Ys IV: The Dawn of Ys English Dub Patch Released!

[VestCunt]

What does the following error mean?

Performing Track Mode Analysis... One moment...
Error with Data Track 02: Track following error
Fatal Error: This analysis phase has failed. Aborting...

It saves the TOC from the disc, but that's as far as it seems to get. Tested with other games (Loom) and it worked fine. Perhaps an issue with my disc...

I got some kind of error and partial rip when I tried to use Turbo Rip 1.0 on Windows 7 (don't ask). I switched to TurboRip 1.1 beta on XP and it worked fine.

[Bernie]

I suspect his issue is a bad rip vestcunt.

[TurboXray]

Here's a recording.  Starts getting insane at about 1:18-ish.  Click to download - 16.36 MB

What causes something like this?  Why doesn't it do this in emulators?  Is it a bug with the real hardware?

It has to do with the ADPCM chip in the CD unit. ADPCM uses delta's, and it adds them on every sample then outputs the sample so you hear it. The if the sum adds up past what a 12bit value can hold (either positive or negative), this particular ADPCM controller chip doesn't not correct the 'overflow' like other later or more expensive chips do (they'll saturate it; keep it from overflowing). On the TGCD the overflow value wraps back around, causing all samples after that point to be incorrect in the stream (until it starts a new stream). Some emulators take care of overflow even though the original hardware doesn't; but it's not a given that all emulators will do this (mednafen will probably allow overflow). It's not a problem with the TGCD per se, but rather the encoder you use for the ADPCM. It needs to take care for this. If the encoder doesn't have this feature, then you have to lower the volume of the source material (wave file) so that it doesn't produce this in the encode - which is an el cheapo way of doing this.

 I assume this is what happened (or they got the byte offset wrong when inserting it back into the data track).

[Burnt Lasagna]

Hey Bonknuts/Tomaitheous/@TurboXray.
Maybe you might be able to understand this issue better then I do.

The problem I'm encountering with the ADPCM is that I clearly remember fixing that clip during my initial testing (used mednafen). Shortly after finishing my first test play through I found out certain clips that were working in the past were now clipping like crazy. After talking with Nightwolve about it he explained that I should be measuring all my new ADPCM WAV's right down to the exact sample of the original, which I wasn't doing during my first time around.

I found out a large hand full were one sample over what they were suppose to be. Figured this was the culprit that was knocking over previously working clips as they were being inserted. I fixed all the samples of the new ADPCM to match the Japanese ones exactly.  Then I did another play through of the game and fixed, yet again, the small amount of ADPCM that where now clipping in the game.

I thought I finally put this issue to death after that second play through. Now it appears I was wrong in thinking that. Do you have any idea on whats causing this domino effect?

NOTE: The ADPCM is being converted to VOX and then inserted into the game with SOX.

[TurboXray]

I'm playing through the patch with mednafen (ver 9.2.4) and can confirm what Joe has experienced with the two goddesses. It's the only one so far that breaks up like that.

[Burnt Lasagna]

I'm playing through the patch with mednafen (ver 9.2.4) and can confirm what Joe has experienced with the two goddesses. It's the only one so far that breaks up like that.

Could you send me your save? I'll need it in order to fix the clipping with the scene.
Hopefully this is the only instance of clipping still left in the patch.

[TurboXray]

PM sent.

[Joe Redifer]

There's one more later I believe.  At the alter before fighting the chick.  The clip before she says "come at me boy" when Eldeel is talking...  I think.  I just know there's one more later so far, a much shorter clip so be on the lookout. I haven't beaten the game yet but I am still enjoying the hell out of the english dub.  Though I wish the original programmers let me skip the dialog when repeating a boss fight that I've already heard the dialog for like Book 1 and 2 did.

[Keranu]

I haven't beaten the game yet but I am still enjoying the hell out of the english dub.

It's like playing the game for the first time all over again for me!

[TurboXray]

Just finished the game. I didn't notice any other ADPCM clips going hay-wire like that.

[Joe Redifer]

Mednafen must not be 100% accurate to real hardware.  The second one isn't as bad but it's there.

