Turbo Gouging on Ebay ( r.i.p. - gouging much )

[Bernie]

This keeps popping up, and I want it, but he needs to drop a zero.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160610802716&clk_rvr_id=244892844445

Seriously doubt he ever sells it like that.  Breaking it down, he would surely sell most of it.

[Sleepy Gnome]

This keeps popping up, and I want it, but he needs to drop a zero.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160610802716&clk_rvr_id=244892844445

That sure is some colleaction. I'd not buy it at that price even if I won 10,000,000 on the lottery.

[csgx1]

This keeps popping up, and I want it, but he needs to drop a zero.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=160610802716&clk_rvr_id=244892844445

Seriously doubt he ever sells it like that.  Breaking it down, he would surely sell most of it.

Yeah, that's a ridiculous amount to ask and the seller doesn't even provide decent pics of the the items.

[NecroPhile]

If he was really trying to peddle his goods, he'd comprehensively list what's available and post some pics.  But nope, it's just bullshit bragging from some twat living in mommy's basement (the use of comic sans proves it).

[IDCHAPPY]

I've seen that auction sooooooooooo many times, the guy must have mental problems if he's expecting a sale 

[csgx1]

This seller initially tries to sell Bonk 3 loose for $300 starting bid, open auction.

Now re-listed with a buy now for $600.  This seller somehow feels that it's worth double after not selling for $300......

http://cgi.ebay.com/Bonk-3-III-Hucard-TurboGrafx16-Duo-very-Rare-/180689565682?pt=Video_Games_Games&hash=item2a11eff7f2

[nat]

"Very rare!"

So rare there's only one copy up for sale per week!

[BlackandBlue]

This seller initially tries to sell Bonk 3 loose for $300 starting bid, open auction.

Now re-listed with a buy now for $600.  This seller somehow feels that it's worth double after not selling for $300......

http://cgi.ebay.com/Bonk-3-III-Hucard-TurboGrafx16-Duo-very-Rare-/180689565682?pt=Video_Games_Games&hash=item2a11eff7f2

I just saw this in my email.  It gave me a lolgasm.

[SignOfZeta]

I'm preparing my insults now for when we find out what stupid fuck buys it. This time I'm not even going to mention my complete PCE copy that I got for $35 because...that shit is getting really boring, as I'm sure you all agree.

Someone will buy it, btw. There is no ceiling on TG-16 now, that is my opinion. You can just put any old thing on eBay for whatever price and some stupid shit will buy it. If its going for 4x as much as everyone else's copy, everyone else will just raise their price to match his, and the "hard core TG-16 fan" who has only owned the system for 6 months will think that the game always goes for that much (because it has, in the six months that's he's been collecting) and buy it.

My hope is that this crap won't ever leak into the PCE seen. I assume it basically can't since there are so many times more copies of PCE games, and so many games in the first place, and not that many people willing to pay $160 for Bomberman 3, etc, but...I don't know. I never thought we would see the day when people would even bother to pay the insertion fee for a $600 copy of Bonk 3, let alone the asking price. And in a way its already happened, at least a little bit. If not for the US Magical Chase being so hella hyped, there is no way the JP version would be worth more than $40.

News Item: Neo Geo AES fans are no longer the most insane game collectors!

Seriously, while it still insane to pay $1000 for a specific region of a soccer game that you'll never play, that's still only about 5 times the original, very high, retail price, which isn't bad for something SNK only made a dozen copies of. There were thousands of copies of Bonk 3 made, and they were only $50.

[DragonmasterDan]

I just saw this in my email.  It gave me a lolgasm.

For another 300.00ish dollars there's a seller selling JUST the manual.

Anyway, it's going to sit up there for a long long time unsold at 600.00

[IDCHAPPY]

Wow, for just the card?? almost getting as crazy as the Neo scene 

[CrackTiger]

It's funny how people, both buyers and sellers, confuse the HuCard and CD versions of Bonk 3, but you don't see the PC Engine version of Dynastic Hero selling for much.

