Attract more users we add a Dreamcast and NEC computer section ?

[RegalSin]

You see the NEC computers is where the real party is at, and while the PCE out do the NEC in every way possible, in the box. We might be able to get those people who do not touch the PCE.

This says the NEC console forms, but back then even a computer was considered a console for the video-game enthusiast before the Atari 2600 came to boot.

Next I would also include the Dreamcast section, because the NEC power VR, was chosen over an American competitor ( part of the reason why the N64 was popular in the west ).

Lastly I would include a NEC arcade section, but that is just throwing a bone out there. I do not know too much about that, but I am sure their was a small series.

Give the Toganowa Company a run for it's money.

[kazekirifx]

An NEC computer section would be cool, since I'm not real satisfied with Tokugawa's forums, but it could be just a retro Japanese PC section in general (since I need a place to post about X68k and FM Towns too). On the other hand, narrowing it down to NEC computers keeps it more in line with the original intent of the site.

Not sure why there should be a Dreamcast section. Perhaps a Sega consoles section? Nah. Would have to make a Nintendo one and a Sony one too then.

[RegalSin]

1. Absolutely no classing anything as retro. When computers started to become portable, I am talking about when they were called Micro-computers. It was ( and still from a certain point of view ) amazing to have something the size of a record player/turn table, where you could play arcade styled video-games. The flat fact I do not want a retro anything.

Retro is a commercial term, the marketers are using to make consumers feel they are buying gold. Instead of calling it old, just call it retro. When a person call something old, they are classing it as no-good.

When it comes to video games, the original hardware is part of the actual experience. It should be must for a consumer to get the original hardware if they can. However if they live in a nation like Brasil, where they are still selling SMS, or China, where they release another Famicom everyday. They should focus on emulation.

Imagine if their was no consoles, We would all have NEC computers hooked up to our televisions,
...........................

The Dreamcast has the NEC power VR, which was used in some other machines as well. NEC by this time, has granted all it's powers to the MPC giant known as Windows. Windows CE, is remarkable for programmers, because it was C programming and little hassle. They had to be as cheap and simple as possible.

Sega Saturn was the last stand alone SEGA system, where Hatachi, and JVC were partners. According to ILLBleed ( that game you should play for the Dreamcast ), the Saturn was hell to program for.

The flatfact is that NEC was the power VR inside the Dreamcast, so the Dreamcast should be considered a NEC product. Just as the PCE is considered a Hudson product. Big fish eat little fish?

Hudson > NEC > SEGA >? Microsoft?

The Power VR believe it or not, was sold stand alone for PC computers
as well ( unless I am mistaken ).

Dreamcast is NEC powered,...........embed with the powers of Windows CE, and the ease of C# programming.

[kazekirifx]

1. Quite a fuss over the word "retro". You know what I mean, regardless of the word used.

2. Including the DC because it contains an NEC chip? That's awfully arbitrary I think. Stretching a bit for the existence of an NEC console after the PC-FX aren't we?

[RegalSin]

To keep things short, I stay within in the respect of reach. If I said retro, or antic, it is not respectful at all. It also drives up the prices, and generate consumers, consumers who buys games just to see the graphics of the original thing. I am just hoping for a section added, in reference to NEC computers because their are so many titles, and the thing was ( is ) being treated as a game system. I am officially a PCE guy right now, but I am trying to dive into that world as long as I can.

The Dreamcast Power VR is the heart and the soul of the Dreamcast, and NEC being a Japanese company, is probably most of the Dreamcast exclusive games never made it to, to the PS2, or X-box.

Think of it like this. The NEC PC was the by popular game machine that
was not too expensive or less expensive for a computer person, while the Dreamcast was NEC leaving the building, from videogames as well.

For the PCE, I would probably reference the Hudson Bee Card Catcher as a system as well, along with any other system on a system. The Hudson bee card system, via MSX was Hudsons first move into the console market ( unless mistaken ).  I 100% believe that Hudson original plan was to make a game system from the success of it's card system, as well as for it to become what the Microsoft floppys were.
This could be another section as well I guess, but that is Hudson.

[kazekirifx]

The sound processor and the GD-ROM drive are from Yamaha. Maybe it is not an NEC console, but a Yamaha console.

The CPU in the Xbox 360 is made by IBM. Does that make the 360 an IBM console?

[RegalSin]

I see what your trying to get at, but the flat fact that most game systems require a second party, in order to get built. Nintendo is probably the only one that is lacking an outside party ( asides the Yukaza, unless I am mistaken. )

The X-box purpose was to bring videogame users, to the computer gamers world. The system was nicknamed after the "Direct X" AKA
X-box. The biggest comparison to the Dreamcast and PCE is the
usage of C#. IBM, Mafia soft, and Intel all have been partners forever.
The X-box purpose is not served and videogame users are now diving into the world of windows. Sooner or later all X-box fans will be no different then Windows users. That was the purpose in mind.
Mafiasoft started from IBM. Intel makes processors specifically for
Windows.