[Burnt Lasagna]

Mednafen must not be 100% accurate to real hardware.  The second one isn't as bad but it's there.

You said the clipping happened around when Bami says "come at me boy" when Eldeel is talking? There is two ways that scene can go down, 1) when your in Adol's normal form and 2) When your in daemon form.

I got clipping when you go in as 2) (using mednafen) but not in 1).

Joe, I'm assuming you did the part as 2) and Bonknuts did it in 1)?

If that is the case, then can I assume there is only two clips in need of fixing?

[Joe Redifer]

Yes, 2.  I had forgotten about that.  I did make an effort to try both forms when I originally fell off the bridge at the waterfall.  That's awesome that there are so many combinations of possible voiceovers at that point and slightly beyond.  They all worked great.

[Burnt Lasagna]

Okay, I seemed to have fixed the clipping in both scenes. Thank you Bonknuts for sending me your BRAM file!
I should be uploading a v1.1 of the patch sometime tomorrow.
Stay tune.

[Keranu]

Yes, 2.  I had forgotten about that.  I did make an effort to try both forms when I originally fell off the bridge at the waterfall.  That's awesome that there are so many combinations of possible voiceovers at that point and slightly beyond.  They all worked great.

Haha, I also tried every combination! Hudson paid great attention to fine detail in Dawn of Ys.

[Bernie]

Love the dedication to this project!  Thanks BL!

[Burnt Lasagna]

v1.1 is up!
It fixes the the two instances of clipping on real hardware and on mednafen.

[Bernie]

Grabbing it now! 

[Drakon]

v1.1 is up!
It fixes the the two instances of clipping on real hardware and on mednafen.

Uhh, anyone have a youtube vid of the clipping so I can hear if it's worth a reburn?  It was a lot of work getting 1.0 working and burned.

[ParanoiaDragon]

Do we have to patch an unpatched file, or can this just overwrite an already patched Ys4?

[Burnt Lasagna]

@ParanoiaDragon
You can just overwrite the patched one. You can thank NightWolve for giving the patcher this ability! 

@Drakon
You can hear the clipping here,

Here's a recording.  Starts getting insane at about 1:18-ish.  Click to download - 16.36 MB

Not that big a deal, since it only has to happen with this one clip. I guess you can decide for yourself though.

[ParanoiaDragon]

Hmm, when I run Patcher.cmd, I get the prompt, push any key, & it says this has already been patched!

[Bernie]

If you kept the backup files, just swap those back into your image and redo the patch.  That should take care of it.

[Drakon]

Or you can just turborip it all over again and repeat.  I honestly have no clue if I even used the toc fixer right.  I just opened the isos in it and clicked repair on both of them.

[NightWolve]

OK, my disc definitely says "R2F" but Turborip rips and name the files "R1F". I'll PM you a link to the TOC file.

Thanks! Well, it confirms I don't have to add that TOC or do anything. I thought this might be a 3rd Ys IV unique TOC, but it looks like it just shares the same TOC as one of the others,  R1F.

Magic Engine does not identify the patched disc.

Yeah, if you want, you can run my TocFixer, included with the patch, to repair the image after patching. Choosing either of the two Ys IV IDs, and clicking to repair the image will allow it to be identified by emulators. It's not necessary, but it's a plus. Real hardware won't care, and the emulators will just identify it as a PCE CD and will load it all the same if you don't bother.

Thank you so much Nightwolve, Burnt Lasagna, Sparky, Sadler, and everyone else for your work on all of these different projects!

Err, you're welcome! ;)

Hmm, when I run Patcher.cmd, I get the prompt, push any key, & it says this has already been patched!

You'll have to delete the backup folder, then Patcher.cmd will run again and repatch. I didn't completely modify the original patching code (cubanraul's), just did enough to combat the early patching difficulties. It will likely skip the waves and won't identify them, but since they're replaced, it don't matter (You could run TocFixer to repair the image and that would cause it to completely redo everything though).