[SignOfZeta]

Wow, for just the card?? almost getting as crazy as the Neo scene 

I'm not sure there are any Neo games that sell for 12 times original MSRP loose. That would be, for a late period game, something like $4000. For one, loose games for AES are almost unheard of. Secondly, if there were something like this it would probably something they made literally 15 copies of. There have to be at least 2000 copies of Bomberman '93 US, probably triple that.

Also, it would be a friggn NEO GEO game which is always worth getting stupid about.

[BlueBMW]

I was just thinking about it... it seems like the Laseractive stuff I buy is quite pricey, but in reality the hardware and software were rediculously expensive when new.  $1000 for the unit, $400 - $600 for a pac, and $125 a game typically.

[csgx1]

I never thought we would see the day when people would even bother to pay the insertion fee for a $600 copy of Bonk 3, let alone the asking price.

I haven't sold anything on Ebay in awhile but I heard that Ebay recently changed the fees and now offers free/no insertion fees to list. 

Hence all the high priced buy now auctions that have been popping up and being constantly re-listed.  Basically giving gougers a reason to spam their high priced crap.

[SignOfZeta]

Ah, that's terrible.

[DragonmasterDan]

I haven't sold anything on Ebay in awhile but I heard that Ebay recently changed the fees and now offers free/no insertion fees to list. 

Hence all the high priced buy now auctions that have been popping up and being constantly re-listed.  Basically giving gougers a reason to spam their high priced crap. 

That stuff was going on for a while. About a year ago I was looking for a US copy of Cotton, the only one with manual to show up on ebay during that duration was a copy priced at 175.00 as a BIN. It sat there for at least 6 months. No one bought it and eventually the seller quit listing it.

[GameFreak]

I never thought we would see the day when people would even bother to pay the insertion fee for a $600 copy of Bonk 3, let alone the asking price.

I haven't sold anything on Ebay in awhile but I heard that Ebay recently changed the fees and now offers free/no insertion fees to list.  

Hence all the high priced buy now auctions that have been popping up and being constantly re-listed.  Basically giving gougers a reason to spam their high priced crap.

Yes if you thought things were bad, they will get a lot worse. Now that ebay doesn't charge any amount to do simple listings of items, theses crazy sellers have NOTHING to lose by listing at an even more outrageous price.

I hope ebay changes that policy back sometime to keep prices lower.

[BlueBMW]

In keeping with ebay's push towards more buy it now type listings rather than auctions, the low / zero insertion fees fits perfect.  High insertion fees encourage low starting prices / auctions.  High starting prices are typically buy it nows / best offers.

Unfortunately, it seems that Buy It Nows have killed what made ebay awesome originally... auctions.

[CGQuarterly]

Maybe over time this will hurt eBay enough that they'll change things.  I agree with Blue, auctions were what made eBay a great place to look for deals.  People can list stuff at pie-in-the-sky prices all they want, but they aren't going to sell.  I really wish that someone would step up and offer eBay come competition.

And I agree with Zeta.  I paid like $30 for my CIB PCE Bonk 3.  Why anyone would pay $600 for a loose version just because the label art looks different is beyond me.  The PCE version has better art, anyway.

Chris

[thesteve]

iu think i got my loose copy with a TG16 system complete and 9 other games on ebay for about $100

[BlueBMW]

Yeah I was going to say I dont exactly know what I paid for my US Bonk 3 huey with manual  It was in a lot I bought for $200 with a sealed OotG, Boxed Neutopia 2, JIC Air Zonk, JIC Neutopia, JIC Military Madness and something else.... so.....

[CGQuarterly]

Well that was definitely a nice deal.  I would like to build up my collection more by buying games in bulk, but I don't really see lots for sale outside of fleabay.  A sealed OotG is pretty cool.  Funny how that's just as hard to find as a sealed MC, and yet it's worth so much less.

Chris

[BlueBMW]

A sealed OotG is pretty cool.  Funny how that's just as hard to find as a sealed MC, and yet it's worth so much less.

Thus proving the rediculous nature of MC's price.

[CrackTiger]

A sealed OotG is pretty cool.  Funny how that's just as hard to find as a sealed MC, and yet it's worth so much less.

Thus proving the rediculous nature of MC's price.

Not only are both solid games, OotG doesn't have a cheaper PCE version.

