I freaking wonder about employees at fast food joints.

[o.pwuaioc]

It's easy to continue to ask for numbers when you don't pay attention to the ones already given you.

If you're too fragile to face the world and confront the vapidity of your worldview, why didn't you just say so from the start? You don't need to start calling people Marxists just because you don't have the ability to comprehend basic numbers.

[ToyMachine78]

It's easy to continue to ask for numbers when you don't pay attention to the ones already given you.

If you're too fragile to face the world and confront the vapidity of your worldview, why didn't you just say so from the start? You don't need to start calling people Marxists just because you don't have the ability to comprehend basic numbers.

Uh ok sure lol

[blueraven]

I agree. Post the numbers that prove corporations can't afford to pay their employees a living wage.

Well I think I've posted more numerical logic than anyone else.

1. You mentioned CEO pay cut. You did not mention any other sources of revenue.

2. Costco has less revenue than Wal-Mart (by billions), yet pays its employees more and still makes a profit. If Costco can do it, so can Wal-Mart.

Boom.

[LostFlunky]

Shareholders are more of an obstacle to living wages than CEO's.  Who is going to want to provide capital to a company that can't provide an ROI?

[o.pwuaioc]

Shareholders are more of an obstacle to living wages than CEO's.  Who is going to want to provide capital to a company that can't provide an ROI?

https://www.fool.com/investing/2017/06/26/how-risky-is-costco-wholesale-corporation.aspx

[LostFlunky]

Shareholders are more of an obstacle to living wages than CEO's.  Who is going to want to provide capital to a company that can't provide an ROI?

https://www.fool.com/investing/2017/06/26/how-risky-is-costco-wholesale-corporation.aspx

As the article states - most of Costco's net revenue isn't from sales - it is from memberships.  The article is specifically about how "different" Costco is from most retailers.  Not every retailer, small business, restaurant etc can subscribe to Costco's business model.  Costco works because people are willing to make that membership payment for ONE place (maybe 2).  If Target, McDonalds, Starbucks all started charging membership fees that would lead to them going out of business...

[o.pwuaioc]

Shareholders are more of an obstacle to living wages than CEO's.  Who is going to want to provide capital to a company that can't provide an ROI?

https://www.fool.com/investing/2017/06/26/how-risky-is-costco-wholesale-corporation.aspx

As the article states - most of Costco's net revenue isn't from sales - it is from memberships.  The article is specifically about how "different" Costco is from most retailers.  Not every retailer, small business, restaurant etc can subscribe to Costco's business model.  Costco works because people are willing to make that membership payment for ONE place (maybe 2).  If Target, McDonalds, Starbucks all started charging membership fees that would lead to them going out of business...

They charge a membership fee but they have lower markup. Target has a higher markup with no membership fees.

We don't disagree on the point, though, so to move on. What about In-N-Out, the top of the list mentioned earlier? They pay better than McDonald's, are they profitable? Fuck yes they are. Owner Lynsi Snyder is well on her way to becoming a billionaire, if she's not already one.

[LostFlunky]

Shareholders are more of an obstacle to living wages than CEO's.  Who is going to want to provide capital to a company that can't provide an ROI?

https://www.fool.com/investing/2017/06/26/how-risky-is-costco-wholesale-corporation.aspx

As the article states - most of Costco's net revenue isn't from sales - it is from memberships.  The article is specifically about how "different" Costco is from most retailers.  Not every retailer, small business, restaurant etc can subscribe to Costco's business model.  Costco works because people are willing to make that membership payment for ONE place (maybe 2).  If Target, McDonalds, Starbucks all started charging membership fees that would lead to them going out of business...

They charge a membership fee but they have lower markup. Target has a higher markup with no membership fees.

We don't disagree on the point, though, so to move on. What about In-N-Out, the top of the list mentioned earlier? They pay better than McDonald's, are they profitable? Fuck yes they are. Owner Lynsi Snyder is well on her way to becoming a billionaire, if she's not already one.

Again - In and Out - no shareholders to report to... that was my point.  The quickest way to lose your job when there are shareholders involved is to make less money for them.   I am not saying that is "right" or "moral", I am saying that is just reality.

[o.pwuaioc]

Shareholders are more of an obstacle to living wages than CEO's.  Who is going to want to provide capital to a company that can't provide an ROI?

https://www.fool.com/investing/2017/06/26/how-risky-is-costco-wholesale-corporation.aspx

As the article states - most of Costco's net revenue isn't from sales - it is from memberships.  The article is specifically about how "different" Costco is from most retailers.  Not every retailer, small business, restaurant etc can subscribe to Costco's business model.  Costco works because people are willing to make that membership payment for ONE place (maybe 2).  If Target, McDonalds, Starbucks all started charging membership fees that would lead to them going out of business...

They charge a membership fee but they have lower markup. Target has a higher markup with no membership fees.

We don't disagree on the point, though, so to move on. What about In-N-Out, the top of the list mentioned earlier? They pay better than McDonald's, are they profitable? Fuck yes they are. Owner Lynsi Snyder is well on her way to becoming a billionaire, if she's not already one.

Again - In and Out - no shareholders to report to... that was my point.  The quickest way to lose your job when there are shareholders involved is to make less money for them.   I am not saying that is "right" or "moral", I am saying that is just reality.

Just because they're not publicly traded doesn't mean they don't have investors.