It is a win win situation.

IBM = computer parts
Mafiasoft = floppy A, and Windows
Intel = processor

Put them all together you make any standard PC setup. The difference is that IBM is a parent company and does business on a national scale,
especially with US. If you work in a government, military, or business office you most likely see IBM machines, disguised as Dells.

A Dell is basically a collaboration of absorbed computer companies. Meaning failed or too small companies, that tried to compete. They are like EA but in computers.

.....................

[jlued686]

Considering the recent influx of a-holes, is attracting more users a good idea?

[RegalSin]

Hey...Anything Goes.........cha cha cha

[kazekirifx]

And, personally, I have no problem using the term "retro". Maybe the word does not have the same connotations to you as it does to me, but I don't think that my use of the word implies that I am not a real PCE player, or that I am one of those posers who just bought an "old school Nintendo" from Goodwill so I can play Super Mario Bros. in the living room while I smoke my dope. I find the term useful just because I do play a lot of current gen games these days, and I do like to make a distinction between current gen games and previous gen games. That is all the term is to me. Personally, current gen will never be as 'good' as retro stuff from the late '80s/early '90s. To me, this was and IS when the best games ever were produced... and I choose to call it "retro". So what?

Are you going to call out retrowaretv.com for using the term too?

[RegalSin]

Why not just turn your back, on the current gen and join the 2d side, once and for all. It is uncensored, does not have a warning label, and ignites your imagination, by ten folds.

I understand their are some game I want to play but man, they are just not worth it, anymore. The only way I can see these being worth it, if you brought the games new and cheap, and then wait for the prices to rise in the next ten years.

[kazekirifx]

Why not just turn your back, on the current gen and join the 2d side, once and for all. It is uncensored, does not have a warning label, and ignites your imagination, by ten folds.

I understand their are some game I want to play but man, they are just not worth it, anymore. The only way I can see these being worth it, if you brought the games new and cheap, and then wait for the prices to rise in the next ten years.

I've been there. It was 2000-2006. I pretty much sat out the whole PS2/GC/Xbox generation (played the DC a bit) and focused a lot on (what I refer to as) retro Japanese PC's. Bought a PC-9821, X68k, FM-Towns, and MSX. I had a firm belief nothing made after 1995, or outside Japan, was worth playing. Also focused a lot on collecting Neo Geo MVS, original Famicom and consoles from that general era during that time.

In early 2007 my brother somehow convinced me to buy a PS3. It took a while before I was completely convinced I hadn't wasted my money. Eventually, the Assassin's Creed series changed the way I play video games, and expanded the kind of games I was willing to spend my time on. I understand not everyone likes that particular game, but somehow it just clicked for me. Certain games just seem to 'click' with certain people, and not necessarily everyone.

I'm still very much into the older consoles - I wouldn't be using this message board otherwise - but my options have expanded, and I no longer see any necessity to choose one or the other. Late '80s/early '90s will always be my favorite chapter of gaming, and I will always come back to it - especially during frequent gatherings with like-minded gamers. I'm still occasionally uncovering new games from this period, and constantly collecting them. So, these systems are not really something that only exist in past-tense for me, yet I understand that their time has passed. That's why they are retro to me. In a way, they remind me of a fonder time, a more innocent time when I was still a child, and so the nostalgic feelings that come with the word "retro" are not necessarily a bad thing for me.

I can understand your argument that the term was coined to sell older games to current gen gamers - through things like the Wii Virtual Console and XBLA I suppose - however I feel that the term has been adopted widely enough by gamers, and really don't have a problem with it. What should we use instead? "Classic" isn't much better IMO. Should we just refer to each console by its name? Or say "16-bit generation", etc?

[RegalSin]

retro Japanese PC's. Bought a PC-9821, X68k, FM-Towns, and MSX. I had a firm belief nothing made after 1995, or outside Japan, was worth playing. Also focused a lot on collecting Neo Geo MVS, original Famicom and consoles from that general era during that time.

You had the right idea in mind.

I'm still very much into the older consoles - I wouldn't be using this message board otherwise - but my options have expanded, and I no longer see any necessity to choose one or the other. Late '80s/early '90s will always be my favorite chapter of gaming, and I will always come back to it - especially during frequent gatherings with like-minded gamers. I'm still occasionally uncovering new games from this period, and constantly collecting them. So, these systems are not really something that only exist in past-tense for me, yet

I understand that their time has passed.

You just decided to rejion the ranks of the followers. The ranks that I just had to move away from. The ones who still thinks eating fast food is an option. I can no longer serve those ranks. Their was one game, that almost made me want to buy a PS3 and that was portal, but then I said, hey you know it is ten times fun to watch the darn thing, when the graphics even surpass reboot, and Starwars.

