Megaman PCE thread

[MottZilla]

That's an impressive demo. Is it practical to do the same technique while running an actual game? In other words is the only limitation the lack of memory? Though I'm guessing you lose some sound channels for sound effects that way?

Though don't forget that SNES did audio streaming in games like Clay Fighter and Earthworm Jim 2 as I recall.

[Arkhan Asylum]

That demo only takes 2 channels, IIRC.

So you'd have 4 left.

I am not 100% sure, but I am pretty sure doing a demonstration such as that one does eat up CPU resources, so you'd be better off doing what the PCE does best:  real chiptunes.

[CrackTiger]

That demo only takes 2 channels, IIRC.

So you'd have 4 left.

I am not 100% sure, but I am pretty sure doing a demonstration such as that one does eat up CPU resources, so you'd be better off doing what the PCE does best:  real chiptunes.

Straight chiptunes will always be the most efficient, but I've heard how sloppy many PCE devs were with efficiency in games that still did a lot. Doesn't the sound engine in Air Zonk use up something crazy like 30% cpu resource? Yet it still tosses around a ton of action with screens full of sprites and parallax. Something as slow and action-lite by PCE standards as Megaman X should leave a bunch if cpu power free for frivolous sound stuff like software adpcm.

[MottZilla]

That depends exactly how much in the way of cpu resources is taken up. If you wanted a comparable MMX1 on PCE all you need is SuperGrafx and the Arcade CDROM format. No problem then. ;)

[Arkhan Asylum]

That demo only takes 2 channels, IIRC.

So you'd have 4 left.

I am not 100% sure, but I am pretty sure doing a demonstration such as that one does eat up CPU resources, so you'd be better off doing what the PCE does best:  real chiptunes.

Straight chiptunes will always be the most efficient, but I've heard how sloppy many PCE devs were with efficiency in games that still did a lot. Doesn't the sound engine in Air Zonk use up something crazy like 30% cpu resource? Yet it still tosses around a ton of action with screens full of sprites and parallax. Something as slow and action-lite by PCE standards as Megaman X should leave a bunch if cpu power free for frivolous sound stuff like software adpcm.

Air Zonk is misleadingly action packed.  You don't waste much CPU resources just flinging retarded enemies at the player in predetermined patterns, lol.

There isn't exactly a bunch of AI.  It's just a bunch of pre-done sprite pushing.   So yeah, it can waste tons of CPU on the audio.

a game that has considerably more intelligent AI wouldn't be able to pull it off so good.

Plus, horizontal scrolling line parallax isn't a CPU whore process either.

[Nando]

The PCE Hu-card limitation is probably 256MB limit, if done correctly. If we compared the SNES carts, to the PCE HU, and was released simutameously, they would match up. I mean all the post MMX games after the first one, up till, X5.

We are thinking about limitation, but most of the effects in 2d videogames are programmed effects, not just sprite, or background overlapping. The voice, and audio waves could be stored as with TOPSNES, and video data could run as well, but most likely will be shorter.

Lets not think about the limitations of the past, however, lets think about the abundance, ( and cheapness ) of the future.

let alone do the music justice the way that only the SNES can?

HOLY CRAP!

[CrackTiger]

That demo only takes 2 channels, IIRC.

So you'd have 4 left.

I am not 100% sure, but I am pretty sure doing a demonstration such as that one does eat up CPU resources, so you'd be better off doing what the PCE does best:  real chiptunes.

Straight chiptunes will always be the most efficient, but I've heard how sloppy many PCE devs were with efficiency in games that still did a lot. Doesn't the sound engine in Air Zonk use up something crazy like 30% cpu resource? Yet it still tosses around a ton of action with screens full of sprites and parallax. Something as slow and action-lite by PCE standards as Megaman X should leave a bunch if cpu power free for frivolous sound stuff like software adpcm.

Air Zonk is misleadingly action packed.  You don't waste much CPU resources just flinging retarded enemies at the player in predetermined patterns, lol.

There isn't exactly a bunch of AI.  It's just a bunch of pre-done sprite pushing.   So yeah, it can waste tons of CPU on the audio.

a game that has considerably more intelligent AI wouldn't be able to pull it off so good.

Plus, horizontal scrolling line parallax isn't a CPU whore process either.

I figured that Air Zonk isn't the same as a standard platformer (although I've heard that collision in shooters can be the cause of games like TFIV choking), since it'd be more like Metal Slug, but Mega Man X still doesn't seem like much for the PCE to handle, aside from however much dynamic tiles might be used for parallax. The AI in MMX games doesn't seem much deeper than the Famicom MM games.

