Best First NEC System?

christoph · 09/22/2010, 02:34 AM

I have never REALLY taken the time to seriously play any NEC console - what is the best one?

I love shmups, and really any great games!

Tatsujin · 09/22/2010, 03:05 AM

I don't really get your question? Do you mean the best NEC system in general or just the best PC Engine/TG16 system? In the former case, there aren't much options left than the PC Engine/TG16 itself, since the rest NEC ever made are japanese personal computers (PC88/98) or the PCEs unsuccessful successor PC-FX, but which has litterally just one shmup in its whole and small game repertoire.

Just stick to a JP PC Engine and you will have litterally tons of good shmupses.

SignOfZeta · 09/22/2010, 03:06 AM

What you want, is a Duo R.

Its a higher initial investment than other systems, but once you buy an Arcade Card Duo it can play anything but Supergrafx games (which are more or less irrelevant).

The cheaper systems (Turbo Grafx 16, PC Engine Core) might make sense at first for someone just starting out, but the cost of a working CDROM2 add-on and an upgraded system card is often as much or more than it would have been to just buy a Duo in the first place. The main bulk of good PC Engine games are on HuCard or SuperCD. You really want to be able to play the Super CDs, which all Duos do.

christoph · 09/22/2010, 03:21 AM

hmmm...

sounds like I need an NEC history lesson

SignOfZeta · 09/22/2010, 03:23 AM

Well, they only made two systems. The PC Engine (with a couple of dozen variants) and the PC FX, which...you really don't want. Certainly not as your first system.

NecroPhile · 09/22/2010, 09:48 AM

Quote from: SignOfZeta on 09/22/2010, 03:06 AMWhat you want, is a Duo R.

This. The SX-1 was also pretty sweet, but kinda obsolete nowadays.

christoph · 09/22/2010, 12:58 PM

Whats the price on a DUO-R these days?

JoshTurboTrollX · 09/22/2010, 01:25 PM

DuoR should be around 150 ish.

Wasn't The GameCube built using NEC hardware?

NecroPhile · 09/22/2010, 01:45 PM

Quote from: JoshTurboTrollX-16 on 09/22/2010, 01:25 PMWasn't The GameCube built using NEC hardware?

Nope, it's built around a Power PC cpu and a gpu from former Silicon Graphics peeps. You're thinking of the 64, which used a NEC VR3400.

JoshTurboTrollX · 09/22/2010, 02:00 PM

Quote from: guest on 09/22/2010, 01:45 PM
Quote from: JoshTurboTrollX-16 on 09/22/2010, 01:25 PMWasn't The GameCube built using NEC hardware?
Nope, it's built around a Power PC cpu and a gpu from former Silicon Graphics peeps. You're thinking of the 64, which used a NEC VR3400.

oh yeah, thanks NecroPhile.

Quote from: christoph on 09/22/2010, 02:34 AMI love shmups, and really any great games!

To answer this question simply- you need a PC-FX.

Otaking · 09/22/2010, 03:26 PM

IMO start off with a HuCard based PC Engine Console either the:

PC Engine (original white model),
CoreGrafx,
CoreGrafx II

there is also the SuperGrafx which gives you access to another five games exclusivley made for it but it costs more than the above three so as a first console I would go for one of the above.

Once you've played the top shmup titles on HuCard such as Soldier Blade, Raiden, GunHed etc.. you can than later expand out and add a CD-Rom drive to any of the above HuCard based PC Engines to then have access to the CD-Rom titles.

ApolloBoy · 09/22/2010, 04:12 PM

I would second the Duo-R. The Duo-R, along with the other Duo systems, has the ability to play Super CD games right out of the box, and you don't have to futz around with System Cards unless you want to play Arcade CD games. The Duo-R is also very reliable, especially compared to the original TG-CD/PCE CD setup.

You also won't be able to play TG-16 HuCards on any Japanese system unless you mod it, but I wouldn't worry about that since the PC Engine equivalents of TG-16 games are usually cheaper. That, and most of the TG-16 exclusives suck so you won't be missing out on much.

