MSR *WILL* be finished, come hell or high water... hell more likely.

[OldRover]

QBASIC became QuickBASIC, which was both an interpreter and a compiler, using the same visual editor as QBASIC. To this day, it still retails for $150. There was also the Professional Development System which contained the last version of QuickBASIC, 7.1, but Visual BASIC For MS-DOS quickly replaced that. A freeware successor was written a number of years later by an uninvolved party, which was called freeBASIC. A direct descendent was then written a few years after that, called QB64, again from uninvolved people. freeBASIC is a BASIC-like true compiler that has tons of C-like features, QB64 is essentially a modern QBASIC clone that aims to be able to run all QBASIC code unmodified. I actually use freeBASIC for some of my utility work... most of the binary data files for MSR are assembled using tools developed in freeBASIC. The map editor for MSR was written in Visual Basic 6 though.

[touko]

yeah taking breaks is nice.

Im on a forced break right now.  Any code I code on the PCe right now means im blowing off my classes. lol

at least were almost to midterms, so i can be like FUCK YALL BITCHES IS PCE CODETIME AGAIN.

Why a break ???

it's the period for fuck fests in US   ??? or it was just a fucking mythe  ??

[blueraven]

So wait, is Mysterious Song actually available yet?

[MotherGunner]

Guys he said AFTER MSR is complete..they are still on RC1.

[Arkhan Asylum]

yeah taking breaks is nice.

Im on a forced break right now.  Any code I code on the PCe right now means im blowing off my classes. lol

at least were almost to midterms, so i can be like FUCK YALL BITCHES IS PCE CODETIME AGAIN.

Why a break ???

it's the period for fuck fests in US  ??? or it was just a fucking mythe  ??

 

no, a break because like I said here (and on Aetherbyte.com), I have classes til december 18th or so... and that is a bit more important since it cost like 4000$ to attend, lol

[touko]

and that is a bit more important since it cost like 4000$ to attend, lol

Lol, ok but 4000$, wahou, US school is very expensive ..

[Senshi]

and that is a bit more important since it cost like 4000$ to attend, lol

Lol, ok but 4000$, wahou, US school is very expensive ..

Lol...that's cheap for school. try 30,000 to 50,000 a year for some. (However I don't think they are worth it)

[Arkhan Asylum]

and that is a bit more important since it cost like 4000$ to attend, lol

Lol, ok but 4000$, wahou, US school is very expensive ..

Lol...that's cheap for school. try 30,000 to 50,000 a year for some. (However I don't think they are worth it)

Well this is for one semester and it's graduate school, lol.

The graduate program is far better than the undergrad in most colleges.  You actually learn shit!

[touko]

 

I understand why many americans people continue to pay schools credits, long after.

[termis]

Yeah, but the actual tuiton cost isn't necessarily what one pays.  I went to a school where the tuition fee was $24k year at the time (current tuition at $43k/yr), but after various grants, what I actually paid was close to zero (I did have to borrow for most of the housing costs, but I reckon that's more than fair).

[mrhaboobi]

so what would be great is for you guys to write a WHO TO start coding on PCe, different tools, what to use, how to set up, create a basic hello world, having played with PSX (Yaroze/C ), Xbox 360 (c#), id be keen to be a bit more old school and give the pce a look in, but would need some starters, hell a R-type or platform game with some commented source to get going would be ideal

[OldRover]

Hello World is easy in HuC:

Code Select Expand

#include "huc.h"

main()
{
load_default_font();
put_string("Hello, World!",9,13);
}
hehe.

I have a platformer engine coded in HuC that I've used in three games and a tech demo thus far, but it's not very well commented. If you want to go the HuC route, I could clean it up and toss it your way. If you want to go the assembly route, someone like TheOldMan would be better to talk to.

[mrhaboobi]

Hello World is easy in HuC:

Code Select Expand

#include "huc.h"

main()
{
load_default_font();
put_string("Hello, World!",9,13);
}
hehe.

I have a platformer engine coded in HuC that I've used in three games and a tech demo thus far, but it's not very well commented. If you want to go the HuC route, I could clean it up and toss it your way. If you want to go the assembly route, someone like TheOldMan would be better to talk to.

Id be keen on the HUC stuff, i dont think im ready to go down the assembly route.

[grahf]

Where can one grab the latest version of HuC?

[OldRover]

zeograd.com has the last released version, but it hasn't been updated since 2005. Tomatheous gave me a few new routines for it, and I added a couple of things as well, but such modifications are kept in-house. HuC desperately needs an official update, but its maintainer has abandoned it.

[OldMan]

Let's take this to a new topic... I'd really like to know....

zeograd.com has the last released version, but it hasn't been updated since 2005. Tomatheous gave me a few new routines for it, and I added a couple of things as well, but such modifications are kept in-house. HuC desperately needs an official update, but its maintainer has abandoned it.

