Two interesting things I have found

[jcmeadows]

I was just messing around on twitter last night and I stumbled over this:

http://www.upergrafx.com/home_en

I didnt know if anyone had see this. Look very cool buy the price is crazy expensive.

I also had found this:

http://db-electronics.ca/product/dbgrafx-booster-ttp/

This looks really cool and it can be used on a T-16 or a PCE. You guys have any thoughts on these things? Worth picking up?

[CrackTiger]

mickcris mods Tennokoe IIs for RGB. Better off with an RGB mod and a transcoder/upscaler.

[ccovell]

The Japanese reaction seems to be, "Wow!  Upergrafx!  Wow again!"
The English-speaking consensus appears to be "Terrible value for money."

[Trenton_net]

I would agree with CrackTiger. Just modify your console for JPN-21 RGB out, then get yourself a Framemister. Not only will the quality be perfect, you'll be able to reuse the upscale on any RGB source you want.

[CrackTiger]

With an RGB mod, you can still play on RGB monitors or on a crt TV through component. Although mickris' Tenokoe II's and the dbgrafx are a great idea, everyone should still get a modded Duo or a modded core unit to use with a CD-ROM.

Why limit your picture quality to HuCards?

[NecroPhile]

The upergrafx looks neat, but $350 is rather steep and why is it 720p?  Since most HD TVs are 1080p native, won't they have to upscale it again, introducing more lag?

db_electronic's doodad paired with a decent upscaler looks to be a much better deal with rgb, s-video, and plain ol' composite.  It's just too bad that it's not stuffed into a nice looking box for a finished look.

But I have little use for either, as composite is good enough for me and ain't gonna invest such monies into a huey only system.

[poponon]

The upergrafx looks neat, but $350 is rather steep and why is it 720p?  Since most HD TVs are 1080p native, won't they have to upscale it again, introducing more lag?

from my understanding, good upscalers do 720p because 240p times 3 = 720p , but 240p does not divide into 1080p nicely, so the scanlines do not have the correct proportions . I think most hdtvs that do 1080p can do 720p natively without upscaling also. yea it would suck if they could not

[Johnpv]

from my understanding, good upscalers do 720p because 240p times 3 = 720p , but 240p does not divide into 1080p nicely, so the scanlines do not have the correct proportions . I think most hdtvs that do 1080p can do 720p natively without upscaling also. yea it would suck if they could not

This would be wrong.  Fixed pixel displays (basically everything except an HDCRT) have to scale the image to their native resolution.  So if you have a 1080p set it has to scale the 720p image to 1080p.  If you have a 4k(UHD) set, it has to scale 1080p and 720p to 4k(UHD). 

You can do a 4x integer scale for 1080p and have a game image that is slightly smaller than the top and bottom of the screen, or you can 5x integer scale it and loose I THINK around 5% of the image to overscan. 

350 bucks and only doing 720p is silly of this thing.  Specially considering you could get a Framemeister for that price that can upscale all your consoles to 1080p with many more features.

[ginoscope]

I would agree with Black Tiger. Just modify your console for JPN-21 RGB out, then get yourself a Framemister. Not only will the quality be perfect, you'll be able to reuse the upscale on any RGB source you want.

This is how I feel as well.  The best future proof solution is to just get the system rgb modded and then either use a pvm or an upscaler.  All these 720p and 1080p solutions will all be out of date when we are playing huey on 8k in ten years lol.  In that situation all you would replace is some future upscaler.

[poponon]

from my understanding, good upscalers do 720p because 240p times 3 = 720p , but 240p does not divide into 1080p nicely, so the scanlines do not have the correct proportions . I think most hdtvs that do 1080p can do 720p natively without upscaling also. yea it would suck if they could not

This would be wrong.  Fixed pixel displays (basically everything except an HDCRT) have to scale the image to their native resolution.  So if you have a 1080p set it has to scale the 720p image to 1080p.  If you have a 4k(UHD) set, it has to scale 1080p and 720p to 4k(UHD). 
.

really? shit. i oughta test my flatscreen sometime to see if it's scaling. dont have one at the moment though

[SignOfZeta]

Most HDCRTs have a native res too, probably 720p. Multi-sync monitors (i.e.: for computers) are excepted but actuall TVs...sure, the tube could technically do any resolution but in reality its internal hardware makes everything the same res. This is probably because getting the geometry right on something like this with only one resolution is bad enough. Lag isn't an issue but quality is. If you like scan lines and stuff, don't F with HDCRT. My Sony does at least make KOF shadows properly though, which is more than I can say for most LCDs.

[SignOfZeta]

Another thing that I would point out is that many perfectly great TVs/monitors *are* only 720p in which case that resolution would be perfect, presumably. But yeah, Hu-only is kinda dumb. It's very hard to imagine not regretting a purchase like that.

[jcmeadows]

Thats my only issue with both of them. No CD support. One thing that is nice about the DP one is if you have the HD Retrovision cables for the Genesis 1 it will work on the new version which is kinda cool.