Tatsujin · 09/22/2010, 04:26 PM

the GBA also used NEC parts

SignOfZeta · 09/22/2010, 05:07 PM

The most famous use of NEC parts in a non-NEC console is the Dreamcast, PowerVR.

christoph · 09/23/2010, 02:06 AM

Sounds like a Duo R is where its at. So what is the difference between the DUO R and the Turbo Duo? The DUO R is only available as a JP console right? Can I play NSTC games on it too?

Frank_fjs · 09/23/2010, 02:35 AM

Yeah the Duo R is the Japanese console.

All games are NTSC, both US and JAP so I don't really understand your question.

There were a few PAL consoles released in the UK & Hong Kong but they merely convert the games to a PAL signal via an additional onboard encoder. These consoles are not typical and they still played the same games, there were no specific PAL games that I am aware of.

The JAP console plays JAP games and the US console plays US games. You can play JAP games on a US console via an often overpriced converter. To play US games on a JAP system, you need to perform a hardware mod.

I like the JAP systems and games better, but that's just me. JAP games have awesome artwork, US games got ripped off in this department. JAP hardware & games often seem to be cheaper too & easier to come by.

christoph · 09/23/2010, 02:44 AM

So

Turbo Duo = USA
Duo R = JP

otherwise they are the same system?

I guess the only problem is that the games are then in Japanese..

Frank_fjs · 09/23/2010, 02:58 AM

That's all correct.

The Japanese (language) thing has never been a problem for me. Most Japanese games have a lot of English in them and the general GUI/HUD (score, life etc) items often appear in English anyhow.

I guess you'd only have a problem if you like RPG's or text heavy games.

christoph · 09/23/2010, 03:13 AM

For sure, thanks for the info. So really the main reason to go for a Duo-R is because the JP versions of the games are significantly cheaper?

Frank_fjs · 09/23/2010, 03:23 AM

I suppose. For me, I think that the Japanese hardware looks better, the games have better artwork and yeah, generally it is cheaper and more available.

As an example, the Japanese PC Engine console looks like this:

The US Turbo Grafx 16 like this:

I find the Japanese hardware much more pleasing to the eye. Why they made the US version so god damn big is beyond me, perhaps they thought it would give the impression of being more powerful.

I'm not from the US so I didn't feel the need to get a US system. If I lived in the US I might.

Tablet · 09/23/2010, 04:59 AM

Quote from: christoph on 09/23/2010, 02:44 AMTurbo Duo = USA
Duo R = JP

That's not entirely true, CD games are region free so you could buy a JP Duo-R and US Turbo CD releases will work on it.

As said before hueys are region locked and need converters and stuff to get to work. It all depends what you want to get out of the system, if you're into shooters then go the Duo-R route as it'll allow you to play all the JP only HuCard shooters and you'll still have the flexibility with the CD drive if you want to play english CD releases.

christoph · 09/28/2010, 03:15 AM

I ended up finding a sweet deal on a Turbo Grafx, which I just got in the mail today. I am going to keep my eye out for a Duo-R like you guys recommended.

I played Splatterhouse for about an hour this evening - TG16 controller feels hollow, it flexes when I press the buttons! Is there a "best" controller out there, or is the og TG16 the best one?

I really bought this to play R Type, don't really have any other games on my list at the moment - anyone recommend any MUST HAVES? I love shmups and any other great games.

yee

Arkhan Asylum · 09/28/2010, 03:23 AM

Quote from: JoshTurboTrollX-16 on 09/22/2010, 02:00 PMTo answer this question simply- you need a PC-FX.

euh, theres 1 shmup on PC-FX.

and "great games" might not mean "cutesy dating sims that I can't even read"

anyway what you want ultimately is a US TurboGrafx16 and then a Duo-R

play US hucards on the TurboGrafx, play anything else on the duo-r

reason for this suggestion is, the cost it would take to region mod the duo-r is probably a bit more than you can grab a TG-16 for, and since you already have the TG-16 .....

just get you a duo-r for Japanese HuCards and for CD games (Since the Duo-R has save ram)

The best controller, in my honest opinion, is the Ave 3 or 6. They're both the same but have 3 and 6 buttons respectively. They are amazing. I love them.