Err, yeah, as Bernie said, that works too, restore the files from the backup folder (and delete it afterwards). Come to think of it, there should be a simple "restore.bat" to handle that.

[Drakon]

Lol that clipping is horrible.  Guess I'm reburning this.

[NightWolve]

Here's a recording.  Starts getting insane at about 1:18-ish.  Click to download - 16.36 MB

What causes something like this?  Why doesn't it do this in emulators?  Is it a bug with the real hardware?

It has to do with the ADPCM chip in the CD unit. ADPCM uses delta's, and it adds them on every sample then outputs the sample so you hear it. The if the sum adds up past what a 12bit value can hold (either positive or negative), this particular ADPCM controller chip doesn't not correct the 'overflow' like other later or more expensive chips do (they'll saturate it; keep it from overflowing). On the TGCD the overflow value wraps back around, causing all samples after that point to be incorrect in the stream (until it starts a new stream). Some emulators take care of overflow even though the original hardware doesn't; but it's not a given that all emulators will do this (mednafen will probably allow overflow). It's not a problem with the TGCD per se, but rather the encoder you use for the ADPCM. It needs to take care for this. If the encoder doesn't have this feature, then you have to lower the volume of the source material (wave file) so that it doesn't produce this in the encode - which is an el cheapo way of doing this.

 I assume this is what happened (or they got the byte offset wrong when inserting it back into the data track).

Ah, thanks for the technical explanation Tom! Yeah, in testing, we learned that you had to lower the volume level close to or lower than what the originals were, and I did observe that one mistake in the stream would cause a complete, garbled disaster thereafter and it'd take a while to correct itself, if ever! That ADPCM chip is "way too damn sensitive" was my feeling, but your explanation sheds light on things better. My ADPCM Finder and batch file builder is pretty solid, so I think all the offset data is pretty good.

Anyhow, here is the SOX commandline I chose to convert to VOX:

Code Select Expand

sox -V -G "sample.wav" -r 16000 -e oki-adpcm "sample.vox"
-G option: "Automatically invoke the gain effect to guard against clipping."

SOX Options regarding clipping:

−−norm[=dB-level]
Automatically invoke the gain effect to guard against clipping and to normalise the audio. E.g.
sox −−norm infile −b 16 outfile rate 44100 dither −s
is shorthand for
sox infile −b 16 outfile gain −h rate 44100 gain −nh dither −s
Optionally, the audio can be normalized to a given level (usually) below 0 dBFS:
sox −−norm=−3 infile outfile
See also −V, −G, and the gain effect.


−G, −−guard
Automatically invoke the gain effect to guard against clipping. E.g.
sox −G infile −b 16 outfile rate 44100 dither −s
is shorthand for
sox infile −b 16 outfile gain −h rate 44100 gain −rh dither −s
See also −V, −−norm, and the gain effect.

Given these SOX command line options and your intimate knowledge on the specifics of NEC's ADPCM, is there any smarter command line that would help prevent this ? It seems you knew about SOX long before I ever did, I found out about it from Charles McDonald's NEC documentation work myself. Right now, Mike just keeps lowering the volume level, but from vestcunt's feedback, it would appear it's being done a tad much, though he says it's fine in real NEC hardware, so maybe it's OK. Just sounds like from what you said, there is a "smarter" way to catch and correct this problem instead of continually lowering the volume level overall. SOX warned you about what it thought would clip, but things have to be a lot lower when it comes to that OKI ADPCM chip, so SOX's warnings stopped being helpful at some point, though they did teach me about the concept of clipping, as did the way the game responded when I tested it on real hardware.

[Burnt Lasagna]

Mike just keeps lowering the volume level, but from vestcunt's feedback, it would appear it's being done a tad much, though he says it's fine in real NEC hardware, so maybe it's OK.

To make clear, I'm not exactly lowering the volume when I fix the clips.

Most of the new ADPCM needed a high-pass or a bass-cut filter over them to get them to play right in mednafen and real hardware. A majority wouldn't even play at all if I didn't mess with the clips cutoff frequency before hand, with said filter.

