got my moded duo back no screen shown

8bitForLife · 09/14/2012, 05:25 AM

Ok I got my duo rx back from being modded with region and component. Well excitement quickly turned to disappointment. Ok first things first the region mod works just fine and the original av out plug works just fine but when ever i try connecting my component cable to the plugs on the rx and then tv no single at all. Sometimes and i mean sometimes it flickers a screen of the game or system menu.

Before doing component mod i was asked to hook up my t16 to the y plug on my component inputs on tv to see if it would display black and white and it did. So im kind of frustrated right now as to why its not working. If i hook up the y plug and plug it into the composite av input i get black and white game screen. So i have no idea whats wrong.

Any ideas would be appreciated.

PCEngineHell · 09/14/2012, 05:51 AM

Its possible the package while being shipped back to you may have been jostled and a wire or something came loose. Its rare but does happen. Sometimes USPS can be pretty brutal to packages without making it appear very evident. I'd suggest trying it on another couple of Tvs if possible, and if it still is not working then you may need to ship it back to whomever modded it so they can check their work and see what happened with it.

8bitForLife · 09/14/2012, 06:13 AM

Thanks for the speedy reply. I opened it up and i cant see any loose wires. The mod work looks top notch and is very clean. I just hope its not my tv as I was reading that some tv's just cant do 240p over component but being able to display black and white picture it should be? And shipping it back isn't really possible right now I spent my last buck on the new laser in it so I cant afford to send it back.

Btw I did try another tv but I know it didn't show the black and white on the Y input so nothing showed up regardless.

Drakon · 09/14/2012, 07:03 AM

Professor: Oh yeah that's happened to famicom systems I built. I even created a pictoral guide of how to check your famicom to be sure everything is still plugged in properly before powering it on.

I'm more curious about how exactly component video is being generated. The tg16 / duo systems don't generate component video so unless there's a pcb inside your modded system that's converting rgbs into component then the modder is smoking something good. Anyway if you have rgbs hookups then you can always buy an external rgb to component video encoder like a jrok or those 60$ shipped ones on ebay. As for mod work looking "very clean" I've seen lots of mods that looked super clean and didn't function right at all. There's a lot of modders out there who're great at making the work look nice and pretty but when it comes to functionality they don't get it right. This can be caused by the modder not having the gear to properly test that their work actually functions (without the right testing gear you don't know if you wired it up correctly). Or problems like this can happen from a wire coming loose because a lot of "modders" think for some reason that using hot glue to hold a wire firmly in place looks "horrible" and "un-professional". Even though I'm sure a professional would understand how easy it is for a wire to break off and either short circuit or disconnect without something holding it in place.

...And yes some hdtvs just don't do component video at this resolution. Find a tv that you know will use component video at that resolution. I have a crt with component video inputs that I got at a garage sale for 25$

8bitForLife · 09/14/2012, 07:33 AM

Well it worked on his tv and I think displaying in the y input in black and white it should work. It even worked when i connected a cord from the y on the console to the composite on my tv i saw black and white. So im not sure what to do. It does have a pcb inside he added. I did want it rgbed to use scart and I would get a converter later but they said they would do component.

PCEngineHell · 09/14/2012, 07:55 AM

Quote from: 8bitForLife on 09/14/2012, 07:33 AMWell it worked on his tv and I think displaying in the y input in black and white it should work. It even worked when i connected a cord from the y on the console to the composite on my tv i saw black and white. So im not sure what to do. It does have a pcb inside he added. I did want it rgbed to use scart and I would get a converter later but they said they would do component.

Probably sounds stupid, but could you do us a favor and take some pics of the mod, both inside and outside the system? It would help if we could actually see what kind of work was actually done. Also, who did the work?

8bitForLife · 09/14/2012, 08:21 AM

I get a picture taken soon as i can borrow a smart phone.