As for games you just have to have, we will keep it Turbo Grafx-16 for now, until you get a duo-r, and then we will bombard you with more games....

Lifeforce (Salamander in Japan, I'm sure you have heard of it!)
Bloodywolf (It's the closest to Contra you're gonna get)
Keith Courage (Because everyone has to play the pack-in game)
China Warrior (Because I said so, and hope you become one of the fans of the old, giant sprite kung fu extravaganza)
Dungeon Explorer (It's Gauntlet, with content!)
Legendary Axe 1 and 2 (Very nice, eerie action platformers)
Bonk 1, 2 and 3 (The best platformer series ever)
Neutopia I and II (Zelda clones that are better than Zelda)
Parasol Stars (Bubble Bobble part 3! You hit stuff with an umbrella to very happy music, and it's beyond addictive)
Cadash (Best home version of the arcade game. It's kind of like Castlevania on dope, sort of)
Silent Debuggers (Hard to describe. First person cyberpunk action game. You'll either love it or hate it)
Military Madness (One of the greatest strategy games ever. Simple yet effective)
Fantasy Zone (Strange shoot em up game. Kind of obnoxious, totally colorful, addicting like crack)

I think that's a good list for now. Theres some more stuff too... most of these games can be had pretty damn cheap also.

Oh, and duh, Blazing Lazers. Its vertical shmup goodness.

As far as shmups go, you picked the right system.

and FINALLY,

go to pcengine.co.uk and you can quickly see some screenshots and gameplay videos of these games to see if they appeal to you.

blueraven · 09/28/2010, 03:51 AM

The Black PC Engine Duo.

Otaking · 09/28/2010, 04:51 AM

Quote from: blueraven on 09/28/2010, 03:51 AMThe Black PC Engine Duo.

epic win

BlueBMW · 09/28/2010, 09:12 AM

Quote from: christoph on 09/23/2010, 02:06 AMSounds like a Duo R is where its at. So what is the difference between the DUO R and the Turbo Duo? The DUO R is only available as a JP console right? Can I play NSTC games on it too?

You can play any of the CD/SuperCD games on either a US or JP Duo. Hucard games are not interchangeable however. There are a variety of converter cards available and there are people who can region mod the systems. Honestly, most of the best games are available on PC Engine a lot cheaper than on the US TG16. You're probably best off getting a Duo R (JP of course) and then just finding a cheap US Turbo Grafx 16 if you want to play some US hu chips.

Personally, I'm going with a region modded US Duo, but that's just because the US Duo looks so slick.

JoshTurboTrollX · 09/28/2010, 10:09 AM

Quote from: guest on 09/28/2010, 03:23 AM
Quote from: JoshTurboTrollX-16 on 09/22/2010, 02:00 PMTo answer this question simply- you need a PC-FX.
euh, theres 1 shmup on PC-FX.

I was being sarcastic.

Don't go with the PC-FX.

Quote from: guest on 09/28/2010, 03:23 AMLifeforce (Salamander in Japan, I'm sure you have heard of it!)

Salamander is japan only. Would need to contact Chop for a chopsado to play it on a US Turbo!

NecroPhile · 09/28/2010, 10:19 AM

Quote from: christoph on 09/28/2010, 03:15 AMIs there a "best" controller out there, or is the og TG16 the best one?

I'm partial to the wireless PCE pads, but I'm not sure if they're any sturdier than the standard pads (they've never felt too flimsy to me). You might want to try an Avenue Pad 6, as they're pretty chunky and stout, but keep in mind that you'll need a converter cable (or swap the cable out of a TurboPad), as the TG-16 uses different controller connectors than everything else.

Quote from: christoph on 09/28/2010, 03:15 AMI really bought this to play R Type, don't really have any other games on my list at the moment - anyone recommend any MUST HAVES? I love shmups and any other great games.

In addition to those on Ark's list, everyone should have copies of Bomberman '93, Time Cruise, and New Adventure Island; and if you like shmups, Galaga '90, Soldier Blade, and Dead Moon are absolute musts.