Yeah, so most of the time I just mess with the high-pass filter settings in audacity till it plays and sounds nicely in the game. I don't usually lower volume, though that is the case some times.

[Drakon]

Hey, whatever works.

To make clear, I'm not exactly lowering the volume when I fix the clips.

Most of the new ADPCM needed a high-pass or a bass-cut filter over them to get them to play right in mednafen and real hardware. A majority wouldn't even play at all if I didn't mess with the clips cutoff frequency before hand, with said filter.

Yeah, so most of the time I just mess with the high-pass filter settings in audacity till it plays and sounds nicely in the game. I don't usually lower volume, though that is the case some times.

[Bernie]

So....  Whats next on the translation/dubbing scene? 

[NightWolve]

To make clear, I'm not exactly lowering the volume when I fix the clips.

Most of the new ADPCM needed a high-pass or a bass-cut filter over them to get them to play right in mednafen and real hardware. A majority wouldn't even play at all if I didn't mess with the clips cutoff frequency before hand, with said filter.

Yeah, so most of the time I just mess with the high-pass filter settings in audacity till it plays and sounds nicely in the game. I don't usually lower volume, though that is the case some times.

I thought we had shared info that they needed to be lowered down to that +/- .4 range which is where most of the Japanese clips were at on average ? I dunno much about these filters, but are you saying if you had just say lowered the volume level to the .3 range, they wouldn't play unless you messed with other fancy features of Audacity (cutoff, high-bass/bass-cut filters, etc.) ??

[Burnt Lasagna]

The clip does need to be around the +/- .4 range, but it might also need the filter mentioned, depending on how it was recorded.

I dunno much about these filters, but are you saying if you had just say lowered the volume level to the .3 range, they wouldn't play unless you messed with other fancy features of Audacity (cutoff, high-bass/bass-cut filters, etc.) ??

I found all this out during my initial test play through. I believe it was the scene where Slano shows up that I ran into this issue. The clip would play, but no matter how low I set the volume it would always clip.

I'm not exactly an expert on this, but basically the recordings for Slano had to much bass for the PCE to handle. Doing a High-pass, or as it's sometimes called, a Bass-cut lets you bring the clip down to something the PCE can actually run.  This makes the clip sound a tad grainer, but it was needed in order for the clip to even work correctly.

I was never able to get an exact setting that worked with every clip, but it was what audacity had as default that worked for most. 

You can read about a High-pass filter here,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-pass_filter

So....  Whats next on the translation/dubbing scene? 

I don't have any plans for another dubbing project as of now.
Though I would be up to doing one again! Just need the right game...

[Sadler]

I don't have any plans for another dubbing project as of now.
Though I would be up to doing one again! Just need the right game...

Snatcher! Please Snatcher! The LoX's would be good too, but how hard would it be to leverage the SegaCD Snatcher?

[Duo_R]

You know what would be cool, Policenauts voice acting. Same idea as Ys IV, the translation is already there but all the audio is in Japanese. That would be an amazing and historic project. Of course whole different system but that would be awesome. I would for sure do some of those roles.

[ParanoiaDragon]

The question with Snatcher, would be, go the easy route & use the already existing dubbing(assuming it's been, or can be, completely ripped), or start from scratch with new actor's.  I'd actually prefer an RPG of some sort, but it'd still be nice to play Snatcher, as I've never played the Sega Cd version. 

There's also the Valis games, I believe someone else mentioned this.  Though, briefly the possibility of Sunsoft releasing them dubbed or remade or something, but, that looks to be fruitless since they vanished off the face of the earth with most of Telenet's games.   But yeah, Valis 1 & 4 are options, & I'm sure we could do better then what was done in Valis 3!

Anything Falcom would be great, Sorcerian probably has the most text to translate.  Popful Mail, I wonder how doable it would be using WD's dub.  There's probably scenes that aren't in the Sega CD version that are in the Turbo version, IIRC.  As mentioned before, the Legend of Xanadu's, but 2 is already in the works.  Brandish would be cool, not sure how much text there would be to worry about though.