Hewitson · 09/14/2012, 08:55 AM

Quote from: Drakon on 09/14/2012, 07:03 AMOr problems like this can happen from a wire coming loose because a lot of "modders" think for some reason that using hot glue to hold a wire firmly in place looks "horrible" and "un-professional".

It does... A correctly soldered wire of decent gauge should provide a sufficient mechanical connection. If you open up a professionally made piece of electronic equipment you don't see hot glue all over the place.

PCEngineHell · 09/14/2012, 09:20 AM

Quote from: Hewitson on 09/14/2012, 08:55 AM
Quote from: Drakon on 09/14/2012, 07:03 AMOr problems like this can happen from a wire coming loose because a lot of "modders" think for some reason that using hot glue to hold a wire firmly in place looks "horrible" and "un-professional".
It does... A correctly soldered wire of decent gauge should provide a sufficient mechanical connection. If you open up a professionally made piece of electronic equipment you don't see hot glue all over the place.

Sometimes solder joints just break from massive shock. It happens to all sorts of electronics. Also, the fact of the matter is mods are ADD ONS, not in the original design, and hot glue goes hand in hand with this sort of thing when used right, as it acts as a permanent bonding and reinforcement material. It comes in handy for gluing down a small bundle wires that are tightly bound together to the pcb. In gaps between solder point A and solder point B you don't want to have bundles of wires or add on pcbs and circuit boards/encoders running all over the place and dangling free, and there is no real other solid way to bind them down firmly to a spot other then Hot glue in most situations.

This way your job is more tidy, granted you do clean work in general. It also comes in handy for reinforcing the back part of panel mount jacks and switches so they wont work their-selves loose over time from constant use. No modding is going to look "factory professional" but you can tell when a good modder knows what hes doing by how well his mods hold up to use and abuse and how clean the work is over all, even if not "factory perfect" looking, which will never happen with any mods because you have added onto or changed the original factory spec.

Hewitson · 09/14/2012, 10:37 AM

Sorry, but I think that is rubbish. I have NEVER used hot glue in any of the modifications I've done, and I have NEVER had a single solder joint or plug/socket come loose.

As far as I'm concerned, only cowboys use glue.

BlueBMW · 09/14/2012, 11:57 AM

I have seen hot glue like adhesives used in many electronics from the factory. Typically they are updates or revisions retrofitted to a piece of hardware. Ive seen it in sharp x68000s, Ive seen it in pioneer LD players and some receivers as well.

I use hot glue often as there isnt usually a cleaner, better way to secure wires in an add on situation.

HercTNT · 09/14/2012, 12:10 PM

Quote from: Hewitson on 09/14/2012, 10:37 AMSorry, but I think that is rubbish. I have NEVER used hot glue in any of the modifications I've done, and I have NEVER had a single solder joint or plug/socket come loose.

As far as I'm concerned, only cowboys use glue.

Dumb statement. Not a good way to get out of the gate. You can agree to disagree with people, but your "Cowboy" statement just basically shit on ever tech and amatuer modder here.

NecroPhile · 09/14/2012, 12:35 PM

Quote from: Hewitson on 09/14/2012, 10:37 AMSorry, but I think that is rubbish. I have NEVER used hot glue in any of the modifications I've done, and I have NEVER had a single solder joint or plug/socket come loose.

As far as I'm concerned, only cowboys use glue.

I can see you'll go far here, chief.

thesteve · 09/14/2012, 01:16 PM

i only glue, when no other option exists for securing.

GohanX · 09/14/2012, 01:45 PM

I'll bite. An RGB mod on a Duo R requires soldering directly to a chip with tiny, tiny pins, and if you use more than a miscrosopic bit of solder on a really thin wire, you will bridge the pins. If you are then going to hand this to UPS/USPS who will then kick it around like a soccer ball for a few thousand miles, tell me again why using a dab of a nonconductive, easy to apply and remove glue that will keep a wire in place undisturbed for years, is a bad idea?

