash-out, stuff breaks and fails. So interest may fall or rise, but available inventory will only fall. And digital re-releases seem to have a mixed relationship to physical prices.

So what I'm really getting at is... would we expect the TG16 market to follow the general classic gaming market, or, being a niche product, would we expect it to be divorced somewhat from that larger market? I don't think a crash in this market would look anything like the 2600 market right now, but it's easier to rule out possibilities than to rule them in. Does anyone have any prognostication about what the TG16 market particularly would look like post-crash?

[SignOfZeta]

Considering how little actual US "Turbografx" shit there actually is, yeah, downward trends will lag way behind almost every other system. That's why I think near flatlining is more realistic with overall inflation eventually normalizing the price. Also, as you hint at, they ain't making much of *anything* worth collecting now. When I have money to blow on some doodad I tend to go vintage most of the time. Audio gear, car stuff, games, whatever. So every year there is a new wave of yuppies with their first good job and their first real credit card and they're bidding on the same eBay auctions as everyone else.

However, as Tiger mentioned, these prices we're seeing can't be put on simple supply and demand. These fucks acctually want to spend money, brag about it, and seem to be convinced that every time a game changes hands it should increase in price. That is a fad, and it will die, and it's death will be the majority of the crash. Once the interest rate on their credit cards starts to overtake the flipper bonus made when selling it..there's no money left in the fad!

These are all decades out trends in talking here, of course. So anyone who wants to power collect a full library in nine months...yeah, for him there will "never" be a crash because that's how he collects. He just devours shit he can't even use and then dumps it. Five years from now he'll be working full time at his dad's dealership and won't even remember what a Turbo is.

[esteban]

Q: What will the crash look like?
A:

[Gypsy]

However, as Tiger mentioned, these prices we're seeing can't be put on simple supply and demand. These fucks acctually want to spend money, brag about it, and seem to be convinced that every time a game changes hands it should increase in price. That is a fad, and it will die, and it's death will be the majority of the crash. Once the interest rate on their credit cards starts to overtake the flipper bonus made when selling it..there's no money left in the fad!

These are all decades out trends in talking here, of course. So anyone who wants to power collect a full library in nine months...yeah, for him there will "never" be a crash because that's how he collects. He just devours shit he can't even use and then dumps it. Five years from now he'll be working full time at his dad's dealership and won't even remember what a Turbo is.

Yeah that is obnoxious. Gotta get back what I paid! Except no, you really don't. It's not *supposed* to work that way, but it's enabled by desperate buyers who then continue the cycle.

I had a good chuckle at the second paragraph.

Also going into debt for video games is doing it wrong. Call me crazy but housing, transportation (be it a vehicle or a bike or w/e) and say food (if you are in between jobs or something) are things worth going into debt over. If you can't afford a freaking video game, don't buy it. Just emulate it instead, or if you are a real legal larry, just don't play it.

[xcrement5x]

That single tear is shed for those with high credit card debt and no impulse control.