What would you change/fix in Huc?
I have an include flag patch in place, along with some minor bug-fixes (ie, not skipping spaces correctly).
I'd like to split the library stuff up, so you could include only what you need, and -maybe- re-write the asembler to output linkable modules. Anyone interested in helping/testing?

[Arkhan Asylum]

They said they abandoned updating it because not enough people were using it.

But, I think not enough people are using it BECAUSE it needs an update...

yeah.

[OldRover]

I will test the fuck outta any changes made to HuC. We abused the hell out of it with MSR, exposing its myriad of limitations and bugs. Just the other day I came across yet another flaw, involving variables set global at the source level (as opposed to global in globals.h, which seems to be at an even higher scope). Slow array access is the biggest thing in dire need of fixing, and from there, proc shuffling for minimum space waste... or, as you guys call it, "backpacking".

If no one uses your stuff, there's no need to fix it. But if you don't fix it, no one will use it. It's a catch-22.

[Arkhan Asylum]

Slow array access is the biggest thing in dire need of fixing,

yeah , and IIRC, >> and << aren't any faster than multiplies/divides...

pointers didn't work right at all really, and there aren't any structs... we have a list of complaints over here already.   What other ones do you have Rover, lol.

at least the Aetherbyte HuC Tweak extravaganza makes it a little more useable.  I'm using it for Atlantean and will be using it for the other crap too.

[OldRover]

Stuff I would want to see:

-Fix array access (as above)
-"Auto-backpacking" (as above too)
-Remove the utterly useless gfx plotting routines (already did this here)
-Remove the broken sound code that just wastes space in hucard building
-Optimize scroll()
-Better mapper functions that support more than 256 unique tiles
-Getting rid of scan_map_table() and making the mapper support height/width greater than 256
-Add ACD and SGX capabilities to hulib (Tom did this already)
-Modify compiler/assembler to take advantage of the extra 24KB of SGX work RAM
-More intelligent verbose code output (backslashes screw it up at present)
-struct support
-C++ style comments (would help with verbose output, I think)
-goto keyword (being forced to do this in assembly is lame)
-Expansion of the overlay table (50 is fine until you get serious)
-The addition of a 24 bit variable type for addressing (there's one internally but it's not exposed)
-Much more intelligent use of zero page
-ADPCM streaming (Tom coded one, so I have it in my hulib)

I probably have more but this is about all I can think of for now. I've tried to fix things myself but it's just a nightmare... the code is a mess and things aren't done optimally.

[Arkhan Asylum]

-Much more intelligent use of zero page

I loled.

I wonder who would actually use a new / fixed HuC aside from You, and Aetherbyte.

Everyone else seems to just do asm.

[OldRover]

A few people have expressed interest, but without something worthwhile of recommendation... well, you know.

ChrisBee wants to start up his own group, but he said he doesn't really code. I think he wants to learn though. mrhaboobi is obviously interested too. I think HuC's limitations really squashed any early attempts at greatness... people like Trilinear just packed up their toys and went home once they found out how broken it was.

And we mustn't forget about hcf. He's a pretty serious coder too.

[OldMan]

I took the HuC discussion to a new topic, so everyone knows. (What Needs Fixed In HuC)

I wonder who would actually use a new / fixed HuC aside from You, and Aetherbutt.

I think HuC's limitations really squashed any early attempts at greatness

Genearal opinion seems to be "If it wasn't such a pos, maybe a lot more people would use it" :0

[Arkhan Asylum]

Genearal opinion seems to be "If it wasn't such a pos, maybe a lot more people would use it" :0

Yeah, but the creator (and his closer companions) are of the opinion that there is no point in fixing it if noone is using it... so either we fix it (as usual? ;)), or enough people start using HuC and make 900 bug reports.

I believe one of them also said "The only way to fix it really is to just rewrite the whole thing".  Not a great sign there.

[OldRover]

Just because one says it doesn't mean it's correct. Yeah, it's broken, but yeah, it can be fixed without reinventing the wheel.

[Arkhan Asylum]

A few people have expressed interest, but without something worthwhile of recommendation... well, you know.

ChrisBee wants to start up his own group, but he said he doesn't really code. I think he wants to learn though. mrhaboobi is obviously interested too. I think HuC's limitations really squashed any early attempts at greatness... people like Trilinear just packed up their toys and went home once they found out how broken it was.

And we mustn't forget about hcf. He's a pretty serious coder too.

My question was who would care about a new C tool?  The question becomes "is it worth it to organize a widescale, done-up-nicely" released version with documents/explanations/etc..... or a "yeah 3 of us care so heres the .zip of the current fix" hack job.