[Dyna138]

A sealed OotG is pretty cool.  Funny how that's just as hard to find as a sealed MC, and yet it's worth so much less.

Thus proving the rediculous nature of MC's price.

Not only are both solid games, OotG doesn't have a cheaper PCE version.

I love OotG awesome, awesome game.

I also wondered the same thing about Beyond Shadowgate. As far as I know the US version is the only version that came out yet its typically worth much less than Dynastic Hero which you can get a JP version used for 20 bucks. I'd also say Beyond Shadowgate is just as rare or even more so than DH.

[Mathius]

A sealed OotG is pretty cool.  Funny how that's just as hard to find as a sealed MC, and yet it's worth so much less.

Thus proving the rediculous nature of MC's price.

Not only are both solid games, OotG doesn't have a cheaper PCE version.

I love OotG awesome, awesome game.

I also wondered the same thing about Beyond Shadowgate. As far as I know the US version is the only version that came out yet its typically worth much less than Dynastic Hero which you can get a JP version used for 20 bucks. I'd also say Beyond Shadowgate is just as rare or even more so than DH.

Yeah, I hardly ever see Beyond Shodowgate anywhere ever. MC on the other hand...

[hoobs88]

A sealed OotG is pretty cool.  Funny how that's just as hard to find as a sealed MC, and yet it's worth so much less.

Thus proving the rediculous nature of MC's price.

Not only are both solid games, OotG doesn't have a cheaper PCE version.

I love OotG awesome, awesome game.

I also wondered the same thing about Beyond Shadowgate. As far as I know the US version is the only version that came out yet its typically worth much less than Dynastic Hero which you can get a JP version used for 20 bucks. I'd also say Beyond Shadowgate is just as rare or even more so than DH.

You can also get Dynastic Hero for $5 or $6 on the Wii Virtual Console.

[CGQuarterly]

I think that a lot of people thought that the Virtual Console was going o drive down the cost of old games, but it seems to have had no effect whatsoever.

Chris

[VestCunt]

OK, no offense to anyone, but the comparison commonly tossed around here about MC being as common as OotG is total nonsense and I've heard a half dozen people repeat it.

OofG came out a lot earlier, around the same time as Air Zonk.  They were both part of the "new software lineup" advertised through Turbo Zone (NOT TZD) and Totally Turbo in 1992.  They're both copyrighted 1992.  The Turbo was still a semi-viable system that year - there were no clearance sales, and Toy's R Us had not yet begun trimming down their selection.

By 1993, Turbo games were much harder to find, making it safe to say that games like MC had nowhere near the distribution of earlier releases even if just as many were pressed.

Let's look at the slate of Turbochips scheduled in the 1993 Club Duo Catalog:

Jan - Darkwing Duck (makes sense, the copyright on the actual Turbochip is 1992)
Feb - Hero Tonma, World Sports Comp
March - Bomberman '93
July - Magical Chase
August - Bonk 3 (makes sense because this is the only game released with the updated box design)
Oct - Battle Load Runner (oops, what do you know, never released)

The accuracy of this list is supported by the Bonk 3 box design, the copyrights on the games, and the fact that BLR wasn't released.  So, I'm going to argue that MC was the second-to-last Turbochip ever released and is therefore pretty frickin' rare.

[Tatsujin]

And I agree with Zeta.  I paid like $30 for my CIB PCE Bonk 3.  Why anyone would pay $600 for a loose version just because the label art looks different is beyond me.  The PCE version has better art, anyway.

Chris

and it's the even better game as well.

[CGQuarterly]

OK, no offense to anyone, but the comparison commonly tossed around here about MC being as common as OotG is total nonsense and I've heard a half dozen people repeat it.

OofG came out a lot earlier, around the same time as Air Zonk.  They were both part of the "new software lineup" advertised through Turbo Zone (NOT TZD) and Totally Turbo in 1992.  They're both copyrighted 1992.  The Turbo was still a semi-viable system that year - there were no clearance sales, and Toy's R Us had not yet begun trimming down their selection.

By 1993, Turbo games were much harder to find, making it safe to say that games like MC had nowhere near the distribution of earlier releases even if just as many were pressed.