PCEngineHell · 09/14/2012, 02:12 PM

Quote from: JKM on 09/14/2012, 01:45 PMtell me again why using a dab of a nonconductive, easy to apply and remove glue that will keep a wire in place undisturbed for years, is a bad idea?

Because the nobody with 11 post and ZERO reputation, who hasn't posted any of his countless prior work on Nec systems, because he has no such experience to speak of, says so, so it must be teh law. Isn't that good enough a reason for everyone here? Surely it must be? Evidently he can bind and hold down wires on the power of his words alone.

Drakon · 09/14/2012, 03:34 PM

That's total B.S. The 32x comes from the factory with soldered in wires that have hot glue holding them in place. The whole reason why I'm posting more here than sega16 lately is because people here seem to understand things like a little "ugly" hot glue makes for much more durable mod-work. There's a lot of forums full of idiots who automatically call a mod horrible because the wires are secured with hot glue. One of my clients had tiny wires break off from his spdif modded snes from simple handling because they weren't glued in place. And I fully agree that mods should never look "clean", they're post built additions which should look a bit ugly even when done right. To me good mod-work means a mod that's just as durable as the rest of the console. Not something that's going to fall out or pop off from too much shaking. I don't care how ugly the work is as long as it's nice and solid.

Quote from: Hewitson on 09/14/2012, 08:55 AM
Quote from: Drakon on 09/14/2012, 07:03 AMOr problems like this can happen from a wire coming loose because a lot of "modders" think for some reason that using hot glue to hold a wire firmly in place looks "horrible" and "un-professional".
It does... A correctly soldered wire of decent gauge should provide a sufficient mechanical connection. If you open up a professionally made piece of electronic equipment you don't see hot glue all over the place.

thesteve · 09/14/2012, 03:51 PM

agreed

NightWolve · 09/14/2012, 05:52 PM

So what's the status of the component mod, steve/8bitForLife ? I still haven't implemented steve's cheap component circuit design, I have to order some different caps and a triple component RCA mount, but I gotta do it soon since the Ys IV dub is almost ready (within days) and I wanna play the whole game on my old 32" CRT via a component connection.

thesteve · 09/14/2012, 06:04 PM

looks like the luma input came off the board somehow in shipping

Bernie · 09/14/2012, 06:48 PM

Quote from: Hewitson on 09/14/2012, 10:37 AMSorry, but I think that is rubbish. I have NEVER used hot glue in any of the modifications I've done, and I have NEVER had a single solder joint or plug/socket come loose.

As far as I'm concerned, only cowboys use glue.

Yep, this one is up for new a-hole of the week I see.....

NightWolve · 09/14/2012, 07:37 PM

Sorry guys, but I've gotta do it: "I will NEVER use hot glue! NEVER have and NEVER will! You understand me, buddy??? NEVER I say! NNNNNEEEEVVVVVVEEEEEERRRRRR!"

turbokon · 09/14/2012, 07:49 PM

I've used hot glue to secure components and wires in place, but never purposely over a soldered joint just because I might have to tweak or undo something.

HercTNT · 09/14/2012, 08:04 PM

I use hot glue for very small connections that benefit from said glue as to not come apart. More importantly those of us who are newer to modding and make frequent mistakes, hot glue gives us the chance to go back and fix those mistakes.

Hewitson · 09/14/2012, 09:05 PM

Quote from: Bernie on 09/14/2012, 06:48 PM
Quote from: Hewitson on 09/14/2012, 10:37 AMSorry, but I think that is rubbish. I have NEVER used hot glue in any of the modifications I've done, and I have NEVER had a single solder joint or plug/socket come loose.

As far as I'm concerned, only cowboys use glue.
Yep, this one is up for new a-hole of the week I see.....

I might be an a-hole, but at least my work is of a professional standard.