[Kaijuboy]

I'm sure other peeps around here still have it. Try asking nicely. Maybe you'll get lucky.

Can some kind, wonderful, altruistic soul lead me to this fine fine download?  

[Keith Courage]

I'm sure other peeps around here still have it. Try asking nicely. Maybe you'll get lucky.

Can some kind, wonderful, altruistic soul lead me to this fine fine download?   

Yeah, I know. That is what I was hoping for as well.

[Frank_fjs]

Are you guys after the Megaman CD ISO? If so, I have it, does the original author (Bonknuts?) mind if I submit a download link?

[Keith Courage]

I am after the one with the CD music. It just adds so much to the game.

[Frank_fjs]

Ah, pretty sure I don't have that one then. It's only a few meg and although it plays music it doesn't appear to be redbook audio, sounds like old fashioned chip music to me.

[Bernie]

Most likely that is the one you have Frank.  The CD version wasn't up long, and not many knew about it. 

[Kaijuboy]

Most likely that is the one you have Frank.  The CD version wasn't up long, and not many knew about it. 

Do you happen to have one of these elusive CD-audio versions?....  O:)

[Bernie]

I dont think the author wants it out right now, since it is not finished.

[Nando]

Most likely that is the one you have Frank.  The CD version wasn't up long, and not many knew about it. 

Do you happen to have one of these elusive CD-audio versions?....  O:)

I'm clueless on this, MOAR info please

[esadajr]

Yeah, better wait for the version with the disclaimer. Cool project indeed.

[KnightWarrior]

Mega Man 8-bit Collections NES version anyone

[Bardoly]

Any more updates on this project?

Thanks in advance.

[Bloody Wolf]

Ahh Mega Man.... Haha i luv this game!!!

[TurboXray]

Most likely that is the one you have Frank.  The CD version wasn't up long, and not many knew about it.  

Do you happen to have one of these elusive CD-audio versions?....  O:)

I'm clueless on this, MOAR info please

This?

I'm currently still in hibernation, but when I wake up in a couple of months... we'll see what happens

[Nando]

Most likely that is the one you have Frank.  The CD version wasn't up long, and not many knew about it. 

Do you happen to have one of these elusive CD-audio versions?....  O:)

I'm clueless on this, MOAR info please

This?

I'm currently still in hibernation, but when I wake up in a couple of months... we'll see what happens

OH so sweet sounding! Looks smooth!

[KnightWarrior]

Just do a Mega Man Anniversary Collection on the PC Engine/Turbo

Don't include Mega Man 7, 8 and Power Battle Games

[ParanoiaDragon]

Just do a Mega Man Anniversary Collection on the PC Engine/Turbo

Don't include Mega Man 7, 8 and Power Battle Games

Scratch that.  DO include them, as well as Mega Man & Bass, Mega Man's 9 & 10, & the Power Fighter etc. games!  Hell, make a 2D version of Super Adventure Rockman, & update the Mega Man PC games!

[Keith Courage]

Yes Bonknuts, that's the one I was talking about. The updated CD music adds so much to the game. Some games I am more partial to chip tunes but the CD sound on this one really works for me.

[Nando]

How about Willy War graphics with the CD choones?  yes, no, maybe so?

[KnightWarrior]

It would be pushing the Hardware if you include Mega Man & Bass, Power Battle Games,  MM 7, 8, 9 & 10

Just do Mega Man 1-6 on HuCard

[ParanoiaDragon]

I don't know, I feel like only MM8 would take a real hit in the gfx department.  I think MM&B, 7, & Power Fighters could be replicated fairly accurately, though deffinitely paralax would have to be changed around.  9 & 10 are basically NES games, so, they'd be easy peasy to pull off.

[KnightWarrior]

9 & 10 are basically NES games

How so??

You can't just put it on a NES cart and play..It's programmed diffenet

[Arkhan Asylum]

9 & 10 are basically NES games

How so??

You can't just put it on a NES cart and play..It's programmed diffenet

They use graphics from, or on par with the NES games.

They sound like NES games.

They even let you turn on slowmo/sprite flicker like an NES game mode.



However, they both suck.  Really bad.

[Mathius]

9 & 10 are basically NES games

How so??

You can't just put it on a NES cart and play..It's programmed diffenet

They use graphics from, or on par with the NES games.

They sound like NES games.

They even let you turn on slowmo/sprite flicker like an NES game mode.



However, they both suck.  Really bad.