Let's look at the slate of Turbochips scheduled in the 1993 Club Duo Catalog:

Jan - Darkwing Duck (makes sense, the copyright on the actual Turbochip is 1992)
Feb - Hero Tonma, World Sports Comp
March - Bomberman '93
July - Magical Chase
August - Bonk 3 (makes sense because this is the only game released with the updated box design)
Oct - Battle Load Runner (oops, what do you know, never released)

The accuracy of this list is supported by the Bonk 3 box design, the copyrights on the games, and the fact that BLR wasn't released.  So, I'm going to argue that MC was the second-to-last Turbochip ever released and is therefore pretty frickin' rare.

If you had some release numbers from a respected source then your argument would be a lot more viable.  Just because MC was released late in the TG's life cycle (and yes, may have been the second to last game) doesn't automatically make it more rare than OotG.  Just because OotG came out at the same time as Air Zonk, that doesn't mean that they had similar release numbers.  In fact, they may have released a smaller number of copies of OotG because they assumed that it would not sell as well as something like Air Zonk.  Companies do try and tailor their release numbers so that they don't end up with lots of unsold stock.

I'm not saying that you are wrong (or right), but the frequency with which OotG shows up on the market speaks to it's rarity.  It does show up for sale more often than MC (in my opinion), but that's probably got something to do with the fact that fewer people want the game.  Unless someone is going for a complete collection or actually intends to play the game (which has less mass appeal and name recognition than marquee titles like Bonk, Zonk, BL, etc), they are probably going to throw it up for sale if they come into possession of it.

OotG may have been more widely distributed than MC due to the fact that the TG was still present in stores at the time of it's release, but that doesn't mean that more copies of it were produced.  That's all I'm saying.  At the end of the day, we don't (that I know of) have production numbers to look at.

Chris

[GameFreak]

Yes there is a big difference between "auction" and "buy it now". I personally think they should NOT be subject to the same Insert Fees.

But what do you guys think of the ebay option of "make offer" ????
IMO,...as I buyer, i have had great success with this option!
....and you? 

[BlueBMW]

Offers can work but most of the ebay gouge jobs wont accept an offer that's much less than their BIN price.

[Keith Courage]

http://cgi.ebay.com/Turbo-grafx-16-console-booster-5Mint-games-Guaranteed-/230642440998?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35b35c5b26#ht_1021wt_881

[GameFreak]

http://cgi.ebay.com/Turbo-grafx-16-console-booster-5Mint-games-Guaranteed-/230642440998?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35b35c5b26#ht_1021wt_881

Ok I can understand someone in Europe or U.S. wanting a PC-engine, but why on earth would anyone in japan want a U.S. turbografx-16? (that is where the item is located. why did it wind up there?)

[PunkCryborg]

http://cgi.ebay.com/Turbo-grafx-16-console-booster-5Mint-games-Guaranteed-/230642440998?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35b35c5b26#ht_1021wt_881

Ok I can understand someone in Europe or U.S. wanting a PC-engine, but why on earth would anyone in japan want a U.S. turbografx-16? (that is where the item is located. why did it wind up there?)

lol he's sending the shit back!

[BlueBMW]

http://cgi.ebay.com/Turbo-grafx-16-console-booster-5Mint-games-Guaranteed-/230642440998?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35b35c5b26#ht_1021wt_881

  Its in Japan?  Thats kind of strange....

[csgx1]

http://cgi.ebay.com/Turbo-grafx-16-console-booster-5Mint-games-Guaranteed-/230642440998?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item35b35c5b26#ht_1021wt_881

Ok I can understand someone in Europe or U.S. wanting a PC-engine, but why on earth would anyone in japan want a U.S. turbografx-16? (that is where the item is located. why did it wind up there?)

Maybe someone thought: "the grass is always greener on the other side".

[thrush]

Ok I can understand someone in Europe or U.S. wanting a PC-engine, but why on earth would anyone in japan want a U.S. turbografx-16? (that is where the item is located. why did it wind up there?)

The only "reasonable" scenario I can imagine is if you were really into vintage hardware and just wanted to own every variant... there certainly seems to be lots of folks like that in the Commodore/Amiga scene.  But in that case why part with it later?  Probably csgx1's "grass is greener" is more likely.