Obviously any of the Cosmic Fantasys, though, CF's 1 & 3 I believe are being worked on by somebody.  I know atleast 1 was already being translated, maybe by Dave Shadoff?

Double Dragon 2, probably very little text to translate, maybe none.  River City Ransom, could maybe use most of the text from the NES version(?), though I think alot of names n' stuff were changed.

Kaze Kiri or Legend of Iga Ninja would be cool.  I don't recall how much text is in those.  Probably not much.

Mystic Formula, I believe there's zero text to worry about, though, the game isn't the most sought out, as it's only average.

Shubibinman 3, pretty cool game, almost no text, & was originally planned both by TTI(as Shockman 2) & WD(as Cyber Twins) seperately BITD.

[Marll]

I may have missed it somewhere, but is there a good source to get an english manual (or at least front and back manual replacement, like what Sparky was doing for some games) and an english tray insert?

[Keranu]

A Xak III dub would be cool since you can work with Nightwolve again like Ys IV. A full Snatcher localization would be awesome, but definitely lower priority.

I like PD's idea of localizing games that were intended to make it over shores, but failed. We must fulfill NEC and TTi's long lost promises!

[Bardoly]

A Xak III dub would be cool since you can work with Nightwolve again like Ys IV. A full Snatcher localization would be awesome, but definitely lower priority.

I like PD's idea of localizing games that were intended to make it over shores, but failed. We must fulfill NEC and TTi's long lost promises!

Hear!  Hear!

[Marll]

I agree! Any games that were slated to come to the US and never did, or really SHOULD have and can be patched and/or dubbed would be awesome.

[Burnt Lasagna]

I can't say for sure what my next dubbing project will be, since I generally work on anything that I impulsively decide on.
Though there's a good chance it would be TG-CD related since that is the system I have the most experience with.

[MotherGunner]

Manji Maru! PLEASE!

[TurboXray]

I can't say for sure what my next dubbing project will be, since I generally work on anything that I impulsively decide on.
Though there's a good chance it would be TG-CD related since that is the system I have the most experience with.

Credits for DX should be next (I got a whole week off next week, maybe we can finish this up ;) ). Also, the credits in Ys IV didn't get translated. Any plans to fix this?

 What about Spriggan Mark 2 dub? No pressure, but I do have a full script inserted in the game (just needs a few tweaks) and I got a full translation to all the cinemas. I was planning on subtitling it, but a dub would be great. Might be something we can work on together (if you're not into taking it on all yourself). Or at least help with finding/setting up some VAs (I got a few people here in town that could do a few roles, but not everyone covered).

[Joe Redifer]

Just beat this game.  The ending was interesting:  SPOILER STOP READING NAO:  A woman appears with a baby and talks about the crest missing from its head.  I don't remember this in the game at all and I thought I had visited everywhere.  Seemed out of the blue.  Also, the very end insinuates that this game takes place before Ys 3.  Does it?  Or are they sailing off to Ys 5 in Super Famicomland?

[NightWolve]

Credits for DX should be next (I got a whole week off next week, maybe we can finish this up ;) ). Also, the credits in Ys IV didn't get translated. Any plans to fix this?

Heh, you're asking and yet you're one of the possible few with the knowledge/experience that could fix this ??? ;) The Credits roll is all graphics which are compressed... You need to find the block of graphics that corresponds to the credits, decompress it, figure out the format, change it, recompress and replace the original block... So... no, no plans to fix this, but you're welcome to volunteer yourself some time. ;) From what I recall in packaging Neill Corlett's decompression code together with David Shadoff's reversal of it into compression code, the latter was written to only handle the text mode. I think I saw in Neill's notes that a flag is set when the block is graphical data and what not, I'd have to check. It's been a long time... Anyway, this is hell that I am not willing to go through all to change some Japanese names in the Credits roll to English... I don't see the payoff here all that much given the expense in time and energy, plus the knowledge that I'd have to gain in order to accomplish it.

No answer to my previous post BTW ??

A Xak III dub would be cool since you can work with Nightwolve again like Ys IV. A full Snatcher localization would be awesome, but definitely lower priority.