I thoroughly enjoy MM9. It's pure nostalgia. I can't comment on MM10 but I haven't heard good things.

[ParanoiaDragon]

I think both are great, though I think MM9 is alot better then 10.

[TurboXray]

Hey, look what I found...

[OldMan]

Good Job. Glad to see you back.

[Drakon]

I demand cd audio for this thing of beauty...

Hey, look what I found...

[VestCunt]

Hey, look what I found...

Wow. You're rapidly making my NES obsolete!

[CrackTiger]

Hey, look what I found...

This is literally a dream come true for me.

[Opethian]

Megaman 2 tunes are legendary! cant wait!

[BigusSchmuck]

Hey, look what I found...

Thats pretty cool, so what are your plans on distributing this gem?

[TurboXray]

Hey, look what I found...

Thats pretty cool, so what are your plans on distributing this gem?

A pressed CD? A real hucard? Sony DADC CD-Rs from a professional replicator (probably the best option given the cost and such)? I dunno. What do you guys want??? Though to be honest, I'm not really interested in getting dragged to court by Capcom ;>_> Someone else should handle... ehm.... that aspect of it? A few members here could set something up? I dunno.

 I kind of like the CD format as it gives the option for CDDA/redbook tracks (or original chiptunes).


 BTW, I made a test video:

This is literally a dream come true for me.

I figured quite a few people wanted Megaman 2 instead of MM1 For MM1, I got a hit of about 150 views on my site/blog and that was with a lot of people referencing it from other sites (I can see the redirects). With my MM2 post, which I didn't really advertize, got 300+ views in like 4 hours.

Megaman 2 tunes are legendary! cant wait!

I need to tighten up the audio emulation a bit (fix the sweep support), but otherwise the audio came out pretty decent so far. But yeah, MM2 has the most memorable tracks out of any MM game.
 

I demand cd audio for this thing of beauty...

Shall I setup a donation thingy for it, for requests? ;)


 Since this MM2 went so well (I still can't believe it only took 4 hours to get it up and running, and that includes the time to play through it and beat it ), I'm looking into the other megaman games as well. MM3 and MM5 have a totally different setup than MM1,2,4, and 6. But I'm up for the challenge I was thinking maybe a dual pack release per CD. I don't know if I showed off the new sprite work for MM1 (megaman and cutman have all new sprites), but it was a pain in the ass to do. So much so, that I might just work on redoing the background tiles and maps for now.

 I love the MM series and so this is a labor of love for me. But it does suck not to be able to... well, get a return on the hundreds and hundreds hours put into this backend emulation code/support. Morality/ethics/whatever issue aside (not that they don't have merit), I don't want any legal trouble or such. I mean, it's my own fault for not putting that time into something original that I could sell. So with that in mind, I was thinking about making a megaman type of game (clone) for the PCE. Feedback?

[BigusSchmuck]

Hey, look what I found...

Thats pretty cool, so what are your plans on distributing this gem?

A pressed CD? A real hucard? Sony DADC CD-Rs from a professional replicator (probably the best option given the cost and such)? I dunno. What do you guys want??? Though to be honest, I'm not really interested in getting dragged to court by Capcom ;>_> Someone else should handle... ehm.... that aspect of it? A few members here could set something up? I dunno.

 I kind of like the CD format as it gives the option for CDDA/redbook tracks (or original chiptunes).

 BTW, I made a test video:

This is literally a dream come true for me.

I figured quite a few people wanted Megaman 2 instead of MM1 For MM1, I got a hit of about 150 views on my site/blog and that was with a lot of people referencing it from other sites (I can see the redirects). With my MM2 post, which I didn't really advertize, got 300+ views in like 4 hours.

Megaman 2 tunes are legendary! cant wait!

I need to tighten up the audio emulation a bit (fix the sweep support), but otherwise the audio came out pretty decent so far. But yeah, MM2 has the most memorable tracks out of any MM game.
 

I demand cd audio for this thing of beauty...

Shall I setup a donation thingy for it, for requests? ;)


 Since this MM2 went so well (I still can't believe it only took 4 hours to get it up and running, and that includes the time to play through it and beat it ), I'm looking into the other megaman games as well. MM3 and MM5 have a totally different setup than MM1,2,4, and 6. But I'm up for the challenge I was thinking maybe a dual pack release per CD. I don't know if I showed off the new sprite work for MM1 (megaman and cutman have all new sprites), but it was a pain in the ass to do. So much so, that I might just work on redoing the background tiles and maps for now.