[Mathius]

That's something I haven't seen yet!

[RR1980]

The guy could be an expat kinda like Tokei had his tg16 with him when he living in Japan.

[nat]

OK, no offense to anyone, but the comparison commonly tossed around here about MC being as common as OotG is total nonsense and I've heard a half dozen people repeat it.

OofG came out a lot earlier, around the same time as Air Zonk.  They were both part of the "new software lineup" advertised through Turbo Zone (NOT TZD) and Totally Turbo in 1992.  They're both copyrighted 1992.  The Turbo was still a semi-viable system that year - there were no clearance sales, and Toy's R Us had not yet begun trimming down their selection.

By 1993, Turbo games were much harder to find, making it safe to say that games like MC had nowhere near the distribution of earlier releases even if just as many were pressed.

Let's look at the slate of Turbochips scheduled in the 1993 Club Duo Catalog:

Jan - Darkwing Duck (makes sense, the copyright on the actual Turbochip is 1992)
Feb - Hero Tonma, World Sports Comp
March - Bomberman '93
July - Magical Chase
August - Bonk 3 (makes sense because this is the only game released with the updated box design)
Oct - Battle Load Runner (oops, what do you know, never released)

The accuracy of this list is supported by the Bonk 3 box design, the copyrights on the games, and the fact that BLR wasn't released.  So, I'm going to argue that MC was the second-to-last Turbochip ever released and is therefore pretty frickin' rare.

The whole thing was started by a guy who used to work for Hudson, that stated Order of the Griffon and Magical Chase had the same release run. It was something like 3,000 copies, I don't remember exactly. That's solid enough "evidence" for me, and it seems to fit based on the number of copies of each I see on a regular basis.

Distribution may have mattered a lot back in 1993, but it doesn't mean jack shit in 2011. The games are all out there now, in circulation. Unless you're implying there are cases of unsold copies of Magical Chase laying around somewhere, which I highly doubt. Any unsold copies of the game would have ultimately made their way back to TTi, which, as we all know, turned into Turbo Zone Direct. You might have had an argument four years ago, when TZD (the REAL TZD) was still around, that perhaps Steve was sitting on a case or two of sealed MCs to be used as leverage when it came time to sell the business. Well, the sale actually happened as we all know, and there was no secret stash of unopened Magical Chases. Hell, I'm not sure he held on to even a single copy. We know they had one single sealed Dynastic Hero, and some other odds and ends that never made it to the official sale page but nothing in any quantity that would have any effect on a game's actual rarity.

Your argument actually makes little sense to me. The timeframe in which a game was released doesn't dictate a game's rarity; the number of copies pressed and released does.

[NecroPhile]

Unless you're implying there are cases of unsold copies of Magical Chase laying around somewhere, which I highly doubt.

Excepting the full palette sitting in my garage, right?  I call it my 'retirement fund'.

Hell, I'm not sure he held on to even a single copy.

Didn't Mr. Nanto get the last one for providing TZD with sexy pictures right before they sold out?

[VestCunt]

Thanks for the comment about the Hudson guy, I had forgotten the source for that.  While OotG and MC are both "sleepers" that probably had low print runs, it still seems odd that the penultimate Turbochip released during 1993 - the year of bargain bins and cancelled games - would have a run the size of a game released during the launch of the Turbo Duo, Air Zonk, and LoT...still, I'll buy it.  

I actually wrote a follow-up post to Jibbajaba the other day addressing the issue of distribution, but had to run out the door before finishing it.  Here's an updated version:
  
There are still a number of holes in the equal quantities theory.  Foremost being the report of bulldozed games and TZD trying to buy as many as they could to save:  https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=5384.msg93705#msg93705

Whether or not this source has any authority, it stands to reason that a bankrupt company's inventory had to be liquidated, debts paid, and the remainder disposed; a smooth transfer of TTI handing their entire stock over to TZD is very unlikely.  The liquidation/bulldoze story is also supported by the fact that Smartworks apparently took over hardware sales due to some kind of settlement (http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=142037&page=5) and I've read that Telegames added a lot to their stock of Turbo goods at this point (can't find the source right now).