Doesn't hcf do asm?

I know Tom is of the "go asm or go home" walk.

Touko seems to be fine in asm, but maybe he would like a new HuC?  Touko? What say you!

If some of the original Zeograd.com demo creators showed up expressing interest, man that would be awesome.  Where did they all go?

Just because one says it doesn't mean it's correct. Yeah, it's broken, but yeah, it can be fixed without reinventing the wheel.

Oh I wasn't saying it was correct, I was just giving reasons why HuC is dead in the water right now.  I asked questions, made comments, got responses, and drew my own conclusions about the status of the thing.

[OldRover]

Well, it almost makes me want to just reinvent hulib for cc65. heh.

[Arkhan Asylum]

Well, it almost makes me want to just reinvent hulib for cc65. heh.

Who knows, it might be worth the effort.  lol

[mrhaboobi]

I think you would find that newbies to any platform ( like myself ) would rather attack it in C then ASM in the first instance, have a decent C plaftorm would make things easier, yaroze was C and then converted to C++, Psyq ( the proper pfx tools ) did allow C and ASM, and sure ASM makes alot of sense, but personally for me it would be easier to start in C and then transition if i need to.

[touko]

oh, a new release of huc will be fine ..
For now i'am using huc only for banks mapping (because his ASM generated code is too dirty) , and i have 85/90% of assembly in my current project ..
And of course with custom libs .

And i agree with rover for goto in C, this is very  usefull for speed, and code size reduction ..

[Arkhan Asylum]

Well HuC in it's current form is fine for noobinators, since its not like you'll spot all the disasters until you're really entrenched. 

[grahf]

Well I'd be interested in a less buggy release.  I did some x86 assembly when I was younger, but now the only two languages I kinda know are C and Python.  I keep planning on trying to build a little something in HuC, but I always put it off because of how finicky people say it is.

I think that having a C compiler that works as expected would be really useful in getting new people coding for the platform.

[OldRover]

Behold... the covert art.

/msrcover4.jpg

[TheClash603]

[grahf]

Looks good so far. Do you plan to clean up the SuperCD and HE System logos a bit? Those make it seem a bit rough..

[Arkhan Asylum]

I thought he was groping her and got all excited!

[hoobs88]

Behold... the covert art.

/msrcover4.jpg

Me likey!

[JoshTurboTrollX]

Behold... the covert art.

/msrcover4.jpg

That is really excellent!!  The four people on the cover, what are they're names?

[Arkhan Asylum]

play the game and you'll find out!

[NecroPhile]

The four people on the cover, what are they're names?

I count five.....

[_Paul]

The four people on the cover, what are they're names?

I count five.....

One's a ginger. Do they count as people now?

[OldRover]

Looks good so far. Do you plan to clean up the SuperCD and HE System logos a bit? Those make it seem a bit rough..

Black Tiger submitted the base image along with a low-res assembled test image. What you're seeing is the low-res assembled test image on the front there. The base image is extremely hi-res and doesn't have the logos, so new logos can be put onto it. So no worries... cleaner logos will be put on before this goes to manufacturing. I just printed these up to show off roughly how this will look when finished.

...and tharr be more... arr...

/msrcover2.jpg
/msrcover3.jpg

[Arkhan Asylum]

im digging the back.

[_Paul]

The back image is awesome, but I'd like to see perhaps a black bar on left with some screenshots and game info, maybe copyright info and logo along the bottom. That kind of stuff makes it look more authentic I think.

[OldRover]

I was considering putting something on the back... but I'm not sure. The insert art is a photograph of an actual painting by Rose-Marie Kossowan. I don't think I wanna mess with it.

[hoobs88]

Looks good so far. Do you plan to clean up the SuperCD and HE System logos a bit? Those make it seem a bit rough..

Any reason why you chose the PC Engine logo over the Turbo Duo logo?

[JoshTurboTrollX]

play the game and you'll find out!

I was mostly just wondering if the blue haired dude was Tiger...lol

[OldRover]

Any reason why you chose the PC Engine logo over the Turbo Duo logo?

I think he chose the PC Engine logo because we found a clean version of it. I don't know.

[Arkhan Asylum]

Any reason why you chose the PC Engine logo over the Turbo Duo logo?

I think he chose the PC Engine logo because we found a clean version of it. I don't know.

just scan any game and photoshop it.. lol duh.

I scanned the logos off my copy of Dragon Half for Insanity.


The back could use a few screenshots though.  Put them in a scatter on the back, like 3 screen shots in a > pattern....and then maybe duplicate the artwork for the manual so theres an unmolestered one to.

by > pattern, I mean

one here
                      one here

one here

[OldRover]

I don't have any games to scan... oh well.