Honestly, I get surprised when I learn that somebody actually appreciated the Xak III project, in addition to about the dozen or so people that I've already counted and what not... ;) I dunno, the translation work has no heart to it and I'm not proud of that project but it was a path to Ys IV, so it was good for something! Somebody else needs to translate it, but I doubt there would ever be an interest to do it right. I did actually ask SamIAm if he'd be interested one day to retranslate Ys IV for me, so that we're not forever stuck with Shimarisu's more literal style (and hence extremely boring/dry) of translation. That would be worth doing.

[geise]

Manji Maru! PLEASE!

^THIS!

[Burnt Lasagna]

Credits for DX should be next (I got a whole week off next week, maybe we can finish this up ;) ). Also, the credits in Ys IV didn't get translated. Any plans to fix this?

 What about Spriggan Mark 2 dub? No pressure, but I do have a full script inserted in the game (just needs a few tweaks) and I got a full translation to all the cinemas. I was planning on subtitling it, but a dub would be great. Might be something we can work on together (if you're not into taking it on all yourself). Or at least help with finding/setting up some VAs (I got a few people here in town that could do a few roles, but not everyone covered).

Ah, Rondo's credits! Glad to know you're still interested in doing this! I've been meaning to go back to this project to tie up a couple of loose ends, so I'm definitely up to finishing this with you

As for Spriggan Mark 2, I've actually been considering this. Though I was unsure on whether or not you were planning on doing this yourself.
Now I haven't played much of Spriggan Mark 2, but how much spoken dialogue is there? From what I've played it seems like quite allot. Now that isn't necessarily a bad thing, I just want to know what I would be up against.
What format are the voices in? From my quick examinations it seems a large sum is Redbook, though I'm guessing there are some ADPCM voices as well? If that is the case, have you already found the ADPCM address's?

I'd love to work on a game like Spriggan Mark 2, so consider me very much interested!

Just beat this game.  The ending was interesting:  SPOILER STOP READING NAO:  A woman appears with a baby and talks about the crest missing from its head.  I don't remember this in the game at all and I thought I had visited everywhere.  Seemed out of the blue.  Also, the very end insinuates that this game takes place before Ys 3.  Does it?  Or are they sailing off to Ys 5 in Super Famicomland?

That is the mother of the baby that Enzo uses to speak vicariously through. I was a bit confused with this scene as well when I first saw it, since she didn't have a voice nor a portrait originally.
I believe Ys IV is a prequel to Ys III. I don't remember were I originally heard that but it makes sense either way.

Manji Maru! PLEASE!

^THIS!

Hey, me too!
Though Manji Maru isn't really open at the moment.

[ParanoiaDragon]

Just beat this game.  The ending was interesting:  SPOILER STOP READING NAO:  A woman appears with a baby and talks about the crest missing from its head.  I don't remember this in the game at all and I thought I had visited everywhere.  Seemed out of the blue.  Also, the very end insinuates that this game takes place before Ys 3.  Does it?  Or are they sailing off to Ys 5 in Super Famicomland?

Yes, 4 deffinitely happens before 3.  I think that's one of the reasons they didn't bother to number Oath in Felghana, or Celceta: Sea of Tree's as Ys 3 or 4.  IIRC, Ys 4 happens 2 years after Ys 2, & Ys 3 happens a year after that.

[Keranu]

Honestly, I get surprised when I learn that somebody actually appreciated the Xak III project, in addition to about the dozen or so people that I've already counted and what not... ;) I dunno, the translation work has no heart to it and I'm not proud of that project but it was a path to Ys IV, so it was good for something!

Back when the Xak III project started, there were barely (if any?) CD translations available. Not the most attractive title, but it was definitely a worthy accomplishment.

[Keith Courage]

The way I look at it is any translated pc engine RPG is worth playing for me regardless of how good the game is.

No one has mentioned it yet but how about a dub translation for startling odyssey II since the text is complete?

[VestCunt]

Quality translations are a definite bonus, but I don't mind subpar work. It's not like CF2 or Dragon Slayer set the bar very high.