I think somewhere in this conversation you missed where I mentioned that "the current legal structures that allow them to foster shitty behavior with impunity is what's bad" (p. 2 of this thread).

It doesn't have to be like this, but the Republicans masturbate to deregulation and economic fantasies nightly, so we'll never get anywhere.

[LostFlunky]

Shareholders are more of an obstacle to living wages than CEO's.  Who is going to want to provide capital to a company that can't provide an ROI?

https://www.fool.com/investing/2017/06/26/how-risky-is-costco-wholesale-corporation.aspx

As the article states - most of Costco's net revenue isn't from sales - it is from memberships.  The article is specifically about how "different" Costco is from most retailers.  Not every retailer, small business, restaurant etc can subscribe to Costco's business model.  Costco works because people are willing to make that membership payment for ONE place (maybe 2).  If Target, McDonalds, Starbucks all started charging membership fees that would lead to them going out of business...

They charge a membership fee but they have lower markup. Target has a higher markup with no membership fees.

We don't disagree on the point, though, so to move on. What about In-N-Out, the top of the list mentioned earlier? They pay better than McDonald's, are they profitable? Fuck yes they are. Owner Lynsi Snyder is well on her way to becoming a billionaire, if she's not already one.

Again - In and Out - no shareholders to report to... that was my point.  The quickest way to lose your job when there are shareholders involved is to make less money for them.   I am not saying that is "right" or "moral", I am saying that is just reality.

I think somewhere in this conversation you missed where I mentioned that "the current legal structures that allow them to foster shitty behavior with impunity is what's bad" (p. 2 of this thread).

I agree with that completely - business in general will only behave in an ethical fashion to avoid legislation.

However,

We are going to get to see first hand what happens when a living wage get legislated here in Ontario.

Minimum wage goes up from $11.40 to $14.00 on 01-01-2018.  Then to $15.00 on 01-01-2019.   

I am just going to come out and say it - liberal or conservative, when you suddenly have to come up with an additional 26% of your wage budget, make concessions with tenured employees over wage compression, and placate stakeholders who you are telling they will have to increase prices and expect less sales, you will forget about your political ideology and realize that, for the time being, you are screwed...

(edit - had the dates wrong... it hasn't happened yet.. )

[o.pwuaioc]

Yeah, it's almost like legislators can only act in extremes. Minimum wages should have always been tied to inflation, but now that it hasn't, more moderate increases are necessary to prevent mass hours being cut.

Stupid all the way around.

[blueraven]

Translation: toymachine hates poor people, Mr. Broadway hates vagina, and blue raven exploded.

[crazydean]

Yeah, it's almost like legislators can only act in extremes. Minimum wages should have always been tied to inflation, but now that it hasn't, more moderate increases are necessary to prevent mass hours being cut.

Stupid all the way around.

Ya, I had a job a Pizza Hut where I wasn't allowed to work more than 32 hours a week because that would have been too close to full time. Then, they would have had to offer things like health care. It's rough when you're willing to work, but The Man won't let you.

[Mas]

DAMN!!!!
What did I start. I was just saying how people in general in today's market don't take pride in the food or jobs and I get all these comments. Hell im going back to try and get ready to pre order the snes mini so I won't be able to get one when I cash out. Lol

[o.pwuaioc]

DAMN!!!!
What did I start. I was just saying how people in general in today's market don't take pride in the food or jobs and I get all these comments. Hell im going back to try and get ready to pre order the snes mini so I won't be able to get one when I cash out. Lol

Say stupid shit, receive stupid shit.

[Mas]

DAMN!!!!
What did I start. I was just saying how people in general in today's market don't take pride in the food or jobs and I get all these comments. Hell im going back to try and get ready to pre order the snes mini so I won't be able to get one when I cash out. Lol

Say stupid shit, receive stupid shit.

Nah I usually get rolling eyes that's all.

[esteban]

DAMN!!!!
What did I start. I was just saying how people in general in today's market don't take pride in the food or jobs and I get all these comments. Hell im going back to try and get ready to pre order the snes mini so I won't be able to get one when I cash out. Lol

I know.



It was fun, though.

[TheClash603]

Shareholders are worse than CEOs, though CEOs are awful, as are entitled people.  The problem is at every layer there are problems and at every layer there are few solutions.  Humans are a complicated bunch.

It doesn't matter, because back to the automation discussion, most of these jobs will be gone soon.  That store in Seattle owned by Amazon with basically no workers is nearly done working out its kinks.  Wait til they purchase a few food chains too and deliver the food via drone.  This is my personal speculation, but Pizza Hut or Dominoes seem like a reasonable next step, now that Whole Foods has been purchased.

[seieienbu]

It doesn't matter, because back to the automation discussion, most of these jobs will be gone soon.  That store in Seattle owned by Amazon with basically no workers is nearly done working out its kinks.  Wait til they purchase a few food chains too and deliver the food via drone.  This is my personal speculation, but Pizza Hut or Dominoes seem like a reasonable next step, now that Whole Foods has been purchased.

...my sky pizza better be just as hot as my land-bound teenager-driven pizza.  [/entitlement]

[xcrement5x]

Wait til they purchase a few food chains too and deliver the food via drone.  This is my personal speculation, but Pizza Hut or Dominoes seem like a reasonable next step, now that Whole Foods has been purchased.

But if that happens, it will make it even harder to believe all those deliveryman pornos.

[esteban]

Sadly, I have a craving for pizza now.

GODDAMMIT.

No success in reducing my calories today.