NightWolve · 09/14/2012, 09:08 PM

Quote from: Hewitson on 09/14/2012, 09:05 PMI might be an a-hole, but at least my work is of a professional standard.

And anyone who uses some glue just for a little extra protection in case of a pulling action (e.g. say it's carelessly opened up by the owner in the future, etc.) their work is not of a professional standard ?? Pfffft. Yeah, let's start a flame war over this......

PCEngineHell · 09/14/2012, 09:37 PM

Quote from: Hewitson on 09/14/2012, 09:05 PM
Quote from: Bernie on 09/14/2012, 06:48 PM
Quote from: Hewitson on 09/14/2012, 10:37 AMSorry, but I think that is rubbish. I have NEVER used hot glue in any of the modifications I've done, and I have NEVER had a single solder joint or plug/socket come loose.

As far as I'm concerned, only cowboys use glue.
Yep, this one is up for new a-hole of the week I see.....
I might be an a-hole, but at least my work is of a professional standard.

Says the guy who has posted NOTHING of his own work, who has no experience with any NEC systems. Put your money where your mouth is. Provide us with names of people you have done work for, and links to show the countless projects you have done with detailed pics. Basically guy, TOGTFO, because you are trolling this thread. None of your post have helped anything and you have been wasting time posting bullshit.

Vecanti · 09/14/2012, 09:54 PM

Quote from: Hewitson on 09/14/2012, 09:05 PMI might be an a-hole, but at least my work is of a professional standard.

You don't use Mil-Spec grade solder and wire by chance do you? (just checking if I know you from another forum)

thesteve · 09/14/2012, 10:12 PM

Quote from: Vecanti on 09/14/2012, 09:54 PM
Quote from: Hewitson on 09/14/2012, 09:05 PMI might be an a-hole, but at least my work is of a professional standard.
You don't use Mil-Spec grade solder and wire by chance do you? (just checking if I know you from another forum)

lol I do

8bitForLife · 09/14/2012, 11:37 PM

Its my console thesteve worked on his work is top notch we think it might be some unknown compatibility as the mod is working and it shows graphics on the y input in black and white with composite so its able to handle the 240p over component. So he think we could make a pass through cord of some kind if im correct in that's what hes thinking. Its just hard as i have no electronic knowledge whats so ever in this kind of work. I plan on taking a class at the college here and also a Cisco class after December.

thesteve · 09/15/2012, 12:25 AM

heres the circuit (id=63)

As spec'd it should push 0.9V to 1.1V of Luma into a 75ohm load.
now i suspect his TV is not providing a 75ohm load.
if he had a meter we could find out.
if his tV is 100ohm he will need another 25-30 ohms added to the Luma line. (most likely)
it could also not like DC coupled Luma (unlikely as most DVD players use DC coupling)

8bitForLife · 09/15/2012, 02:20 AM

http://shop.panasonic.com/shop/model/TC-L42D2?t=specs&support#tabs

this is the model of my tv not sure if this helps

ApolloBoy · 09/15/2012, 05:06 AM

Quote from: Hewitson on 09/14/2012, 09:05 PMI might be an a-hole, but at least my work is of a professional standard.

Then show it, bucko.

Drakon · 09/15/2012, 06:56 AM

Yeah thesteve is the man. Guess that rules out bad modding.

Quote from: 8bitForLife on 09/14/2012, 11:37 PMIts my console thesteve worked on his work is top notch we think it might be some unknown compatibility as the mod is working and it shows graphics on the y input in black and white with composite so its able to handle the 240p over component. So he think we could make a pass through cord of some kind if im correct in that's what hes thinking. Its just hard as i have no electronic knowledge whats so ever in this kind of work. I plan on taking a class at the college here and also a Cisco class after December.

Firebomber7 · 09/15/2012, 09:42 PM

Quote from: Hewitson on 09/14/2012, 10:37 AMSorry, but I think that is rubbish. I have NEVER used hot glue in any of the modifications I've done, and I have NEVER had a single solder joint or plug/socket come loose.