[jcmeadows]

I would agree with Black Tiger. Just modify your console for JPN-21 RGB out, then get yourself a Framemister. Not only will the quality be perfect, you'll be able to reuse the upscale on any RGB source you want.

I had thought about a Framemister but dropping that money on it plus the money to mod consoles and then get cables. Its a huge investment but the results cant be argued with for sure. To be honest, Im pretty happy just playing it on my old CRT tv lol

[CrackTiger]

I would agree with Black Tiger. Just modify your console for JPN-21 RGB out, then get yourself a Framemister. Not only will the quality be perfect, you'll be able to reuse the upscale on any RGB source you want.

I had thought about a Framemister but dropping that money on it plus the money to mod consoles and then get cables. Its a huge investment but the results cant be argued with for sure. To be honest, Im pretty happy just playing it on my old CRT tv lol

Many/most 240p consoles output RGB without mods.

[crazydean]

Thats my only issue with both of them. No CD support. One thing that is nice about the DP one is if you have the HD Retrovision cables for the Genesis 1 it will work on the new version which is kinda cool.

The HD Retrovision cables are just cables not scalers. So yes, you can buy them and play on your HDTV using component. However, they don't scale the image so your TV still has to upscale internally.

[esteban]

I was just messing around on twitter last night and I stumbled over this:

http://www.upergrafx.com/home_en

I didnt know if anyone had see this. Look very cool buy the price is crazy expensive.

I also had found this:

http://db-electronics.ca/product/dbgrafx-booster-ttp/

This looks really cool and it can be used on a T-16 or a PCE. You guys have any thoughts on these things? Worth picking up?

So, I am glad you posted this because I am finally looking into buying something like this (I can use it on my TG-16 and PCE white and PCE CoreGrafx II)... I actually like swapping out hardware and using different stuff throughout the year

Historically, I prefer all my hardware stock, because I like to compare/experience what these machines actually did back in 198_ ... but, I am curious to see if I have been wrong... MAYBE I WILL PREFER a better video signal?

(1) ...db electronics is working on a revised turbo booster (the one you linked to is out of stock...not sure if he will still make them)...

(2) BUT I also like the idea of a modded Tennonoke II... it's more fun for me (using an original peripheral)... isn't mckris in UK? I may buy one from him during the interim (who knows when db electronics will finish new batch).

TRIVIA: I was going to buy the never-came-to-be Turbokon & Co. TurboBooster (a third option, though defunct) from not too long ago (the kickstarter funding never materialized)...

Anyway... this will at least help me get a taste for better video signal on a PVM BVM DSM and see if I care enough to RGB mod consoles like DUO (for teh CD games).

[CrackTiger]

Thats my only issue with both of them. No CD support. One thing that is nice about the DP one is if you have the HD Retrovision cables for the Genesis 1 it will work on the new version which is kinda cool.

https://twitter.com/db_electronics/status/770804790615879680

The HD Retrovision cables are just cables not scalers. So yes, you can buy them and play on your HDTV using component. However, they don't scale the image so your TV still has to upscale internally.

They're a transcoder inside a wart along the cable and people who have bought them have expressed that they don't work as good as the cheap component transcoder on eBay.

The idea, if pulled off well, is alright, but the entire pitch from day one is very misleading to the target audience. "HD" should not have been in the title or description, aside from a disclaimer warning that these cables do not address the primary issues modern "HD"TVs have with retro console video.

[jcmeadows]

Im not one who has to have it upscaled to 1080 Im happy with just cleaning up the picture to make it a little clearer. Im grabbing a set of the cables for the Genesis and try them out. My end up with the dp chip at some point too just to see how it does.

[crazydean]

They're a transcoder inside a wart along the cable and people who have bought them have expressed that they don't work as good as the cheap component transcoder on eBay.

Are you talking about the SCART to YPbPr? I bought one of those a few years ago off ebay before I went the full PVM route. It worked very well on an old Trinitron CRT.

[mickcris]

I was just messing around on twitter last night and I stumbled over this:

http://www.upergrafx.com/home_en

I didnt know if anyone had see this. Look very cool buy the price is crazy expensive.

I also had found this:

http://db-electronics.ca/product/dbgrafx-booster-ttp/

This looks really cool and it can be used on a T-16 or a PCE. You guys have any thoughts on these things? Worth picking up?

So, I am glad you posted this because I am finally looking into buying something like this (I can use it on my TG-16 and PCE white and PCE CoreGrafx II)... I actually like swapping out hardware and using different stuff throughout the year

Historically, I prefer all my hardware stock, because I like to compare/experience what these machines actually did back in 198_ ... but, I am curious to see if I have been wrong... MAYBE I WILL PREFER a better video signal?

(1) ...db electronics is working on a revised turbo booster (the one you linked to is out of stock...not sure if he will still make them)...

(2) BUT I also like the idea of a modded Tennonoke II... it's more fun for me (using an original peripheral)... isn't mckris in UK? I may buy one from him during the interim (who knows when db electronics will finish new batch).

TRIVIA: I was going to buy the never-came-to-be Turbokon & Co. TurboBooster (a third option, though defunct) from not too long ago (the kickstarter funding never materialized)...

