cd systems

musicman130 · 02/20/2016, 10:58 AM

Looking at using part of my tax refund, if the wife will let me, to buy a cd unit from Keith Courage. I'm leaning toward the duo unit instead of the briefcase since it is only $10 more and if I would decide I want arcade card it is cheaper. I see that he does mods on the units and am confused. I thought that component and RGB were the same thing. Can someone explain if it is different?

Also with these systems, more than likely most games will be burned, since it is hard to find real copies of these at decent prices since ebay is so high anymore, to play on it. I have a sega CD system that plays the discs well and this is from the same time frame, how does it do with burned cd's?

Thanks for all the responses, I am filing soon and hopefully the wife will let me use some of my refund for this. lol

tbone3969 · 02/20/2016, 11:10 AM

I am wondering about Component Vs. RGB as well.

When you say RGB do you mean S-cart RGB? That is a specific connection type. Mostly used in Europe.

Is S-cart RBG better than Component RGB? I will wait for the tech experts to respond.

TIA

CrackTiger · 02/20/2016, 11:19 AM

RGB is technically more pure, but you only really need it over component if you want the best signal when connecting to an RGB monitor or upscaler like the framemeister.

Scart is just the name of one type of RGB connection. You're best off sticking to European scart cables.

If you plan to only ever hook a console up to a crt TV using component, then component is fine, provided that the mod is done right and the picture is fine tuned.

ClodBusted · 02/20/2016, 11:27 AM

RGB natively found on the Turbo/PCE has usually four signals:
Red, Green, Blue, Sync (either tapped from composite sync or composite video). That's why its called RGBS in some places.
In Europe and Japan, RGB support is usually available on TVs with SCART or JP21 sockets. Usually supports up to 480i (NTSC) or 576i (PAL) resolution.

Component YPbPr video has three signals:
Luma, and two carriers for chroma.
Pretty common in the US and Japan, I think. But it wasn't very common in Europe, until the first LCD HD-TVs were released. It supports up to 1080i resolution, depending on signal source (videogame console, blu ray player, etc.) and TV.

To get Component YPbPr from your Turbo/PCE, you need to convert it from the RGB source signals.

There are also other types of RGB:
RGBHV with separate horizontal and vertical sync for VGA computer screens
RGB with composite sync-on-green, found only on a few computer screens, also supported by the PlayStation 2's Linux OS kit.

SignOfZeta · 02/20/2016, 11:49 AM

RGB and YPbPr are both component video. The difference is that YPbPr (the one usually referred to as "component") is compressed in the analog realm. This YPbPr came about because the signal for pure RGB is ridiculously huge, too big for practical video tape. Certain pro video tape formats used YPbPr but it wasn't until DVD that it really took off with consumers.

I don't have an XRGB so I can't say anything about the difference between the two in that realm, but on a pure analog set there is virtually no difference. Basically the "compression" used allows one of the colors to be calculated from the difference between the other colors and the luma signal. It's not compressed like NTSC or anything and certainly not like MPEG. This could lead to a difference in visuals for the XRGB since it has to deconstruct the analog and build something to put out of HDMI, but if hooking to a PVM that accepts both there is little to no difference.

CrackTiger · 02/20/2016, 12:28 PM

The problem with using component on the framemeister at least, is that it has poor support for it. So even though component quality itself is great, it comes out looking noticeably worse than RGB from one.

musicman130 · 02/20/2016, 01:02 PM

so I want to connect it to either my plasma TV or my stereo that upconverts. I guess I'm asking which mod I would request he would do.

MNKyDeth · 02/20/2016, 01:12 PM

It is going to come down to the connections on the Plasma. If you have YPrBr you need to make sure the TV supports 240p video signal if you use a component mod.

Your stereo, will also depend on the connections available. If none of your devices has a Euro scart connection but they do have component, then component would be the way to go. If your stereo doesn't support 240p and the tv doesn't support 240p then you will still be left without a signal.

At that point an upscaler of some sort would be needed to reach the requirement of the devices.

This thread will also show the video differences between composite, component and RGB using various RGB amps and the Component V2 mod using a framemeister xrgb-mini upscaler.
https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=20470.0

musicman130 · 02/20/2016, 04:31 PM

TV sort of plays the turbo on my plasma. I say sort of as I have picture but it flickers A LOT when I plug the yellow into the green input on the TV. I'm guessing this is telling me that it is not going to work real well. Also, not sure how many TV's in future will support this. What is another option or I can just stick with the stock composite video for now. I know not the best but it might be my only option.