I do not know why you lke Assasin Creed. All I know is that it might appeal to j-rpg people like me, dad people, and of course the prinson culture crowd. The game was advertised as a movie.

That's why they are retro to me. In a way, they remind me of a fonder time, a more innocent time when I was still a child, and so the nostalgic feelings that come with the word "retro" are not necessarily a bad thing for me.

Now you are an adult you can appreciate what you never exprienced. Like the saying
"If I never seen it, then it is new for me". You can play online via Kalleria, and sample videogames before you purchase. With the neo-game consoles, you can't do that. Your stuck being a consumer. The only reason why it was fun, was because we had
other people to play with. Now you can enjoy for your purpose alone. I hate living in the moment. I rather live in my memories, and the memories of others. I can not go back to that world, I have gone so far, even with my wing clipped.

I can understand your argument that the term was coined to sell older games to current gen gamers - through things like the Wii Virtual Console and XBLA I suppose

Lets be fair in 1999 would you pay for something that you could never sell, never truly own, or never actually be able to store? When people buy invisible items they are basically classing their products no differnt then produce. Produce ( food substance ), is a one way ticket, and my or anybody meida products should never be like that. Everybody has a value. Our organs alone are worth tens and thousands of dollars to the right buyer, that is how it should be for videogames.

however I feel that the term has been adopted widely enough by gamers,

Gamer is just a manager word for person who is an impulsive consumer for videogames. Just like the word Anime is an idiot word for person looking for Japanese
animation. How do you know you are implusive? When you buy something, that gives limited joy, and not infinitive joy, or representive joy. Like when I got DKN64 brand new, and was like WTF is this rubbish??? Then my mind just kept on saying, "hey at least you got an expansion pack.............and it costed 60 dollars. The same t hing happened when I got PN03 and was like, "where are the dead bodies on the space colony", and was like oh, so she was robot all this time", and I go through
the same exact room about 500 times" I think the last disappointing game exprience was Xenosaga................I can not have dissapointment. again. recently I decided to rebuy Metroid Prime, because I missed the game.

What should we use instead? "Classic" isn't much better IMO. Should we just refer to each console by its name? Or say "16-bit generation", etc?

I just call them standard games, and call the more recent releases neo-games, or crappy plastic light Motion death games LMDs. Or just call the newer ones rubbbish, because that is what they are.

It is like I look at the stufff and know what it is, but seriously, I am beyond this stuff.
I mean who do you think they are fooling? It is like my eyes have been wide open and I can see the commercialism, copy cay behaviour on so many levels.

0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
To divide the generations it could be like this

Computer games /Videogames  -  That how things stayed until the X-box.
After that all previous computer systems are to be considered game systems.
The way I saw it is like this. ( MSX, SMS, NES PCE, NEC, Atari, Amiga ) that was videogames until 2001.

.........
Post 2001 games - Crap games - neo games LMD ( Light motion death games ) etc
Everything since then has been blah blah gimmick, after gimmick, after gimmick. I mean seriously.

[kazekirifx]

So, you're using the reverse of the terminology everyone else is using. Instead of current gen games being the default, it is the previous gen games, and current gen is "neo-games". Interesting concept, but it ceases to be very useful when the vast majority of people use the opposite terminology. (If there's any place you can sell this idea, it's message boards like this one, though.) Does anyone else actually use the term "neo-game" or did you make it up? I hadn't heard it before, and I don't think I would have known what it meant outside of the context above.

Everything since then has been blah blah gimmick, after gimmick, after gimmick. I mean seriously.

There was a time when games having multiple screens was a gimmick. When Xevious was new, scrolling was a gimmick. When Donkey Kong country was new, pre-rendered characters were a gimmick. There've always been gimmick games. Not all gimmicks catch on, but generally yesterday's gimmicks become today's staples of game design.

You just decided to rejion the ranks of the followers. The ranks that I just had to move away from.

You are me in 2000. Maybe you will 'rejion' the ranks like I did later. Maybe you're less far along the continuum than I am.
If rejioning the ranks means I get to play Assassin's Creed 3 this fall, I am a happy indoctrinated follower of the masses.

Anyway, I'm sure most would agree there's no point in arguing which is 'better', new games or old games. I, for the record, wouldn't choose new games if I had to choose between one or the other.

[RegalSin]

Does anyone else actually use the term "neo-game" or did you make it up? I hadn't heard it before, and I don't think I would have known what it meant outside of the context above.

That is how I define, the recent games, since the post Dreamcast/PS2 days. After that it was downhill from their.
If videogaems were standard, then they would have intergrated the original consoles into newer, consoles. Like lets take the WiiU, We all know if Nintendo installed a cart slot for NES games people would buy them, Instead they just did the same exact thing and added a tingle controller, AKA VMU. They destoryed our world and people just pretend that it never happened at all.