Anyway... this will at least help me get a taste for better video signal on a PVM BVM DSM and see if I care enough to RGB mod consoles like DUO (for teh CD games).

I'm in TX.  I do have 1 tennokoe 2 left.  Need to mod it though. Just haven't gotten around to it.  If you are interested, let me know and i will put that next on my list.

[SuperDeadite]

The Japanese reaction seems to be, "Wow!  Upergrafx!  Wow again!"
The English-speaking consensus appears to be "Terrible value for money."

That's just a cultural thing though.  Society requires them to say something positive, but in reality 90% of the commenters have no interest in one.

[mickcris]

The Japanese reaction seems to be, "Wow!  Upergrafx!  Wow again!"
The English-speaking consensus appears to be "Terrible value for money."

That's just a cultural thing though.  Society requires them to say something positive, but in reality 90% of the commenters have no interest in one.

The device is pretty cool though.  But, like others have said, the price is too high.  Maybe they will lower the price if it doesn't sell well.

[Groover]

It is a cool piece of tech. It doesn't work for me. I have Duos. Also I already have an upscale solution and RGB out of a turbo console is way more useful for me. I want a SuperGrafx and the first thing I would want with that would be RGB out.

[ccovell]

The Japanese reaction seems to be, "Wow!  Upergrafx!  Wow again!"
The English-speaking consensus appears to be "Terrible value for money."

That's just a cultural thing though.  Society requires them to say something positive, but in reality 90% of the commenters have no interest in one. 

Noted.  But actually, silence is the main indicator of disapproval in Japan, so people don't automatically have to make positive comments if they don't want to.

[esteban]

I was just messing around on twitter last night and I stumbled over this:

http://www.upergrafx.com/home_en

I didnt know if anyone had see this. Look very cool buy the price is crazy expensive.

I also had found this:

http://db-electronics.ca/product/dbgrafx-booster-ttp/

This looks really cool and it can be used on a T-16 or a PCE. You guys have any thoughts on these things? Worth picking up?

So, I am glad you posted this because I am finally looking into buying something like this (I can use it on my TG-16 and PCE white and PCE CoreGrafx II)... I actually like swapping out hardware and using different stuff throughout the year

Historically, I prefer all my hardware stock, because I like to compare/experience what these machines actually did back in 198_ ... but, I am curious to see if I have been wrong... MAYBE I WILL PREFER a better video signal?

(1) ...db electronics is working on a revised turbo booster (the one you linked to is out of stock...not sure if he will still make them)...

(2) BUT I also like the idea of a modded Tennonoke II... it's more fun for me (using an original peripheral)... isn't mckris in UK? I may buy one from him during the interim (who knows when db electronics will finish new batch).

TRIVIA: I was going to buy the never-came-to-be Turbokon & Co. TurboBooster (a third option, though defunct) from not too long ago (the kickstarter funding never materialized)...

Anyway... this will at least help me get a taste for better video signal on a PVM BVM DSM and see if I care enough to RGB mod consoles like DUO (for teh CD games).

I'm in TX.  I do have 1 tennokoe 2 left.  Need to mod it though. Just haven't gotten around to it.  If you are interested, let me know and i will put that next on my list.

Yes, I want it.

I sent a PM.

Texas! Ha! In my brain, I associate you with SCART cables, and I (erroneously!) assumed you were in the UK.

I am an idiot, because if I had known you were "local", I wouldn't have worried about shipping.

Thank you

[Trenton_net]

The device is pretty cool though.  But, like others have said, the price is too high.  Maybe they will lower the price if it doesn't sell well. 

Ya, they would need to reduce the price by a significant amount since their only customer base would be people who just want 'good enough' quality at 'impulse buy' prices. Considering it costs pretty much the same as a Framemister, there is virtually no reason to choose this over it. The reason being, the Framemister was designed specifically for quality upscaling, has a company dedicated to it's development and backing, and has already gone through multiple hardware versions/generations trying to perfect their product.

I'm not saying it's impossible, but it's very unlikely that some (relatively) random nobodies would come by and do a better job than a company who spent years designing and maintaining their 'killer-app' upscaler product.

[ccovell]

Also, as far as I understand it, the Upergrafx has a frame of lag (freezing or somesuch) once every 6-10 seconds due to analogue timing differences...

Or at least its maker admitted to this lag during the prototype stage.

[SuperDeadite]

The Japanese reaction seems to be, "Wow!  Upergrafx!  Wow again!"
The English-speaking consensus appears to be "Terrible value for money."

That's just a cultural thing though.  Society requires them to say something positive, but in reality 90% of the commenters have no interest in one. 

Noted.  But actually, silence is the main indicator of disapproval in Japan, so people don't automatically have to make positive comments if they don't want to.

Silence is more reserved for people that do something truly stupid, offensive, or rude.  Silence would be a bit too strong for a simple homebrew project like this.  For example, if your Japanese sucks, they will tell you your Japanese is great, because they want to encourage you to keep studying.  If your Japanese is actually really high-level, they will happily correct any mistake you make, since they know you can handle it.