 I love the MM series and so this is a labor of love for me. But it does suck not to be able to... well, get a return on the hundreds and hundreds hours put into this backend emulation code/support. Morality/ethics/whatever issue aside (not that they don't have merit), I don't want any legal trouble or such. I mean, it's my own fault for not putting that time into something original that I could sell. So with that in mind, I was thinking about making a megaman type of game (clone) for the PCE. Feedback?

A clone would be cool. Instead of calling it Megaman, call it Turboman? I know you can't link the game on these forums in its current state but I and many other people here would love to play it on the turbo without having to digg out our nes just to play some Megaman. I have lots of memories of that game and its endless sequels (especially Megaman 3)

[Drakon]

ditto.  Megaman 2 is the game that made me into a gamer.  As for the choice of cd audio that might be tough, but if you're the guy who made gate of thunderforce then I trust in your audio judgement!

Hey, look what I found...

This is literally a dream come true for me.

[ParanoiaDragon]

Just tie it to the Shockman series, & call it a day.

[Nando]

Just tie it to the Shockman series, & call it a day.

ShubibibibibibiBIBIBIN 4

I'd give money to support a new game and/or the fan port (see what I did there?) Hell even if it's a sprite swap with a few surprises here and there it would be cool.

[burn_654]

Bonknuts, it's great to see your incredible work on these ports continuing! I'm in awe. 

I wonder...there's tons of very capable Megaman hacking utilities out there...would it be possible to patch the internal nes binary with one of the hacks? I know you had to reorient a fair amount of things in the nes binary, is that correct? Or is the nes code fairly untouched?

I just think the possibilities to port over the better Megaman hacks to pce (not to mention the ability to create new ones) with remixed music and/or graphics has TONS of potential.

As well I just want to say it's great to see you back in the scene a bit. Your pce hacking efforts and documents are just incredible!

[NecroPhile]

Even though I've never been a huge fan of Megaman (not that they're bad games though), I'd love to see a clone game, especially so if it's two player. 

[TailChao]

Just saw the post on your blog during lunch.
Great job, man. This is really awesome stuff

Edit:

I don't want any legal trouble or such. I mean, it's my own fault for not putting that time into something original that I could sell. So with that in mind, I was thinking about making a megaman type of game (clone) for the PCE. Feedback?

I don't see why this wouldn't be a good idea.
It would be tough to generate, say, a MegaMan 3 level of content in a short amount of time. The originals are really fantastically designed.
But luckily you can't get sued for borrowing mechanics, only characters.

I can't speak for level design, but it seems you have (more than enough of) the technical background to pull it off. So go for it

[BlueBMW]

Ill happily pay good money for anything mega man related on pce.

[TurboXray]

Good Job. Glad to see you back.

Thanks Good to be back

I wonder...there's tons of very capable Megaman hacking utilities out there...would it be possible to patch the internal nes binary with one of the hacks? I know you had to reorient a fair amount of things in the nes binary, is that correct? Or is the nes code fairly untouched?

I just think the possibilities to port over the better Megaman hacks to pce (not to mention the ability to create new ones) with remixed music and/or graphics has TONS of potential.

Yeah, using existing hacks is very doable. I don't hack much of the rom to begin with (less than 0.01% or so if you compare it against just the code of the rom, i.e. excluding graphics/maps/sound/data/etc), but if the rom hack someone made was above and beyond what the editors do.. that is to say they did ASM hacking to the rom and not just graphics/sprite/maps, then I'd have to do a little more port opcode hunting down. But with my tool I made, it makes that much easier. And so yeah, even with an ASM hack it's doable. But traditional hacks are cake (usually no modifications needed). I have Dragon Warrior running on PCE CD (it was the very first nes2pce game I did) and after it was up and running, I took Sliver-X's hack of Dragoon Omega and applied it to the rom. It worked perfectly.

Even though I've never been a huge fan of Megaman (not that they're bad games though), I'd love to see a clone game, especially so if it's two player. 

As for an original game, I've though about two player mode. A four player mode would be hilarious, but complicated for balancing. Anyway, I thinking that maybe the two players could share the same life and weapon energy bar, and if either player dies they have to restart. Something along those lines.

[Nando]

As for an original game, I've though about two player mode. A four player mode would be hilarious, but complicated for balancing. Anyway, I thinking that maybe the two players could share the same life and weapon energy bar, and if either player dies they have to restart. Something along those lines.

That's pretty interesting. Would foster more team play.

Four player could be manic, but doable, I think; besides the regular metalslug/megaman like game play, you can set up a vertical scrolling platform heavy rainbow islands like stages. Just one idea.