When TZD and Telegames were choosing what to save from the landfill, they no doubt erred on the side of games like Bonk 3 and Soldier Blade and overlooked games without any U.S. name recognition like MC.

This would explain why TZD sold out of MC - a no-name game that was never advertised - almost instantly.  This would explain Steve's comment to Aaron about how there are probably only five sealed copies in existence (mentioned in Aaron's original MC/Bonk3 pictures post, now deleted).  This would explain why Aaron's copy from TZD (sold on ebay a few years ago) is the only sealed one anyone has ever seen.  

The issue of distribution is relevant because OotG had an extra one-to-two years to sit in Toys R Us before the day of reckoning came.  Off the top of my head, I know Blue has a sealed copy, I have one, I saw a third in Stillwater in 2006, and a couple others on ebay over the years.

[RoyVegas]

This would explain why Aaron’s copy from TZD (sold on ebay a few years ago) is the only sealed one anyone has ever seen. 

I'm aware of 3 total that are still sealed.

[hizaygizirlz]

Interesting stuff.  That guy on half.com also claims to have one that is sealed for 5K, I'm sure most people are aware of that one though. 

If it is true or not I have no idea.

[DragonmasterDan]

Thanks for the comment about the Hudson guy, I had forgotten the source for that.  While OotG and MC are both "sleepers" that probably had low print runs, it still seems odd that the penultimate Turbochip released during 1993 - the year of bargain bins and cancelled games - would have a run the size of a game released during the launch of the Turbo Duo, Air Zonk, and LoT...still, I'll buy it. 

I actually wrote a follow-up post to Jibbajaba the other day addressing the issue of distribution, but had to run out the door before finishing it.  Here's an updated version:
   
There are still a number of holes in the equal quantities theory.  Foremost being the report of bulldozed games and TZD trying to buy as many as they could to save:  https://www.pcengine-fx.com/forums/index.php?topic=5384.msg93705#msg93705

Whether or not this source has any authority, it stands to reason that a bankrupt company's inventory had to be liquidated, debts paid, and the remainder disposed; a smooth transfer of TTI handing their entire stock over to TZD is very unlikely.  The liquidation/bulldoze story is also supported by the fact that Smartworks apparently took over hardware sales due to some kind of settlement (http://www.digitpress.com/forum/showthread.php?t=142037&page=5) and I've read that Telegames added a lot to their stock of Turbo goods at this point (can't find the source right now).

When TZD and Telegames were choosing what to save from the landfill, they no doubt erred on the side of games like Bonk 3 and Soldier Blade and overlooked games without any U.S. name recognition like MC.

This would explain why TZD sold out of MC - a no-name game that was never advertised - almost instantly.  This would explain Steve's comment to Aaron about how there are probably only five sealed copies in existence (mentioned in Aaron's original MC/Bonk3 pictures post, now deleted).  This would explain why Aaron's copy from TZD (sold on ebay a few years ago) is the only sealed one anyone has ever seen.   

The issue of distribution is relevant because OotG had an extra one-to-two years to sit in Toys R Us before the day of reckoning came.  Off the top of my head, I know Blue has a sealed copy, I have one, I saw a third in Stillwater in 2006, and a couple others on ebay over the years.

That definitely seems like it's accurate. I really wish Steve from TZD checked this boards from time to time.

Whether or not there were just as many OOtGs produced as Magical Chase, clearly not as many survive to this day.

[nat]

Ah yes, I'd forgotten some of the unsold stock had been destroyed. That certainly cements a foundation for your argument, however, there's no way to be certain exactly what games got destroyed and what didn't. It's certainly logical to assume TZD opted for games like Bonk 3 and Soldier Blade over MC, but we don't really know this to be the case.

All that said, I still firmly believe the perceived rarity of MC is almost entirely hype. There are copies up for sale multiple times a month.

[VestCunt]

I think it's about as rare as official Turbochips get, but not as rare as people think.

Now what I can't figure out is why TZD sold out of MC in the first year, yet Legend of Hero Tonma and World Sports Competition stuck around for so long.