CrackTiger · 02/20/2016, 05:31 PM

If you buy a decent upscaler like the XRGB3 mini/framemeister and send RGB video from your PC Engine setup to it, it can output 1080p video which looks as clear as emulation.

MNKyDeth · 02/20/2016, 05:34 PM

In a world of HDTV's the framemeister is your best friend. There are other upscalers but none compare from what I have read and seen.

I love my framemeister.

musicman130 · 02/20/2016, 06:02 PM

Am I seeing the price correctly. $300 - $400 for one of those?

MNKyDeth · 02/20/2016, 06:20 PM

Yes, imo your best bet is to order it from Japan.

https://solarisjapan.com/products/xrgb-mini-framemeister-compact-up-scaler-unit

Imo also get it with the DT that allows you to hook up component connections to it. That way no matter what direction you go you are covered. It's how I hook the Component V2 mod from the SuperGrafx up to it.

They arn't cheap but imo they are the best.

tbone3969 · 02/20/2016, 07:48 PM

Save yourself the money and hassle of setting it up and just get yourself an old Sony Trinitron CRT for cheap. Component & S-video look awesome on mine. Heck even composite looks great.

Digi.k · 02/20/2016, 08:30 PM

Quote from: musicman130 on 02/20/2016, 04:31 PMTV sort of plays the turbo on my plasma. I say sort of as I have picture but it flickers A LOT when I plug the yellow into the green input on the TV. I'm guessing this is telling me that it is not going to work real well. Also, not sure how many TV's in future will support this. What is another option or I can just stick with the stock composite video for now. I know not the best but it might be my only option.

it's a shame, I have plasma but I don't remember it flickering when I was testing it. I am quite happy with the component straight to the TV but at a much later date I'm am gonna try and save up for a framemeister and hope that I don't get caught with import tax. Have to keep in mind the DT but what is that?

EDIT

Ah I just saw it..

SignOfZeta · 02/20/2016, 09:49 PM

Quote from: tbone3969 on 02/20/2016, 07:48 PMSave yourself the money and hassle of setting it up and just get yourself an old Sony Trinitron CRT for cheap. Component & S-video look awesome on mine. Heck even composite looks great.

It's true. A good condition PVM crushes all HD fakery. When you just *have* to play games and you can *only* have one display (which, people assure me, is the case, people who somehow have room for 5600 fucking games in their house) and it *has* to be a 100" LCD billboard that itself takes up more room than several SD displays, then without question the stuff from Micomsoft is the only sane solution to your fucked up "problem".

Or, if you have $45 plus gas money you can get the unquestionably quintessential OG gaming experience and just buy a fucking PVM for fucks sake. You don't even need to mod anything. Even composite looks great on these things and Y/C looks %90 as good as component.

johnnykonami · 02/20/2016, 10:11 PM

I'm moving into a new house, I was looking for a PVM myself. In all seriousness, where can I get one of these for $45? My plan was just to grab someone's free Trinitron or something from Craigslist, but a reasonably sized PVM would be great. Seems like the 20" ones go for 2-300 on ebay last I checked.

tbone3969 · 02/20/2016, 10:38 PM

Quote from: johnnykonami on 02/20/2016, 10:11 PMI'm moving into a new house, I was looking for a PVM myself. In all seriousness, where can I get one of these for $45? My plan was just to grab someone's free Trinitron or something from Craigslist, but a reasonably sized PVM would be great. Seems like the 20" ones go for 2-300 on ebay last I checked.

I use a Sony Trinitron. I think I paid $25 at the Salvation Army. It has S-video, Component, and Composite. I love it for vintage gaming. I never said to get a PVM. Those things are expensive and you need a shit ton of cables to hook them up properly. I have thought about picking a PVM up before but they are 200+ whenever I see them pop up. Screw that.

ginoscope · 02/20/2016, 10:50 PM

I started out using my rgb modded PC engine duo on my benq LCD and for a while I loved it.

Fast forward last couple months and I got a tg16 CD setup and I modified it for s-video. I honestly prefer the s-video on my 20" Toshiba crt to the RGB on the duo. Looks better than composite yet not so pixelated like the RGB did. Guess what I'm saying is the s-video looks less emulator like.

Bloufo · 02/21/2016, 02:03 AM

I have a couple CRT's with component outputs, so I tend to use RGB SCART to Component for my PC Engine/Turbo gaming. It even looks good with that connection on my el-cheapo LCD.

But I have noticed that even going the "standard" route with these consoles, the composite signal is still very acceptable. Even RF isn't terrible.

Compare that to composite out of, let's say, a Genesis console, and it's like day and night.