Quote from: Psycho Arkhan on 09/28/2010, 03:23 AMThe best controller, in my honest opinion, is the Ave 3 or 6. They're both the same but have 3 and 6 buttons respectively.

They aren't the same. The 3 is shaped similar to a standard controller with its rounded ends, whereas the 6 is bigger and has square edges, making it not so nice to hold onto.

Arkhan Asylum · 09/28/2010, 12:24 PM

Quote from: JoshTurboTrollX-16 on 09/28/2010, 10:09 AMSalamander is japan only. Would need to contact Chop for a chopsado to play it on a US Turbo!

hmm,I coulda sworn there was a US release of Lifeforce, or was that Nintendo maybe.

SignOfZeta · 09/28/2010, 12:25 PM

Quote from: christoph on 09/23/2010, 02:44 AMSo

Turbo Duo = USA
Duo R = JP

otherwise they are the same system?

The Turbo Duo is the US version of the PC Engine Duo. The Duo R (or RX) is a later model that only came out in Japan. Functionally the only difference is that the Duo R (or RX) lacks the headphone jack.

QuoteI guess the only problem is that the games are then in Japanese..

The games will be in whatever language the were coded in, what system you play them on has no effect on this. A hardware mod will let any system play any game, so the original region doesn't really matter.

Also, a lot of PC Engine games are shooters and platform games and fighters and pinball and genres where the language the game is in is irrelevant. Also, a lot of Japanese games are totally in English anyway. In those cases the only "translation" done was to make a new shitty box for the US version and censor a few things.

christoph · 09/28/2010, 03:02 PM

You guys rock, thanks for all the great info.

Looks like I've got some hunting to do!

Mathius · 09/28/2010, 11:32 PM

You really, really, REALLY need to check this guy's video reviews out! If you want to get an idea to what games your looking for Chris Bucci's vids are a must see. They are the best Turbografx/PC Engine reviews on the net.

https://www.youtube.com/user/spida1a

DragonmasterDan · 09/29/2010, 08:40 AM

Quote from: christoph on 09/23/2010, 03:13 AMFor sure, thanks for the info. So really the main reason to go for a Duo-R is because the JP versions of the games are significantly cheaper?

The main reason to go for a Duo-R or RX is that they are known to be far more reliable than the likely to die original Turbo Duo or PC Engine Duo.

BlueBMW · 09/29/2010, 09:07 AM

Quote from: DragonmasterDan on 09/29/2010, 08:40 AMThe main reason to go for a Duo-R or RX is that they are known to be far more reliable than the likely to die original Turbo Duo or PC Engine Duo.

It also seems that sometimes a fully functional Duo R/RX is usually cheaper than a fully functional US Duo. So you could probably get a Duo R/RX + us TG16 for the price of a working / restored US Duo.

christoph · 09/29/2010, 12:54 PM

Nice. I watched some of that dudes videos.

So yeah, if anyone has R-TYPE, a DUO-R, and a AVE 6 Controller, I'd love to buy/trade for them all!

Thanks!

turbogrfxfan · 09/29/2010, 07:20 PM

i do. gotta be one hell of an offer

BlueBMW · 09/29/2010, 08:59 PM

Debating whether or not to let my US Rtype go.... i've got the two PC engine games..... I'll think bout it!

Tatsujin · 09/30/2010, 12:01 AM

1st Five "relatively" cheap games you have to get:

1. Gate of Thunder (will blow you out of your socks)
2. Winds of Thunder (ditto)
3. PC Genjin (a PC Engine is no real PC Engine w/o a PC Genjin)
4. Bomber Man '93 (ditto)
5. R-Type 1&2 or complete cd (still one of the most legendary games on the PC Engine, and also one of the very early killer apps. that helped the PC Engine to become what it is today).

Opethian · 09/30/2010, 12:58 AM

this man speaks the truth!

rag-time4 · 10/01/2010, 12:57 AM

Quote from: HardcoreOtaku on 09/28/2010, 04:51 AM
Quote from: blueraven on 09/28/2010, 03:51 AMThe Black PC Engine Duo.
epic win

Speaking of epic win... nice avatar!! HAHA