As far as I'm concerned, only cowboys use glue.

Now where have a I read this before, hmmm...

What other forums are you on?

NightWolve · 09/15/2012, 09:54 PM

Quote from: Drakon on 09/15/2012, 06:56 AMYeah thesteve is the man. Guess that rules out bad modding.

Steve is da man? Wrong, steve is a rough-riding cowboy if you ask me!!! All that damn glue he splatters everywhere! THAT'S why his mod isn't working right now!! Damn cowboys!!!!!! ;)

HercTNT · 09/15/2012, 10:00 PM

I just had this vision of steve riding a donkey, caulking guns akimbo hooked up to air compressors and a laser sight, gluing turbo's from 300 yards away. Hewiston's standing not far away shaking his fist at him

Mathius · 09/15/2012, 10:10 PM

Quote from: HercTNT on 09/15/2012, 10:00 PMI just had this vision of steve riding a donkey, caulking guns akimbo hooked up to air compressors and a laser sight, gluing turbo's from 300 yards away. Hewiston's standing not far away shaking his fist at him

Hewitson says...

QuoteHewitson-You dirty rotten good for nuthin' heifer f@cker! Your a disgrace! A DISGRACE!

HercTNT · 09/15/2012, 10:21 PM

LOL. and yet we all know the quality of steve's mods and don't know shit about hewiston, go figure.

8bitForLife · 09/16/2012, 05:54 AM

well we figured out what was wrong but i dont have any money for me to send it back.

Drakon · 09/16/2012, 07:49 AM

Quote from: 8bitForLife on 09/16/2012, 05:54 AMwell we figured out what was wrong but i dont have any money for me to send it back.

Mind sharing what the problem is?

8bitForLife · 09/16/2012, 09:18 AM

it was under powered and needs a resister added i believe is what he said and to make sure it works when i get it back he would put a pot on it so i can adjust it to make sure it works.

thesteve · 09/16/2012, 12:44 PM

specifically the matching resistor i used 75ohm 1VPP is too much resistance for his TV input.
in studying other devices, i found there is no standard for luma level (devices running anywhere from 0.7VPP to 2.3VPP)
im adding a pot to allow adjustment from 0.5VPP to 2VPP

thesteve · 09/21/2012, 12:42 PM

its back at my place
the chroma drive transistors got damaged during the testing i had 8bit do on his end.
i replaced the transistors restoring color.
i bypassed R14 bumping luma up to 1.8V
this caused a slight loss of detail

the pots to make it adjustable are not here yet

NightWolve · 09/21/2012, 10:26 PM

Oh my, look at this! Looook at this! Rampant cowboyism on display on a professionally made digital thermostat, ladies and gentlemen!!! I had to change the batteries and lo and behold, THIS is what I discovered:

thesteve · 09/21/2012, 10:37 PM

lol i rarely glue wires, and use RTV when i do.
rtv secures boards far better than hot glue as well.

Drakon · 09/22/2012, 07:28 AM

Quote from: NightWolve on 09/21/2012, 10:26 PMOh my, look at this! Looook at this! Rampant cowboyism on display on a professionally made digital thermostat, ladies and gentlemen!!! I had to change the batteries and lo and behold, THIS is what I discovered:

; )

Obviously the work of an unprofessional modder, you should automatically refuse to buy anything from a guy who's making stuff like this.

PCEngineHell · 09/22/2012, 08:46 AM

Quote from: thesteve on 09/21/2012, 10:37 PMlol i rarely glue wires, and use RTV when i do.
rtv secures boards far better than hot glue as well.

Yeah you can use RTV, but as a silicone product it will eventually break down slowly on a chemical level over the years. Even the high grade stuff also has a issue with releasing acetic acid while curing. That stuff can be bad news for pcbs, which is why it is not normally used for computer boards, and instead used for gaskets and sealing bolts, etc.