Think about how stupid things are now. The Sega Saturn is in the Videogame museum, with Panzer Dragon, meanwhile Visual C++ will not compile exe files after 2005, edition. I can't even make an html file on my
windows 7 anymore. They gave our entire generation the middle finger, and we are just going to be happy campers, and support them?

..................................................

About gimmicks I mean releasing something that does not need to be released like the Nintendo Wii, or a game system that dies on you.

..................................................

You play your assasins creed, and when it hit 3.99 in the stores and it is brand new, I will pick that copy up,
if it has not been put into the dumpster yet. That is how much love these retailers have.

[kazekirifx]

Like lets take the WiiU, We all know if Nintendo installed a cart slot for NES games people would buy them,

Why would they do that? I know it would be convenient, but how are they going to make money by giving people the capability to play NES carts? Are they going to start releasing NES carts again and charge $50+ for each of them?

[RegalSin]

Because people will be encouraged to make videogames for the previous systems allowing
more innovative products to be made for the SNES, NES, N64 etc. Think about it like this,
you now have the power to  release "Earthbound 3" on the N64 in cart format with the extra chipset needed to run the game but in one cart, and distubute it to users, across the globe.
However their is a negative impact would of course, Like what happend to people who made X-box games.

Like right now, we have Mysterous Song, being released, along with Insanity. You see the problem now?

Imagine having the power to play an MSX in a PS3 and just renaming it MSX4. Imagine if the Dreamcast came back and merdged with the PC engine, and called it the Dream Engine. That is the kind of power we are cooking with.

Imagine an NES being re-released but their was a cd rom drive below the cart slot.

We would be making a product for everybody, old and young. The only thing that would get collected would
be computer games, and that is merly ordering the right parts, Imagine building a super NEC computer gameing
system, with cassette loaders, floppys, and FM and midi sound. That would balance the equation or expression.

[kazekirifx]

None of that will ever happen.

I do love how the homebrew scene is breathing new life into our old consoles, and I will always choose to play them on the real, original consoles rather than through some form of emulation. Even if you put an NES cartridge slot on the Wii U, that's what it would be - emulation... using real carts. Not really interested in that. I'll just use my old NES, thanks.

No one outside the homebrew community is going to release new carts for dead systems. Other than the fact that the people interested in buying them would be a minority of hardcore gamers like us, also it takes a lot of money to make and distribute a physical product. That's why we have paid downloads now like the Wii Virtual Console.

(If anyone else is reading this thread now, they're wondering why the hell I'm bothering to reply anymore.)

[RegalSin]

We have paid downloads on the Wii, because it is faster for a person, like me or you to email our product to Nintendo's download system ( or however that works ). You get my drift??? You do not have to leave your home to make money, and that is why people are doing that.

People are purchaing videogames as downloads because they are too damn lazy, to go outside and buy something in person. Also people are just fed up with dealing with people ( Clerks), at the store. Along with making excuses about gas prices. Imagine a person living in the suburbs, who is just too damn tired to drive down to the local game store, so they would download a videogame.

By intergrating people will have something to buy, and it will bring out fans like you and me back to the stores. We could play NES games, with our children, like it should be.

The idea you are talking about is the excuse ( you know excuse ), why Nintendo said they switched to cd. Then when everybody was using CD, the prices of manifacturing a CD droped.
To manifacture carts do not cost a lot of money, if you go to China ( as Nintendo and even Apple does today ). So that should not be a problem.

I am telling you, if all Media converted to electronically stored information, they we are damaging our freedoms and way of life. Anything without a body is not real because you can't resell the product, because now you can make copies of it. The technology for that does not exsist because it is stupid. AKA don't copy that floppy ( remember that motto ? ). Nobody will respect it at all. You think it is not affecting you but it is on a nation wide scale, because your purcahing power is a vote, that decides the faith of humanity.

[esteban]

(If anyone else is reading this thread now, they're wondering why the hell I'm bothering to reply anymore.)

Hahahhhahahahahhaa. I didn't read anything in this thread, but I scanned and saw this. Ha!

Why do you bother?

Why do I bother?

Oh, brother.

[RegalSin]

becuae you know it would be so cool to have a

NEC computer section on the board.

[kazekirifx]

Yep. We have paid downloads because people are too lazy to go out and buy a game at a store. You're right. That's the only reason paid downloads exist. /s

becuae you know it would be so cool to have a

NEC computer section on the board.

I agree with you there, bro.

[Ji-L87]

becuae you know it would be so cool to have a

NEC computer section on the board.

I agree with you there, bro.

For once, I agree with Regal too. May pigs now fall from the sky. Considering how many X68s Blue must have picked up now, maybe it would be a good idea